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the Origins of Love

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Dawn Moline
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« on: January 21, 2007, 01:59:05 am »

the Origins of Love[/b]

To start with, we used the the model of the Watchers seducing the Daughters of Cain in the Book of Enoch. The question I first posed was, why were the Watchers first drawn to mortal women, was it lust, as the texts would have us believe, or was it love, as I personally happen to believe?

It could not be simple lust.

An angel, knowing the grace of God, would not sacrifice that grace lightly, and surely a being that is All-Knowing would know that lust is simply a passing fancy. An Angel, not knowing the draw of love, would be seduced and might make such a sacrifice. I also hold that it was not mere beauty alone that led the Watchers astray. There are female angels as well as male, and surely a female angel could become a thing of beauty far more enticing than flesh could ever conceive. I believe it was some inner quality that drew the angels, an element they saw in their creator, an innate human quality. The Watchers fell in love with the daughters of Cain because they sensed, in them, the same human quality they saw in the creator. In other words, their love for the women was the same as their love for their God. Loving the women helped them become closer to God, just as when we love one another we, too, become closer to God.

Love could not conceive of the monsters (giants) such a union at first reproduce, love simply is, it knows no master but itself, and that it enough.

When did love first enter the world? Did Neandertal man have any love for his mate? While the Ice Age hunter/gatherers hunted the Woolly Mammoth, did they do so for love?

From what I can see, love can be said to have first entered the world in one of two ways:

Human beings, descended from the apes, and all our impulses, love included, are nature's trick to get us to reproduce, impulses present in any species.

Human beings, descended from the angels, and the ability to love is of God's gift to us, perhaps our one saving grace amidst a sea of troubles.

Knowing many of you as I do, I think I can imagine which of the two camps some of you might split into. Still, I would like to put a more personal touch on this. I invite everyone to share their opinions, theories, even experiences on the reality of love, no matter how plain or how intimate. I notice many of you aren't using your real names, so there is nothing to conceal, no secret to protect. The only thing that you are protecting is whatever standing you have may have built up in the forum, which, in the final analysis, means very little anyway. I want to judge no one, I wish to understand everyone.

As human beings, I believe it our responsibility to try and gain a greater appreciation of one another. In my opinion, that is the one thing we owe to our past generations, to our children who come after us. No greater understanding can be greater than the one we have of love.
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"The unexamined life is one not worth leading."
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Aristotle
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« Reply #1 on: February 03, 2007, 05:27:07 pm »

I actually once used to believe that love was simply an effect of nature's to get human beings to reproduce, and yet, I believe that falls more neatly into the category of "lust" instead.

The truth is, there are all kinds of levels of love that have nothing to do with the love that couples feel towards each other. 

Love of nature, for one, or love for a pet, a family member or a good friend.  Love of a good book or a work of cinema or music.

Each of these are a sort of love in themselves and proof that a "magic" irregardless of chemical biology exists.  And where that love comes from, that is certainly still a mystery.

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Volitzer
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« Reply #2 on: February 04, 2007, 07:05:08 am »

Love is the dedication and commitment thru all good times and bad.
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Volitzer
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« Reply #3 on: February 04, 2007, 07:06:39 pm »

Bad news for Courtney Love.  Sad

After a membership with eHarmony she ended up getting a refund because eHarmony found absolutly No matches for her.

Hmmmmmm  I wonder just how well she filled out the compatibility profile?   Huh

Somehow I just can't picture her sitting still long enough to fill out the personality profile.  Grin Grin Grin
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« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2007, 10:33:29 pm »

At this point, Courtney is so used and worn out from drugs, who would want her?

How is your love life going, Volitzer?
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╔╪╪╪╪╪╪╪╪╗
☼The Pagan ☼
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« Reply #5 on: February 06, 2007, 01:39:14 am »

"I've had the blues,
The reds and the pinks,
All I can say is Love Stinks,

Yah Yah Love STINKS!"

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"There exists an agent, which is natural and divine, material and spiritual, a universal plastic mediator, a common receptical of the fluid vibrations of motion and the images of forms, a fluid, and a force, which can be called the Imagination of Nature..."
Elphias Levi
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HUH?


« Reply #6 on: February 06, 2007, 06:08:13 am »

Dawn my friend, love and lust carry a fine line my dear.
Yet love endures, and lust is something that consumes like a fire and then fizzles out.

Love is to life long commitment as lust is to a candle in the wind.
You can go through all the very same thoughts and emotions, but the  morning after is when you know the truth of what it all really was.

I wish that I knew what other differences were. In truth; Even at 36, I still don't understand why lust is even more blinding at times then even love.
As a man, it is like a snake bite.
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Volitzer
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« Reply #7 on: February 06, 2007, 06:42:14 am »

At this point, Courtney is so used and worn out from drugs, who would want her?

How is your love life going, Volitzer?

Doing pretty good.  Going for the 30+ crowd has proven very successful.  She came to visit up here the 27th & 28th of February, it was quite magical.

Fianlly a woman who finds intellect a turn on.  I've only been waiting 24 years for her.

eHarmony may just very well turn the divorce rate in America around and down to 5% providing Americans are smart enough to allow it to work for them.  Yet somehow the users and gold-diggers will never be helped.
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Michelle Sandberg
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« Reply #8 on: February 07, 2007, 01:35:15 pm »

It's nice to see so many friendly faces here and that we got this topic started again.  I hope this is the place we can talk about our relationships, because I would still like to share mine.

When last I talked with everyone, I told everyone that Curt and I were engaged.  We're still engaged, but haven't set a date yet.  I suppose I am feeling a little anxious.

Anyway, there is this guy that started working at the library I work at that just started there a month ago.  He's tall and muscular, and very good looking, he was just my type so naturally I was attracted to him. His name was John.  My boss had me train him when he started, and on his first night, he asked me out for drinks. It was cold out, so I accepted. Anyway, we hit it off, I got a little tipsy, and, the next thing I knew, we wound up in bed together. The sex was intoxicating, and I don't mind saying, a little addictive, too.  He was hard and physical and very forceful, I felt wanted in a way I hadn't for months.  Much as I love Curt, once you have been with someone for as long as we have, there gets to be this sameness about it. He is also rarely around anymore. 

Anyway, once it was over, I knew I did wrong by cheating on Curt, and yet I couldn't help myself, I wanted more, I had to get more.  Curt is working two jobs right now, and we barely see each other.  When we do, he is too tired to do anything fun.  This is terrible, I know, but for the last month, after our shift is over, John and I walk over to his apartment, have sex together before he takes me home. I don't want to do it, but it is this animalistic instinct that  just can't control. He wants me, I like being wanted and how physical he is with me, and I am helpless to stop it from happening.

Oh, I know I am cheating on Curt and I also know that John doesn’t love me, he just wants my body, and yet, I can't control myself. My body aches to have sex with him and I let him do whatever he wants with me. 

John is not a nice person.  He doesn't buy me flowers or want to take me out, he just wants to have sex.  He knows he has me hooked and that I am helpess to resist.  The really odd thing is that now that it has gotten colder out, I want to have sex all the more, because the interaction of the flesh seems to keep me warm. I'm torn between crying because what I'm doing to Curt and being consumed by this insatiable need to keep the sex going.  I tell myself that I am just going through a phase and that I will return to wanting to be with someone who I know honestly respects and loves me, but for now, my sexuality has me under complete control.  I hope that no one thinks too poorly of me of confessing any of this. I'm glad that this is a private forum, so that only those of you I think of as my friends can listen to it. 

What do you do when you are in love with one man, but can't stop yourself from sleeping with another?

Michelle
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Aristotle
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« Reply #9 on: February 07, 2007, 08:46:48 pm »

Michelle,

If you don't mind my saying so, this lack of faithfulness is an indication of your inability to settle down and get married at this point in your life. Nothing wrong with that, most people sow some wild oats before they do decide to settle down.  You're young and you still have some living to do.

If you want my opinion, Curt probably senses this about you, which is why he hasn't set a date yet.  I don't blame him, for all I know, he feels the same about his life.  But if you still have the urge to see other people, clearly you're not ready to get married.

Frankly, if I were either of you, I wouldn't get married unless I were actually genuinely ready to commit to someone.  Just by my conversations with you, I don't think that you are.  Maybe each of you should do yourselves a favor and not even try.
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Volitzer
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« Reply #10 on: February 08, 2007, 08:48:49 am »

It's nice to see so many friendly faces here and that we got this topic started again.  I hope this is the place we can talk about our relationships, because I would still like to share mine.

When last I talked with everyone, I told everyone that Curt and I were engaged.  We're still engaged, but haven't set a date yet.  I suppose I am feeling a little anxious.

Anyway, there is this guy that started working at the library I work at that just started there a month ago.  He's tall and muscular, and very good looking, he was just my type so naturally I was attracted to him. His name was John.  My boss had me train him when he started, and on his first night, he asked me out for drinks. It was cold out, so I accepted. Anyway, we hit it off, I got a little tipsy, and, the next thing I knew, we wound up in bed together. The sex was intoxicating, and I don't mind saying, a little addictive, too.  He was hard and physical and very forceful, I felt wanted in a way I hadn't for months.  Much as I love Curt, once you have been with someone for as long as we have, there gets to be this sameness about it. He is also rarely around anymore. 

Anyway, once it was over, I knew I did wrong by cheating on Curt, and yet I couldn't help myself, I wanted more, I had to get more.  Curt is working two jobs right now, and we barely see each other.  When we do, he is too tired to do anything fun.  This is terrible, I know, but for the last month, after our shift is over, John and I walk over to his apartment, have sex together before he takes me home. I don't want to do it, but it is this animalistic instinct that  just can't control. He wants me, I like being wanted and how physical he is with me, and I am helpless to stop it from happening.

Oh, I know I am cheating on Curt and I also know that John doesn’t love me, he just wants my body, and yet, I can't control myself. My body aches to have sex with him and I let him do whatever he wants with me. 

John is not a nice person.  He doesn't buy me flowers or want to take me out, he just wants to have sex.  He knows he has me hooked and that I am helpess to resist.  The really odd thing is that now that it has gotten colder out, I want to have sex all the more, because the interaction of the flesh seems to keep me warm. I'm torn between crying because what I'm doing to Curt and being consumed by this insatiable need to keep the sex going.  I tell myself that I am just going through a phase and that I will return to wanting to be with someone who I know honestly respects and loves me, but for now, my sexuality has me under complete control.  I hope that no one thinks too poorly of me of confessing any of this. I'm glad that this is a private forum, so that only those of you I think of as my friends can listen to it. 

What do you do when you are in love with one man, but can't stop yourself from sleeping with another?

Michelle

If Curt aint putting forth any effort then maybe you should move on.  You should break it off with him first tho.  Since losing my virginity I can't wait to move south and be with my eHarmony sweetie.  She's the only woman I've ever known in which intellect is a turn on.  She even gave me a book and sex positions and things to work on.  I can't wait till next I see her.  I am going to put enough SEXATIVA in my system to set my hormonal clock back to my teens and then proceed to have sex with her.  That combines with what she gave me sex position wise as well... Kiss Kiss Kiss  Wink

Michelle... seriously, you might want to consider a man whom is both loyal and sexual.  You're only getting pieces at this point.  All you are going to do is keep acting on the oxytocin and vasopressin, the intimacy hormones,  John is going to keep exploiting that and then when John finds someone else he's really interested in and gets tired of you he's just going to drop you. Undecided

You may not be ready to settle down but at least respect yourself enough not to be used. Sad
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Bianca
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« Reply #11 on: February 08, 2007, 10:37:58 am »


St. Petersbug Times, Feb. 8, 2007


WORKERS FIND PREHISTORIC ROMEO AND JULIET LOCKED IN EMBRACE

An archaeologist says the find dates to a formative period of society.



Associated Press

ROME - They died young and, by the looks of it, in love.

Two 5,000-year-old skeletons found locked in an embrace near the city where Shakespeare set the star-crossed tale ROMEO AND JULIET have sparked theories
the remains of a far more ancient love story have been found.

Archaeologists unearthed the skeletons dating back to the late Neolithic period outside Mantua, 25 miles south of Verona, the city of Shakespeare's story of
doomed love. 

Buried between 5,000 and 6,000 years ago, the pair are believed to have been
a man and a woman and are thought to have died young, because their teeth
were found intact, said Elena Menotti, the archaeologist who led the dig.

"As far as we know, it's unique," Menotti said.  "Double burials from the Neoli-
thic are unheard of, and these are even hugging."

Archaeologists digging in the region have found some 30 burial sites, all single,
as well as the remains of prosperous villages filled with artifacts made of flint,
pottery and animal horns.

Although the Mantua pair strike an unusual and touching pose, archaeologists
have found other prehistoric burials in which the dead hold hands or have other
contact, said Luca Bondioli, an anthropologist at Rome's National Prehistoric and
Ethbnographic Museum.

Bondioli, who was not involved in the Mantua dig, said the find has "more of an
emotional than a scientific value.".  But it does highlight how the relationship people have with each other and with death has not changed much from the
period in which humanity first settled in villages, learning to farm the land and
tame animals, he said.

"The Neolithic is a very formative period for our society," he said.  "It was when
the roots of our religious sentiment were formed."

Menotti said the burial was "a ritual, but we have to find out what it means."

Experts might never determine the exact nature of pair's relationship, but Me-
notti said she had little doubt it was born of a deep sentiment.

The couple's burial site was located Monday during construction for a factory.  Experts will now study the artifacts and the skeletons to determine the burial site's age and how old the two were when they died.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

A picture is included and it would be greatly appreciated if someone would trans-
fer it here for me.  Thank you,

Love and Peace,
Bianca
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« Reply #12 on: February 08, 2007, 11:56:52 am »

Great story Bianca,

I searched for the story on line and could not find it.  Got a link?
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ILLIGITIMI NON CARBORUNDUM

Thus ye may find in thy mental and spiritual self, ye can make thyself just as happy or just as miserable as ye like. How miserable do ye want to be?......For you GROW to heaven, you don't GO to heaven. It is within thine own conscience that ye grow there.

Edgar Cayce
Bianca
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« Reply #13 on: February 08, 2007, 04:48:20 pm »



Yes, Rockessence, it's in the header.  It's my hometown's news-
paper, THE  ST. PETERSBURG TIMES - <sptimes.com>. Feb. 8/07.

There's a very poignant picture of the skeletons 'in situ'.

Love and Peace,
Bianca
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Bianca
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« Reply #14 on: February 08, 2007, 04:51:33 pm »



Rockessence:

If you find it, please post the picture. 
I don't know how.

Thanks,
Bianca
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