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the Emerald Tablet of Thoth (Original Version)

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Author Topic: the Emerald Tablet of Thoth (Original Version)  (Read 13204 times)
Veronica Poe
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« Reply #165 on: May 27, 2008, 10:17:18 pm »

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Rate Member   posted 02-01-2006 11:45 PM                   
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Looks like we have several takers on that bet, hack is one choice, I have a few other choice words for Hawass. Behold the said expert in the field of Egyptology, giving the o.k. with hastiness to remove a near 4,000 year old mummy with delicate inlaid beads on the chest. Having his cohorts excavate while he (Zawi) directed. I could not believe it, the beads survived nearly 4,000 years of history only to be dashed in the face of Zawi's lack of intelligence. While the mummy was being pulled, the beads fell everywhere and Hawass didn't say "wait stop!" No he just kept motioning for them to keep lifting meanwhile almost 4,000 irreplaceable years fell to the dirt in the bottom of the tomb. Sad because before he even gave the go ahead I said that they should cover those beads in order to better preserve them, and then it happened, and I am not the expert. Can you believe it, me a common man knowing more than proclaimed experts, I mean he (Hawass) was supposed to be the one knowing what he was doing not me. How nice would it be to have his job, to go around acting like you know what your doing without consequence and getting paid top dollars for it. I guess I should be getting paid for knowing more about Zawi's field than he does, really if Hawass is an expert does that not make you people Gods comparatively.

[ 02-01-2006, 11:50 PM: Message edited by: researcher ]
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« Reply #166 on: May 27, 2008, 10:17:59 pm »

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   posted 02-02-2006 01:03 AM                       
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Welcome researcher.....
And I agree, that guy should have just stuck to uncovering the dirt as instructed.

Psycho and Brig, you both made extremely interesting points. I have always beleived that there are two sphinxes on that sight and that they were lions. It then makes the stelas present interpretation invalid.

The upright block between the Sphinx's paws is a stela detailing the story of a man who dreamed that the Sphinx spoke to him and promised him the double crown if he would dig out the body of the Sphinx, which was buried in sand up to its neck at the time. According to the stela, he did this and shortly after his task was finished, he became pharaoh.

This story alone seems to effect the story about the age of the sphinx because according to the stela this guy was made pharoh.
Now what pharoh did this at what time?

Here is more on a second sphinx theory from yet other seemingly credible sources;
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Cafe/7808/page1.html
http://www.philae.nu/akhet/NetjeruA.html#Aker
http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Cafe/7808/secondsphinx-Complete.html
http://members.tripod.com/~arescott/pathways/Sphinx2.html

Please bear in mind that these links were produced from doing a search on two lions in Giza.
LOL

Again, you guys have been doing your homework.
Now the question is; If a second sphinx does exist, is it going to be where we find the Hall Of Records?

[ 02-02-2006, 01:04 AM: Message edited by: ParaNormalIAm ]

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« Reply #167 on: May 27, 2008, 10:18:34 pm »

ParaNormalIAm

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   posted 02-02-2006 01:12 AM                       
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One more quick one before my morning coffee.
Zawi Hawass is looking to cover-up what ever it is he is hiding.

Again what reason would he have to lie on national television, unless there is something more to the whole area?

How could he stop ground penetrating sonar from being used if a satellite was used?  Cool
I think that would be the ticket right there.
The problem with that is the US has probably done this already and is in on the cover-up.

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« Reply #168 on: May 27, 2008, 10:18:55 pm »

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   posted 02-02-2006 01:33 AM                       
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Why on earth would the US be in on a cover-up - to hide historical material - thats bound for the National Museum, anyway?!
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« Reply #169 on: May 27, 2008, 10:19:56 pm »

ParaNormalIAm

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   posted 02-02-2006 04:26 AM                       
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Well I beleive this because I don't think it is bound for the National Museum. You can't move the Hall Of Records or a pyramid for that matter....

Besides, like all other skeptics out there you are only looking at one side of the multi-sided picture were discussing.

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« Reply #170 on: May 27, 2008, 10:20:27 pm »

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   posted 02-02-2006 04:30 AM                       
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Psycho if you and Brig would, I have more on this very subject in the Giza Power section.

Granite has quartz and radios had quartz.

I think you guys might find some of this interesting...

[ 02-02-2006, 04:31 AM: Message edited by: ParaNormalIAm ]

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« Reply #171 on: May 27, 2008, 10:21:06 pm »

 
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  posted 02-02-2006 10:59 AM                       
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From my Inventory Stela thread:

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Between the front paws of the Sphinx is a granite stela which was erected in commemoration of a renovation campaign carried out by Pharaoh Thuthmosis IV (1401 BC - 1391 BC). It contains the single syllable 'Khaf', which the Egyptologists immediately claimed was proof that Khafre was the builder of the Sphinx. The Stela was dug up in 1817 and was already badly damaged. Even though the portion of the Stela containing 'Khaf' has now completely flaked away, there isn't any reason to doubt that the syllable 'Khaf' actually appeared on the stela at the time of it's excavation, as it appears to have been well documented. Not to leave something significant unsaid, the stela was inscribed with hieroglyphs which had to be translated to English. One extremely important fact that is impossible to ignore, unless of course you are an Egyptologists it would seem, is the fact that every inscription, and that means literally every inscription, found dated to the very beginning to the very end of the Pharaonic era represented the name of a Pharaoh in a cartouche. A cartouche is an oval-shaped object that framed the inscribed hieroglyphs which spelled out the name of the Pharaoh. Not one single exception has ever been found. Seems to be convenient that this would be the one exception, but just for a moment lets give the Egyptologists that exception. Thuthmosis IV lived 1,000 years later than Khafre, which is a very long time for knowledge to have been passed by word of mouth, as there have been no other inscriptions uncovered that would have bridged the gap of 1,000 years between the two Pharaohs. So even if the not very likely is true, and the Thuthmosis IV stela did refer to Khafre as the builder, how can we be sure that wasn't an assumption on Thuthmosis part? Again, even if we ignore the obvious and stipulate that it does refer to Khafre, it still fails to offer proof. Furthermore another stela known as the 'Inventory Stela', uncovered at Giza and believed to be contemporary to the era, states that the Pharaoh Khufu saw the Sphinx. Being that Khufu was the predecessor to Khafre, and Pharaohs were Pharaohs for life, it would make it impossible for Khafre to build it and Khufu to see it. Egyptologists view the 'Inventory Stela' as fiction, again simply dismissing anything that contradicts them.
One more interesting aspect of the Sphinx weighs in heavy on this debate. It is less obvious from the front, but quite apparent viewed in profile. Proportionately the head is way too small for the body. It would be easy to blame the enormity of the carving for this, but if the Pyramids were built, and this is key, and the Sphinx as we see it today, at the same time, the craftsmanship seems less than should be expected. If however the Sphinx was uncovered, and the Sphinx head was recarved during the fourth dynasty by Khafre into the head of a Pharaoh, complete with headdress, that would allow for a reason for Khafre's name to appear on the afore mentioned stela and for the Egyptologists to believe it is the face of Khafre. However, I can't leap that far; it doesn't look like the statue of Khafre in the Cairo Museum, and the 'Khaf' isn't in a cartouche as it must be.
Conclusion
It should be the Flying Egyptologists, the name of a Trapeze act at the circus, for all the leaps these scientists make. Where the Sphinx sits in relation to the Pyramids needs more than just the assumption that they are accurate in their assessments of when the Pyramids were built, it needs evidence that proves who built one built the other, more about when the monuments of the Giza Plateau were built in The Dating Game. The inscriptions on the Sphinx stela do not match other historical inscriptions without the cartouche, and proclaiming the 'Inventory Stela' to be fiction, because it punches a hole in their conclusions, is manipulating the evidence to support their truth, not collecting evidence to find the truth.
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« Reply #172 on: May 27, 2008, 10:22:16 pm »

 
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And, regarding the Second Sphinx:

THE SECOND SPHINX THEORY BY BASSAM EL SHAMMAA
After Cheops came Khephren (2020 BC.) and built the second pyramid on Giza Plateau which from one spot appears higher than the Cheops pyramid, but this is due to it being built over a higher plateau.
The causeway and tomb entrances were always protected by double sphinxes flanking the entrance. Consequently, there is a great chance that there was, or is, another sphinx parallel to the one which exists today, only in very poor condition due to air pollution and underground water erosion.


I here offer my humble theory that there is a second sphinx, located on the other side of the causeway.
I firmly believe its existence is conspicuous beyond the shadow of a doubt. I believe it lies buried under the sand, its suffocated and dilapidated remains not rivaling the state of preservation of the existing sphinx. Perhaps it was not buried throughout time as the existing one, which aided in its destruction. If we were to calculate its measurements, aided by newly excavated ruins, we should find it to be 66 feet high, 240 feet long, the mouth 7 feet 7 inches, the ears 4 feet 6 inches and the nose 5 feet 7 inches. Exactly the same typical measurements of the existing sphinx. The second sphinx is mind boggling in its simplicity and common sense.

I here offer you the research that aided in the discovery of this new theory:
In the Egyptian Museum there is a stela called the "Inventory Stela", which proves that Cheops saw the sphinx and it also mentions that lightening struck the tail of the nemes headdress of the sphinx and destroyed it. To the south the lightening also burnt a sycamore tree. The area between the sphinx and the tree is empty today (I believe this is where a second sphinx lays buried), it could have also been struck by the same lightening causing it great destruction.

The scene symbol of the word "Hill" or mound and/or pyramidal shaped construction is or . According to the ancient Egyptian cult which rose up from Heliopolis (a suburb in northern Cairo today), the god of creation commenced his deeds from this spot. The Priests of the chief temple of the sun wrote the basic text which all religious texts came to depend upon. Pyramid texts, sacred utterances and religious doctrines were al developed from the concept of creation. The complete one, "Atum" (the high god) rose up as a high hill like the solar disk. In utterance 600 it says, "O Atum, when you came into being you rose up as a high hill, you shown as the ben ben stone in the temple of the phoenix in Heliopolis." The primeval mound (the mound of the first time) took many forms and shapes, for example, and that is the shape of the so-called "Mastabah tomb" , also which is the shape of the step pyramid or any pyramid before it is outer cased with a smooth layer.

If we return to the Heliopolitan cut, the first two gods that Atum created were Shu and Tefnut. They were in the form of two lion cubs. Atum the sun enriched the scene with his light as before he rose up from the waters of the primordial ocean (called Nun) there was nothing, there was darkness. So yesterday was darkness. By creating the two lions, Atum became "one lion and two lions". He became identified with the protective force that the lion represents. Equally the two lions became associated with the sun the strong fierce burning power that it is. This makes sense from a practical point, as astronomy, the zodiac sign, "LEO" always dominates in the summer when Atum, the sun, is in his best form, able and burning. Also, it is the time of the flooding of the Nile and from here came the relationship between the lion and fertility. In one sentence when the lion appears in the sky (as Leo) the black land will be visited by the water of the flooding to fertilize the green land.(symbolically , it is the resurrection of the dry land. once the sun sets it begins its journey of the under world , the voyage from west to east. This is brought about by the two lions, the one on the west holds the sun between his jaws and passes it to the second lion situated in the east who pushes it to the sunrise. The rebirth of the sun needed essentially two lions to accomplish the mighty divine reappearance . They were called yesterday and today . Ancient Egyptian artisans and priests always drew and depicted them guarding the two primeval mounds connected with each other forming the sign of Aket which with the sun in the middle forms the hieroglyphic word for "horizon" . That is where the shrine of the GOD was situated . The sun between the two lions flanking the two hills are yesterday and today waiting to transport the sun with their jaws from the west to east . They were also responsible for guarding the eastern and western boundaries. .The sun is heading toward the edge of the world was the same sign in hieroglyphics which if repeated on the other side forms the Akh horizon scene . If we assemble all the previously mentioned information and correlate it with the historical topographical scene of the Giza Plateau, we will find a wonderful surprise . A surprise , who's positive fascination with the truth I hate being away from . If you stand today facing the sphinx there are behind it the three pyramids of ,(from right to left ), khufu (Cheops), KHA-F-RA (Chephren), Min-kaw-ra (Mycerinus) you will be able, with no difficulty to identify the following:

Two hills or pyramidal shaped constructions, similar in height and size and connected by a land valley. So it must be the two pyramids of khufu and kha-f-ra , as the height of khufu is 146 meters while kha-f-ra is 143,5 meters high, almost identical in height . If we measure the side of these two pyramids we find Khufu to be 230 meters and Kha-f-ra is 214.5 meters. Bearing in mind the weathering and erosion, these two pyramids could easily, from a distance be alike in everything including size . Respecting the fact that you cannot appreciate the similarity and resemblance unless from a distance. The perfect spot for this is facing the existing sphinx.


A bird s eye view of the second pyramid complex will confirm that the causeway coming from the mortuary temple to the valley temple had to diverge its path to the south to avoid the already existing sphinx. The causeway ends in the valley temple, opening into its north side, not into its middle, as usual. The workers were trying to avoid another sacred untouchable statue on the south side, which is the vanished sphinx. If we consider the sphinx temple and the valley temple. We can deduct that both temples are similar in design, height, square weathering, erosion and time destruction. This suggests that it was one temple dedicated to the belief of the Horizon, the shrine of the God. When the vestibule came, it divided it into two equal temples, each one dedicated to one lion of Ruti, which is according to Ani's papyrus, meaning yesterday and today. Bear in mind that the pink granite which walled up some parts of the valley temple took place later in time, decades after the temple construction. This fact is proven beyond a shadow of a doubt when you notice how the granite is embedded in the cavities caused by time and weathering. So, if there are two mounds, two temples denoting the two boundary edges of the world on the east and west and two shrines of the god (sphinx temple) and one temple is protested by a recumbent lion sphinx, why then is the second shrine of the god (valley temple) not protected and guarded by having a sphinx behind it? Why ? Remember Atum, the sun appears between the two pyramids on a certain day with a certain angle. The "Aker" scene depends, in addition to its religious connotation, on its artistic harmony and a very symmetrical nature. If you draw a line in the middle, it works like a mirror reflection. "Aker" is often depicted as two lions bodies with human heads (similar to the head of the sphinx) opposite each other or with lion heads which is what I think the sphinx was before it was re-carved into the head of a pharaoh. This would explain why the human head of the sphinx is small in comparison to the body of the lion. Ancient Egyptians never would fall into such a native mistake of ratio and proportion. I believe it was harmonically correct with the body size originally and later carved into the head of a human (the pharaoh).


Religious texts say, "Hail, Atum I am the double lion." , Also "The accustomed offering cake is still yours, O Atum and double lion! You two that have created your own divine selves and powers! This is Shu and Tefnut, the pair who engendered the gods and put them in their proper places". The double lion is a manifestation of Shu and Tefnut. There are, I believe, two sphinxes of Giza, one on each side of the causeway.


The ancient Egyptians never protected one entrance, or any sacred temple or tomb, from one side only. That would be against:
The common sense of the idea of protection.
The double lion theory of RUTI
One side of the shrine of Atum would be exposed to danger.
The two lions who are symbolic of yesterday and today protecting the pyramid.
If only one exists that means that the time is not complete. If there is only today and there is no yesterday the cult is incomplete. How would he explain the emergence of Atum from the primeval ocean of Nun in the time of yesterday? Yesterday was dark and when Atum came he brought light, if there was no darkness (one lion only) then how can light be appreciated, also, how would we appreciate Atum himself in the cult if he came with no positive impressive entry. Simply, if there was no yesterday then today is like any day, not highly special. Moreover, the two lions in the collection of the "spells of coming forth by day," Reu Nu pert em-hru" which was wrongly interpreted by Richard Lepsius in 1842, when he published the Turin Papyrus and gave it the name "The Book Of The Dead", are symbolic of Osiris and Ra and sometimes Atum. The absence of one of them spells chaos, crisis and a great disorder. "Mine is yesterday, I know tomorrow".


If the sun critically needs two lions to take it from the west to east, and as our present day sphinx sits exactly in the border line between the desert (no life) and vegetation (life), then how will the journey of the eternal rebirth of the sun be completed and unmistakably accomplished if there is only one lion? who will take care of its transportation from the west to the aim?. Reaching the target of the resurrection of the sun is impossible, unless there are two lions.


The two sides, profile lions flanking the "Aket" horizon are the two sphinxes behind the sphinx temple symbolizing the western boundary and the valley temple symbolizing the eastern boundary, where the sun will be resurrected just as the land turns green in the valley due to the rich Nile flooding. The ancient Egyptian artists believed in the profile and seldom used the full face. So, if we full face the two lions of the scene, illustrating the theory, you will see exactly two lions flanking the causeway dividing the one temple into two for the cut purposes. In the background two pyramids, Kha-f-re's pyramid base is carved from the bed rock to give us the scene of the primeval mound then the solar disk comes between to complete the immaculate the scene of the "Reu No pert emhru", "Spells of the coming forth by day" which was we know depends on the coffin texts which in turn came originally from the pyramid texts. If you notice in ancient Egyptian art, it always depends on the harmony between the ratio and the proportion of the scene. The forms must be symmetrical. The final result which is produced after a great effort and combining forces of the priests to select a special text, the artist in development of the accompanying scene to fit it must be harmonious. In the case of repetition it means multiplicity. For example, if there is Isis as a falcon on one side of the scene, parallel to it, equal in size and perfectly similar but for the head crown which distinguishes between one deity and the other, is the second Isis. In sculpture, always a double dogma dominated the religious construction. The double avenue of ram headed sphinxes of Ramses II in Karnak or that of the human headed sphinxes of Necta Nebo in Luxor temple. Two seated statues flank the entrances of temple. One side is always equal to the other. Thus, far no excavation has shown us otherwise.
In conclusion, the existence of a second sphinx on the other side of the causeway is conspicuous beyound the shadow of a doubt. Finally, without question, the remains of the second sphinx are still there buried under the sand, its suffocating dilapidated remains may not rival the state of preservation of the existing one, but I believe it does exist.


Sculpture reached its apex during Khephren's reign, when the best example of an idealistic royal statue came to light. Khephren's statue is composed of black diorite (hieroglyphic: meant coming from the quarries of Tushqa) veined with white and it was found in the temple if his pyramid . The clear-cut features, and square shoulders are complemented by the eyes gazing into eternity. The statue is wearing the Nemes,the royal headdress, and shendid, the royal apron and the royal false beared. There are two lions flanking the king's legs. On both sides of the throne there are representations of the union of Upper and lower Egypt, the binding of the lotus and Papyrus (this was called Sematawy).


The cartouch of khephren is clear Ka-f-Ra. The neck of the statue is reinforced with a statue of Horus, the Falcon God, also completing the holy triad, the throne, the pharaoh and the God. This triad enabled us to learn about Egyptian Mythology. In the Heliopolis cult there were nine Gods and Goddesses. They were Atum, creator of the universe, Shu the god of air, Tefnut geb the earth god, Nut the sky goddess, Osiris, Isis, Set and Nyphtyes.. They imagined that in the beginning the universe was filed with a primordial ocean called Nun, which had no surface, its waters were motionless and stagnant. The priests claimed that their temple stood on the site of this primeval ocean over a hill rising out of Nun. The golden age for this Universe was when the gods actually lived on earth and had their kingdom there, where justice reigned over the land and was now maintained by their successor and pharaoh.


In addition to all the proofs I offered in my second Sphinx theory, I add , here the stela of the dream erected between the two paws of the lion part of the existing Sphinx. At the top register we found Tutmosis IV is depicted twice offering to two Sphinxes. This is not one scene repeated in a mirror reflecting impression like other various scenery. The reasons why I believe that Pharaoh here is offering to two sphinxes are:

He is wearing different crowns one is the "Kheprish" blue crown of war and courage, in the other scene he is wearing the "Nemes" royal headdress. So, he is in two different social status assured by 2 different royal regalia.
He is offering two different sets of libations and homage in each scene. Tutmosis IV is treating each Sphinx separately and not in the same manner.

We conclude that the Egyptian history is still offering us more challenges. Egypt is the future of the past.


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« Reply #173 on: May 27, 2008, 10:23:19 pm »

 
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  posted 02-02-2006 11:03 AM                       
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One last one:

PYRAMID REPAIRS BY RALPH ELLIS
There has been much debate of late as to the true age of the pyramids. Perhaps we have all heard about the discussions and arguments that have erupted in books and on the internet regarding the era in which the Sphinx at Giza was constructed. John Anthony West and Robert Schoch have made a veritable industry out of speculation regarding the amount of weathering that is present on the Sphinx itself and its enclosure, and how the era of its construction can be gauged by this observation. It is an interesting discussion and one that apparently has much life left in it - I am sure it will run and run. But erosion of the Sphinx is only one small aspect of the evidence available when assessing the age of the pyramids, there are plenty of other examples of erosion that also point towards an earlier date for the pyramid's construction. Personally, I think that many of the early dynastic monuments in Egypt have a tale to tell in the weathering patterns that scour their fabric, and in the book "Thoth, Architect of the Universe" I try to explore many of these telltale features. So let us indulge ourselves in a quick tour of Lower Egypt and see what evidence is there to support the concept of a very early construction date for the pyramids.

The first example of pyramid erosion that I want to look at lies a little south of the Dahshur pyramids - at Meidum. The pyramid at Meidum is the one that looks as though it has collapsed and the prime clue to the true age of this pyramid can be derived from those very upper pyramidal cladding stones that are now missing from this pyramid - what exactly happened to them? Various authors have argued that these upper cladding stones, the remaining lower portions of which are still apparent under the piles of rubble around the pyramid, have either been stolen in subsequent eras or they have collapsed in a kind of pyramidal avalanche. But perhaps this was not actually the case. From a later excavation of the rubble surrounding the pyramid in the early 1990s, it was quite apparent that the pyramid had simply been eroded away by the weather, like so many of the less well-made pyramids in the area. Unfortunately for the builders, while the central core of the pyramid was made of a fairly durable limestone, the attempt to turn the edifice into a true pyramid used a very weak and friable stone. This stone has proved about as durable as mud-brick and although initially quite solid looking, the blocks that have been exposed to the elements are extremely fragile.

The fact that the pyramid has eroded and not collapsed, can be clearly seen in the rubble around the pyramid, which consists of layer upon layer of small stones. These stones form the type of strata that are always associated with eroded and deposited materials. It can also be seen that, where the rubble has protected the base of the pyramid, the cladding stones there survive intact. But higher courses, which were exposed to the elements for a longer period, have been successively eroded more and more, until at about six meters up there is complete erosion.

Clearly this is due to exposure to the elements with the stones at the lowest levels, which were first covered with rubble descending from above, being preserved the most. Yet one still wonders how long it takes to erode a complete pyramid, even if the stone was a little friable, for in places some ten meters of stone have eroded away at Meidum. The current shape of the pyramid, results from the fact that the upper flat section at the top of the rubble marks the start of another step of harder limestone just under the surface; the present layout is therefore quite stable and may not have changed for some considerable time. Is is possible, however, that so much of a solid stone construction was eroded in just under 5,000 years? Personally, I think not, and the supporting evidence I was looking for became apparent while strolling around the Giza pyramids.

I was trying to explain some of the technical details of the pyramids to my wife and it is one of those facts of life that one never really knows a subject until it has been successfully explained to a novice. The novice does not always understand the first time and so the topic has to be explained again from another perspective. Then, just when you think that there is no more to say on the subject, the novice hits you with a question that you were neither expecting nor can easily explain. The thick limestone paving slabs upon which the pyramids were constructed comes right into that category. My wife asked, "Why is there a line running down this pavement?"

The initial answer to this was easy for, when fully finished, the casing blocks of each of the pyramids invariably stopped short of the pavement edge, such that one particular pavement slab was partly covered by the casing and also partly exposed to the elements. The exposed portion of this slab was therefore beginning to erode over the years, slowly but surely, more and more as the years went by, as exposure to weather and the feet of millions of pilgrims took its toll. But the stone masons were normally wise in their choice of stone and the amount of weathering is minimal in comparison to what we find at Meidum. As we can see from the remaining cladding stones that still cover the Bent Pyramid and the upper portions of the Khafre Pyramid, in the sub-desert climate, good quality stone usually weathers quite slowly.


Then, after many millennia, someone came along and started pilfering the cladding stones from the pyramids, something that is usually ascribed to the eighth or ninth century AD. From this time onwards, the whole of the paving slab was now exposed to the elements and started to weather, hence a line was formed in the paving stones between the two periods of weathering. But there was a curious anomaly here that made me sit and think for a while. When looking at both the Dahshur and the Giza pyramids, there would appear to be a large differential between the pavement that has been covered for a while and the portion that has always been exposed. This is true within one single slab of stone, this is not a case of dissimilar stone strengths. Then there was a little pause in the discussion, for it was obvious now that this little line in the pavement could now be used to date the pyramids, but what would it tell us?

With ruler in hand, I tried to estimate the extent of the erosion, using the base of the remaining facing blocks as a guide to the original surface of the pavement. It was not the most precise of experiments, given the tools at my disposal, but luckily the amount of erosion was easily visible. At Dahshur the amount of erosion on the covered half of the slab was approximately five millimetres, the sort of erosion one might expect in such a climate over 1,000 years of weathering, yet on the exposed portion of the stone there was about 50 mm of erosion. At Giza the differential was even greater. The amount of erosion on the covered portion of the stone was again about five millimetres, and the exposed had between 50 mm and a massive 200 mm of erosion.

In general, it would appear that there was a minimum of ten times as much erosion on the exposed section of each block as on the portion that had been covered with the cladding stones, and this would give us a direct indication of the true age of these pyramids. If a constant erosion rate is presumed and if the time elapsed since the cladding was stolen is about 1,000 years, then the time required for the erosion of the exposed sections of each slab would equate to about 10,000 years and quite possibly much much longer.

Remember that this is true within a single slab of stone, it is not a case of dissimilar stone strengths. Indeed, some of the softer slabs in the pavement have been eroded more than usual on both the covered and the exposed sections, and this weathering is in direct proportion on both sides of the divide. This would seem to indicate that this erosion process is a valid tool for dating the pyramids, for each stone tells the same history, no matter how hard or soft it is. While a 10,000-year history for the pyramids agrees quite well with John West's Sphinx argument, it conflicts strongly once more with the traditional history of the region. Nevertheless, this era is in agreement with some more interesting and quite persuasive evidence that lies a little south of Giza - it has been carved into the fabric of the Dahshur pyramids.

Passing through the small military area and onto the Dahshur plateau, the vast bulk of the Red pyramid (Draco pyramid in the book "Thoth") lies before you. The casing blocks have, of course, been removed and what is visible are the rough-hewn sandstone core blocks. The sandstone is relatively friable, but its high iron-stone content seems to form a tough oxidised ruddy layer on the surface of the blocks, hence the usual appellation for this pyramid.

That most of the pyramids are in this parlous state is a great shame, we would know so much more of the era and methods for their construction if they were still in pristine condition. But there is a pyramid that can give us some clues here, take a look around the corner of the Draco pyramid and the curious form of the Bent pyramid looms into view (Vega pyramid in "Thoth", each being named after the stellar location they represent). Firstly, it is my contention that the Vega pyramid was not hastily finished off, it was deliberately made in this fashion with a bent upper portion. For if you extend the line of the upper outer casing down to the ground, the shape, size and volume so created is exactly the same as its northern partner, the Draco pyramid. This shape is also directly formed from the Pythagorean 20-21-29 triangle, with cubit measurements of 200, 210 and 290 forming the sides of the pyramid - a sure indication that the designer knew what he/she was doing.

More importantly, though, the Vega pyramid retains much of its outer casing, which forms an impressively smooth, straight surface all the way to the top of the construction. Approaching the base of the pyramid, the fine workmanship of the massive casing blocks is easy to see. Other items are not so obvious - the core of this pyramid, despite being right next to the Draco pyramid, is made from a different material; rough limestone instead of sandstone blocks, with a mud mortar in between form the basic shape. For the casing blocks, however, the mortar is replaced by a fine pink mastic, apparently so strong that many of the casing blocks have split into two before the mortar itself gave way.

But this is not all, the basis of this new evidence for the age of the pyramids is another curious feature - the surface of the stones. At some time in the long history of these pyramids, a long forgotten pharaoh looked at the Vega pyramid and said to his chief of public works "We must do something about the condition of this pyramid!" The chief acted immediately on these orders and started erecting scaffolding all over the four faces of the pyramid. This was no mean feat, for wood is not a readily available commodity in Egypt and convoy after convoy of Lebanese cedar had to be brought in to provide the working materials. Slowly but surely a great lattice work of poles covered the entire face of the pyramid - right to its very apex.

A team of several thousand artisans, some skilled, some not quite so, started chipping away at the casing blocks. Stone is not a uniform material, of course, and small fault-lines, cracks, and shoals (sand inclusions) within the limestone blocks each weather at a different rate. Over the years the Vega pyramid had become pockmarked with thousands of small patches of erosion in the casing blocks. Some were minuscule, only a few centimetres across, some required the removal of the face of an entire stone (not the entire stone as the casing blocks are some 2m thick, only the outer face was taken away and replaced). Each and every defect was chipped smooth and a new piece of limestone was neatly placed in the hole and smoothed down to a perfect surface. The pyramid then began to look like it had acne, with the fresh white of the repair blocks contrasting strongly with the older surface. So the entire face of the pyramid was scrubbed clean of the sandy coloured patina that had developed over the years, to display the brilliant white Tura limestone casing as it was in its new condition. Pharaoh looked at his achievement with pride - the pyramids were as new again, sparkling in the ruby glow of a bloated setting sun. He truly must be one of the greatest of pharaohs to have achieved such a feat and the gods must have been pleased. As a record of his great achievement the pharaoh dared the almost sacrilegious, he carved his cartouche in the lower casing blocks to the pyramid and within the mortuary temple.

The description above is of my own invention, but the fact that something very like this has occurred in the distant past is self-evident by the thousands and thousands of little repairs that have been made all over the Vega pyramid, from the bottom to the very top. The question is, though, who made them? The records not only fail to mention the actual construction of these pyramids, they also fail to mention the repairs that were made to them. It has to be pointed out that the repairs are not due to manufacturing errors, as the face of the pyramid that was protected by the adjacent mortuary temple has no repairs on its surface. Clearly the repairs were made to a surface that had been eroded over many millennia, but when was this done?

Personally I think that if such a feat were achieved in the relatively well documented New-Kingdom era onwards (c 1500 BC), we would have heard about it. There are records that document the repairs made to the Sphinx by Tuthmoses IV during the New Kingdom era, yet the surface repairs to the Dahshur pyramids was a far greater undertaking than this. This tends to indicate that the repair-work was actually completed in the ancient past - earlier than the New Kingdom. Remember that the present condition of the pyramids is due to their deliberate destruction in relatively recent history, had this not taken place the major pyramids at Giza and Dahshur would have been in good condition to this day. So if these pyramids have lasted so well in the 3500 years since the New Kingdom and not needed much in the way of repairs, as the evidence from the Vega and Khafre pyramids indicates - why did these pyramids need repairing so quickly after their supposed construction by Snorferu in the 4th dynasty (c 2600 BC).

There is a deep conundrum here that is presented by something as mundane as an inserted repair block, just when was this major feat of repair work carried out? As the Vega pyramid appears to have lasted for the last 3500 years without any repairs, my solution is simple, if rather unorthodox - the Vega (Bent) pyramid must be much greater than 3,500 years old. In fact the evidence from the current state of the Vega pyramid points towards it requiring another surface repair in the not too distant future, which would tend to suggest that the surface can survive for just over double this time-period. Thus if the repairs we see today were carried out some 3,500 years ago, then the pyramid would have been constructed some 7,000 years ago.

As has been speculated in many previous works, including my own book "Thoth, Architect of the Universe", this simple observation seems to indicate once more that these high quality pyramids (those at Dahshur and Giza) were actually built in the distant past. To refine this date further, though, all we require is the date of the repair work. Can such a date be found in the records?

Egyptology has attributed the Dahshur pyramids of Vega and Draco to the pharaoh Snorferu and they indicate that he built both of these plus the pyramid at Meidum, all in the space of some 25 years. But not only does this seem illogical and physically impossible, the pyramids themselves have no inscriptions within them to confirm this proposal - just a few cartouches on the outer casing and in the mortuary temple. A much simpler solution, that will help considerably with the dating process above, is that Snorferu is intimately associated with these three pyramids not because he built them all, but because he REPAIRED them all. If one is prepared to accept this, then these pyramids have apparently lasted some 4,600 years without further repairs to their fabric and therefore the actual construction era for these particular pyramids must have been many thousands of years BEFORE the reign of Snorferu.

Such a scenario may be based on an amount of guesswork, but it does make a great deal of sense and the underlying evidence is irrefutable. Taken together with the data from Meidum, Giza and at the Sphinx - does this not all tend to reinforce the evidence that is emerging that these pyramids are indeed much older than we have traditionally been taught? The weight of evidence appears to be mounting relentlessly, the pyramids would seem to be as much as double or treble the orthodox age. Double the orthodox dating represents 9,000 years ago, and treble would indicate a massive 13,500 years, it is no wonder the orthodoxy would resist such an interpretation of the facts.

Ralph Ellis

Visit EDFU - Ralph's Website

Copyright 1998, 1999 R. Ellis has asserted his rights, in accordance with the Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988 to be identified as the author of this work.


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« Reply #174 on: May 27, 2008, 10:24:02 pm »

 
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  posted 02-02-2006 11:06 AM                       
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Anyway, Para, we have proof that Zawi is incompetent!   Sad

We have proof that Zawi likes to get that much of his on the TV cameras!   Sad

What we need is proof that Zawi is hiding/destroying evidence. The accusation made often, I have yet to see any real evidence to say that he is.

Has anybody..?
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« Reply #175 on: May 27, 2008, 10:24:42 pm »

ParaNormalIAm

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   posted 02-02-2006 02:59 PM                       
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Psycho- We are familar with Edger Cayce saying that the Hall Of Records is buried beneith the right paw of the sphinx.

The picture Im getting about this is, which sphinx was he reffering too?
(Grins evily and laughs with sardonic wrath)

All it would take to destroy this guy's credibility is wittness this singal paw being excavated from the other side of the pyramid by accident/ on purpose.   Wink

This would then be the cats meow.

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« Reply #176 on: May 27, 2008, 10:25:25 pm »

 
Pahana
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   posted 02-02-2006 06:38 PM                       
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The info that came from the Tablets themselves and is available online to read, convinves me it was not plagerized, or made up 100 years ago
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« Reply #177 on: May 29, 2008, 12:29:34 am »

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   posted 02-02-2006 06:39 PM                       
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Here is something that I found while doing a search on Zawi was suspended:
From: EGYPTNEWS@aol.com
Date: Wed, 21 Oct 1998 19:09:28 EDT
Subject: Hall of Records - by Maureen Palmer Status: U

If the search for the Hall of Records on the Giza Plateau comes up with a blank, then perhaps those involved with the search might consider my theory as a second option.

To the Ancient Egyptians animals, birds, trees, mountains and objects as well as people were filled with spirit. This I belief also included Land-forms and Life-form images (simulacra) created by both wind and rain in natural rock formations. Hidden deep within the Theban Necropolis are the tombs of the Pharaohs located in the ‘Valley of the Kings’. Overlooking the Valley is a carboniferous limestone mountain that has the naturally formed shape of a pyramid. To form this mountain pyramid carboniferous limestone was laid down over 300 million years ago in the seabed when shell and bone deposits accumulated and compacted together over time.

To the ancient Egyptians it would have been perfectly clear by the number of fossilised seashells that the whole of the mountain had once been underwater., According to ancient Theban creation myths the gods came into being when the mound of creation rose up out of the abyss of the Nun, the primordial ocean. ‘Re’ the sun god was the first-born of the gods who first manifested himself in the form of a stone object called Ben-Ben. The peak of this mountain was venerated as the goddess Mertseger whose name signified "She who loves silence". Looking upwards at Mertseger from the valley floor the peak forms an image of a woman’s breast facing towards the sky. This is an extract from a collection of religious and magical texts known to the ancient Egyptians as ‘The Chapters of Coming-forth by Day’. ["Neither the heavens nor the earth can be taken away from him, for behold, he is Re, the firstborn of the gods. His mother shall nurse him, and shall give him her breast on the horizon".]

This I belief was the first reason that the ancient Egyptian Pharaohs selected this place to site their tombs because they thought that this was where Re would return at the end of each day? back to his mother’s breast upon the horizon, back to his birthplace, the primordial mound that rose up from the abyss of the Nun. The second reason was because West is where the sun sets at the end of each day, it was here that the Pharaohs would be ready to rendezvous with Re upon his solar boat, which they knew would emerge safely the following day on the horizon in the East.

Re would be born again as a new day and their Ka would have come –forth into the afterlife, by day. If you stand at the top of this mountain and look East, three mountain peaks stand clear on the Eastern horizon. This land-form symbol was used to signify East in the ancient Egyptian hieroglyphs. It was also used in the hieroglyph for underworld which is Ament-et. But the final and main reason for locating their tombs here is because it is here hidden within the natural rock formations that there are ‘life form images’ of their gods’. I know because I have seen them and photographed them.

Lord of the Gods.

In the shadow of the primordial mound Queen Hatshepsut’s mortuary temple stands in the centre of Deir el-Bahri bay. It was built to the command of a remarkable eighteenth Dynasty queen who had ruled Egypt as Pharaoh in her own right. This unique temple is built right up to the cliff face that towers above. To say this beautiful limestone bay is breathtaking is an understatement, it has such a natural beauty that is difficult to describe in words, you have to see it to fully appreciate it.

Within Hatshepsut’s temple are scenes of her ‘Immaculate Conception’ which she invented between her mother and the god Amun. In ancient times this site was called Djeser which means the (Holy), when Queen Hatshepsut built her temple here she named it Djeser -Djesru, the (Holy of Holies) and dedicated her temple to the god Amun. The empty tomb of Senenmut Hatshepsut’s lover; life- time companion and overseer of the building of her temple is also to be found at this site. A few yards to the North of the lower court of Hatshepsut’s Temple a great tomb was discovered in which 163 coffins of priests and priestesses of Amun were found. It was during the reign of Hatshepsut that the ‘festival of the valley’ took place, at new moon in summer. The festival described by Archaeologist Joyce Tyldesley in her book ‘Hatchepsut The Female Pharaoh’, involved taking the cult statue of Amun accompanied by the statues of Mut and Khonsu, to cross the river to spend the night with Hathor at Djeser -Djesru.

If you stand back from the temple, with the temple aligned straight to yourself and look up into the rocks directly above the temple, you will see there are life-form images (simulacra) of three people.

-To the left above the Hathor chapel is an image of a woman, she is sitting with her knees raised, her head is resting on her knees and her arms wrapped around her legs. She appears to have a bare bottom. If you have ever seen the figurine of the crying Ballerina, it is very similar sort of pose. However the image in the rocks has her bottom facing outwards. -To the right of the woman is an image of a young male, the side of his head appears to be adorned by a long heavy tress. -Above the two, right in the centre and reaching the very top of the cliff is an elderly bearded man. He is standing and appears to be dressed in a long robe. He has a protective arm around a little human-faced figure wearing a white conical hat. This is the shape of the crown worn by the Pharaoh’s of southern Egypt.

If you now consider the location of the mortuary temples to the primordial mound; the life-form images in the rocks above the temples, the exact alignment to Karnak and the ‘Festival of the Valley’ we shall begin to see the significance of this place. The simulacra of the ‘elderly bearded man’ was seen by the ancient Egyptians as the god Amun ‘The Father’. The simulacra of the ‘seated woman’ was seen by the ancient Egyptians as Mut ‘The Mother’ The simulacra of the ‘ youth with the long heavy tress’ was seen as Khonsu ‘The Son’.

Now consider that the root of Biblical theology was based on Egyptian theology. God the father, god the Mother and god the Son. Let us consider the following. In the Biblical story of creation we are told that in the beginning ‘God’ created the heavens and the Earth and all living things. The ancient Egyptians also believed in a god of creation, however they believed in other gods too, Imn was ‘Lord of the Gods’ he was the hidden one. Should it be presumed that the ‘God of Creation’ and the ‘Lord God’ who created the garden of Eden are the same?

The title; ‘Lord of the Gods’ and ‘The Lord God’, and the name Imn’ and ‘I am’ are almost the same. In the Bible ‘The Lord God’ speaks, not as a single being but of ‘us’ as if he is not alone, Genesis 1:26 "And God said let us make man in our image, after our likeness" Genesis 3:22 ‘And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us’. This doesn’t seem to make any sense, but would have made sense to the ancient Egyptians because Imn ‘The Lord of the Gods’ was never considered to be alone amongst the gods. Is the reason why the Lord God has been illustrated by artists for centuries as an elderly bearded man, dressed in a long flowing robe, because that is what his image looks like above the Holy of Holies?

Let us continue now to Eve. Eve’s name means ‘Mother’ Genesis 3:20 ‘And Adam called his wife’s name Eve; because she was the mother of all living, Mut’s name also means ‘Mother’. Eve was naked in the garden of Eden, Genesis 2:25 "And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed. What made them say that? Why was it necessary to make reference to Eve’s nakedness? If Eve and Mut are the same, it was important because it was a matter of identification , because her ‘image’ above the Holy of Holies shows her with a bare bottom.

Who or what was the ‘Serpent’ that beguiled Eve into eating from the tree of knowledge? Putting this again into ancient Egyptian religious context, Apep would be the serpent.

So the next question is ‘where is the tree of knowledge of good and evil’, >from which Eve ate? The simple answer is it is among all the other ‘trees’ of knowledge at the centre of the forest of ‘trees of knowledge, in the forest of columns in the temple of Imn at Karnak. The Egyptians ate from it by reading it’s religious hieroglyphic text and understanding it’s deep symbolic meaning. You don’t need to venture any further to find there also the ‘tree of life’, which to the ancient Egyptians was the Persea tree which bore the name of the Pharaoh.

Now the way of Eden was blocked by ‘cherubins’ and a ‘flaming sword’. Genesis 3:24 "So he drove out the man; and he placed at the east of the garden of Eden cherubins and a flaming sword which turned every way, to keep the way of the tree of life’. As you approach the temple of Imn at Karnak the avenue leading up to it is lined with sphinxes could these be classed as ‘cherubins’ . As you enter the temple you see the remaining standing obelisk of Hatshepsut, once said to have been coated in gold. Does this not describe a ‘flaming sword’.? If further evidence is required it is in the fact that the ancient Egyptians nearly always represented themselves and their gods with a youthful appearance, whatever their age, giving the impression that they had access to the fruits of the tree of life.

Now to the location of the ‘Hall of Records’. Slightly to the south of Hatshepsut’s temple is the location of the ‘Royal Cache’. This was the secret hiding place of a great collection of mummies of the New Kingdom Pharaohs, discovered by the Abd-er-Rassul brothers in 1881. In the rocks above the Royal Cache are simulacra of three apes. -Directly above the tomb which housed the royal mummies, in the natural formation of the rocks is the outline, in profile, of a seated dog-headed ape. Thoth Ancient myths relate to a crypt or tomb where Thoth had ‘hidden ‘records’. I am led to believe that it should be somewhere close to the primordial mound. His disciples boasted that they had access to such a place, so it wasn’t considered to be an imaginary place.

Now if the temple of Amun at Karnack is a ‘mirror image’ of Amun’s Holy of Holies at Deir el-Bahri (with the river Nile acting as the symbolic mirror), by reversing the process you can locate the Hall of Records. If you mirror image back from the Hall of Records at the temple of Amun to the Holy of Holies, it is the Royal Cache bay where the ‘Hall of Records’ should be. The bay that is overlooked by a life-form image of natural creation of the god Thoth, the ancient Egyptian god of writing the spokesman of the Gods and their keeper of records.

Maureen Palmer.
Norfolk, England.

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« Reply #178 on: May 29, 2008, 12:32:07 am »

 
Pahana
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   posted 02-02-2006 06:42 PM                       
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http://www.alchemylab.com/hyper_history.htm

quote:
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The teachings of Hermes -- the Hermetic tradition -- is one of the oldest spiritual traditions in the world, and while no direct evidence links the Emerald Tablet to Eastern religions, it shares uncanny similarities in concepts and terminology with Taoism, Hinduism, and Buddhism.
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Now, the real cultivation methods of the Taoist and Buddhist schools....it was not taught publically until the last 20 or 30 years max. Not only does it contain similarities, but similarities to the most important parts. So I don't believe someone in the west had the info to "make up" the info in the Emerald Tablets, or could know what was the important things, 100 years ago

[ 02-02-2006, 06:42 PM: Message edited by: Pahana ]
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« Reply #179 on: May 29, 2008, 12:35:09 am »

ParaNormalIAm

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   posted 02-02-2006 06:46 PM                       
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Now Brig and Psycho this might be another outlook on the stelas as discussed maybe there is just one but the reason two appear with a disk in the middle is to represent a mirrored image...

Man this is getting good....

Quick rewrite, and psycho I think this might be right up your alley.

We need to duplicate this experiment:

Now Maureen writes:
Now if the temple of Amun at Karnack is a ‘mirror image’ of Amun’s Holy of Holies at Deir el-Bahri (with the river Nile acting as the symbolic mirror), by reversing the process you can locate the Hall of Records. If you mirror image back from the Hall of Records at the temple of Amun to the Holy of Holies, it is the Royal Cache bay where the ‘Hall of Records’ should be. The bay that is overlooked by a life-form image of natural creation of the god Thoth, the ancient Egyptian god of writing the spokesman of the Gods and their keeper of records.

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