Was Atlantis a Phoenician city?

[Goliath]

 
Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-18-2002 12:03 AM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brig,
I have not yet mentioned where I believe a city of Atlantis existed, if at all. I believe it is best to work up to such things and there is a great deal of information which I have not yet shared. Suffice it to say that I am not placing the city of Atlantis in Egypt. That is, however, where the priest was saying that the defeated tribes of the alliance were settled - in districts in the Delta region.

As to when it existed, all evidence points to no earlier than 1500 BC. and no later than 1180 BC.

Respectfully,

Erick



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |   
 

[Goliath]

 
Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-18-2002 12:40 AM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nile Queen,
Welcome and thank you.

You do indeed see a new word. Syncretism. In this case, syncretism refers to the manner in which the Greeks and Romans routinely merged gods from many different cultures, who had similar descriptions, into one god with one name. To quote from my research paper:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The first difficulty encountered in attempting to identify the temple in the Atlantis text as Phoenician, is the problem of positively identifying the sea deity represented as Poseidon. In his contribution to the book The Phoenicians (Rizzoli International Publications, Inc., 1999), Sergio Ribichini points out that "All the classical sources raise this problem of fidelity to Phoenician religious facts. Although these sources must not systematically be considered suspect, it should be kept in mind that, in recording the information, the Greek or Latin author performs a mediation-alteration of the facts, due to his own cultural patterns." Dr. Ribichini also mentions that "Another example of the difficulties encountered in using classical sources is the impossibility of attributing a specific name to the Phoenician "Poseidon-Neptune," mentioned by so many authors and several inscriptions as being of primary importance in the religion of the Phoenician merchants and sailors. The Greek and Latin interpretation may identify not just one god, but various Phoenician deities similar to the "Lord of the Sea" in classical mythology."
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If I have researched correctly (and I believe I have), then the Poseidon mentioned in the text is probably nothing more than the standard form of the "Lord of the Sea" with which the Greek author (Plato or Solon) is familiar, and that he has identified the sea deity with, whose real name is actually unknown.

Respectfully,

Erick



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |   
 

[Goliath]

Andre
Member
Member # 661

Member Rated:
   posted 09-18-2002 01:25 AM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi, Your highness Nilequeen, visiting the Minions?  Being non-native tongue I have to check regulary and I've found:

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

syn·cre·tism Pronunciation Key (sngkr-tzm, sn-)
n.
Reconciliation or fusion of differing systems of belief, as in philosophy or religion, especially when success is partial or the result is heterogeneous.
Linguistics. The merging of two or more originally different inflectional forms.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
[Greek sunkrtismos, union, from sunkrtizein, to unite (in the manner of the Cretan cities) : sun-, syn- + Krs, Krt-, Cretan.]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
syn·cretic (-krtk) or syncre·tistic (-kr-tstk) adj.
syncre·tist n.

Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

syncretism

\Syn"cre*tism\, n. (Philol.) The union or fusion into one of two or more originally different inflectional forms, as of two cases.
Source: Webster's Revised Unabridged Dictionary, © 1996, 1998 MICRA, Inc.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


source http://www.dictionary.com

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 758 | From: Zoetermeer, the Netherlands | Registered: Dec 2001  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-18-2002 08:49 AM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry folks,
Hve to be gone for two days on assignment in Pittsburgh, PA. Talk at ya when I get back.

Erick



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Andre
Member
Member # 661

Member Rated:
   posted 09-19-2002 05:49 AM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
No problem, Erick. We will wait patiently. Just a few remarks on timings with Volcanic markers to keep this thread up on top of the list 
We know that cataclysm struck Earth-wide somewhere roughly between 1500 BC and 1150 BC. Wild stories about floods, earthquakes, intense fires originated from the stars, droughts caused havoc in the population. You´re probably going to tell us all about it. How about volcanic activity?

The Thera eruption is held responsible for all the trouble in some sources, but the timing seems heavily debated. Let me do some enlightening on that. Nowadays we have an excellent high resolution data set on paleo-volcanism from the GISP II ice cores of Greenland (a.k.a. Ice Hall Of Records  ) The error margin is only around a year. Crosscheck is possible for some examples like Mt Pelee (1902AD), Krakatoa (1883AD), Tambora (1815AD), Vesuvius (79AD) and Mount Toba (69,108 BC)

The Thera eruption has been dated to a wide range according to geologic and archeological sources from 1425 BC to 1650 BC with a stronger cases for 1627-1628 BC, later this was denied again.

Now, what does GISP II tells us about volcanic activity in our episode of interest?
We have clear single volcanic eruptions only, with clear spikes in 1694BC, 1622BC (strongest) and 1190BC Furthermore we have prolonged stronger volcanic activity between 1458BC and 1452BC (highest spikes)and some weaker indications between 1670- 1667 BC, 1600-1598 BC and 1290-1264BC as well as some smaller spikes at 1440BC, 1336BC and 1326BC. Nothing seemingly significant in between those dates. Weaker and stronger is only relative of course to the distance to Greenland and the prevailing winds that will have influenced the amount of volcanic markers in the ice.

So the Thera/Santorini eruption could be most likely either 1622BC or 1458BC depending on other evidence. Perhaps this helps dating your events, Erick?

But, just to stir up the discussions, the single most strongest Volcanic tracer peak, much higher than the second best, occurred 11,234 years ago, or about ......9000 years before Plato  (kidding); let's call that the Pleistocene Holocene boundary.


[This message has been edited by Andre (edited 09-19-2002).]


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 758 | From: Zoetermeer, the Netherlands | Registered: Dec 2001  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-19-2002 02:28 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andre,
Hey, I'm back.

You have managed to catch my attention with some info in your last posting, specifically the eruption of 1190 BC. Is there any way to find out where that eruption occured? If it occured somewhere in the Mediterranean we might be able to tie the earth shakings to that event.

And what about later dates (i.e. dates after 1190 BC but before 650 BC) Is there any info available for that time period?

Is the GISP II available to access online?

I have already ruled out Thera because it occured too early and because it coincides more with the "exodus" of the jews from Egypt and all of the events surrounding that story.

Thanks.

Erick

P.S. By the way, how do you get the little smiley face icon to appear in your messages?


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-19-2002 03:54 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andre,
A short while back I sent an e-mail to Georgeos asking him to participate in our forum. I received an e-mail back from him today. It reads:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Respected Mr. Wright:
I have not been able to respond its mail before, since it found to me immersed in an archaeological investigation in the area of the region of Gadeira or Gades (Cadiz) in front of the Columns of Hercules (Gibraltar). That is the reason for which I take a pair of weeks outside the forum of Atlantis Rising.

Will be a pleasure my power to establish authentic a dialectic scientist with You, Mr. Andre and yet that one that loves the scientific and rigorous discussion. Only him request that you have a little patience with me, since very I am occupied with the new investigations and discoveries, and with the search of which it translates my studies to the English to be able to publish my work in this language.

Respectful Greetings of Georgeos Diaz-Montexano


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So, it would appear that Georgeos will be joining us on the forum within a couple of weeks or so.

Something to look forward to, eh?

Warm regards,

Erick



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Brig

Administrator
Member # 802

Rate Member   posted 09-19-2002 06:10 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Erick: Can you help us in locating the most original copy of Platos work? Where might we try?
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 9843 | From: Old Washington, Ohio , USA | Registered: Apr 2002  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

NileQueen
Member
Member # 675

Member Rated:
   posted 09-19-2002 10:26 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Erick
To get the little smiley faces to appear in the text, you use colon + right parenthesis for a happy smiley.
If you add a hyphen for his nose, he will not transform into a graphic smiley.
 
 colon + left parenthesis
 semi-colon + right parenthesis
 colon + D

Nile Queen

[This message has been edited by NileQueen (edited 09-19-2002).]


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 706 | From: Indiana | Registered: Dec 2001   

[Goliath]

Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-19-2002 10:36 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brig,
No original copies of Plato's works have survived to us today.

You could check out some of the Neoplatonists, such as Proclinus, Crantor, St, Augustine and others, but you'll find mostly Latin translations of the text.

If you're really interested in creating a copy that's as close as possible to the original, then find a Greek copy and just eliminate the accents and breathing marks and convert all of the letters to upper-case. To find out what that would look like visit the following link.
http://www.plato-dialogues.org/papyrus.htm

To find out why:
http://www.plato-dialogues.org/works.htm

Respectfully,

Erick



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-19-2002 10:53 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Nile Queen,
Many thanks!

Erick



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Andre
Member
Member # 661

Member Rated:
   posted 09-20-2002 01:05 AM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Erick,
We seem to be heading for very interesting times indeed. To answer your questions.
Earth has been rather quiet volcanicly (if that's a word  ) in the 1100-800BC period except for a fairly strong isolated eruption in 1083BC. In the 700-600BC timeframe there has been a lot of smaller activity with a more distinct peak at 736BC.

As I'm neither geologist nor ice core specialist I can't tell you exactly but in some situations it appears to be possible to link the tracers to a certain area. Some of the dust particles in the ice may be identifyable. Perhaps Daffy Duck can help here. But there is an abundance of data and it may take years before they get to your eruption of interest, so you may want to take action.

Anyway, If you drop me a little E-mail on the address you find on my homepage http://home.wanadoo.nl/bijkerk I'm happy to return you all the volcanic GISP II data with the sources.

BTW This looks a lot like some items we have discussed: http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2001/10/1017_NileCities.html


[This message has been edited by Andre (edited 09-20-2002).]


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 758 | From: Zoetermeer, the Netherlands | Registered: Dec 2001  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-20-2002 07:36 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andre & Nile Queen,
As I stated in my post dated 09-16-2002 (12:12), the whole Atlantis story is derived from the story of the Invasions of the Sea Peoples, found in the Ramesseum at Medinet Habu (near Thebes in Upper Egypt), The Harris Papyrus, the Victory or Israel Stela, the Karnak Inscription, the Athribis Stela, and the Cairo Column.

In order to understand the story completely, it is first necessary to get a little background information. To quote from The Epigraphic Survey, 1928-1931:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
From time immemorial the Libyan tribes known to the Egyptians as the Tehenu and the Temehu, with certain subsidiary groups, had filled the western horizon of the Nile-dwellers with the constant menace of invasion. From the days of the Old Kingdom down, we have records of a long series of wars with these peoples. Apparently there never was any serious attempt on Egypt's part to conquer the Libyans and to hold their territory.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Merenptah did not inherite Egypt in the most idealic of situations. In the last few years of his reign, Ramesses II had allowed the Libyans to settle in the western Delta. On Egypt's eastern borders, foreign settlers had nearly ousted the native Egyptians. The extravagant building projects of Ramesses II had damaged the economy and nearly impoverished the people. For the first time in a long time, Egypt was in danger of being overrun.

The Libyan chief, Meryawy, saw all of this and believed that Egypt had grown weak. Realizing that this was his opportunity, Meryawy decided to attack and conquer the whole of the Delta - from where he would be in a good position to conquer the rest of Egypt. So confident was he of his victory that he even brought his wife and children and all of his possessions with him.

Meryawy strengthened his forces by adding contingents of foreign mercenaries. The Karnak Inscription records five other specific groups as part of that invasion:

1. The 'Akauasha', ('-k-w-s'), also referred to as the 'Ekwesh', are generally linked to the Homeric Achaeans.

2. The 'Tuaruasha', (Tw-rw-s'/Tw-ry-s'), also referred to as the 'Tursha', are generally linked to the Trojans.

3. The 'Ruakua' or 'Luakua', (Rw-kw or Lw-kw), also referred to as the 'Lukka', are generally linked to the Lycians of southwest Anatolia.

4 The 'Shardana,' 'Shardenu,' or 'Shardina,' (S'-r'd-n), also referred to as the 'Sherden', are generally linked to settlers from Sardis in western Anatolia who moved to the area of Akko north of Mount Carmel and eventually to Sardinia in Italy.

5. The 'Shara-ruasha', (s'-r'-rw-s'), also referred to as the 'Sheklesh', are generally thought to have moved later to Sicily.

In 1896, British archaeologist Flinders Petrie discovered the Victory Stela of Merenptah [(Baenra)(1213-1203 BC)], also called the Israel Stela because it carries the only known reference to Israel in all known Egyptian literature. This stela commemorates Merenptah's victory over the Libyan tribes and their allies in the 5th year of his reign.

Following is his Victory Poem, which is recorded on the stela:

[preamble]
Men will tell of his victories in all lands; all lands together are made to know and they are made to see the beauty of his valorous deeds.

[The poem then likens Merenptah to a "Strong Bull," which is an invocation of a more archaic Egypt.]

The sun, that drove away the clouds that were over Egypt, he that causeth Timuris (Egypt) to see the rays of the sun, he (Merenptah) removed a hill of brass from the back of the people, that he might give air to the folk that were in captivity. He that made Memphis to rejoice over their enemies, and made Ptah-Tenen to exult over his adversaries. He that openeth the gate of Memphis which had been shut, and made its temples to receive their victuals. Pharaoh Merenptah, the Sole One, that strengtheneth the hearts of hundreds, and breath cometh to their nostrils at the sight of him. The land of the Temehu was broken in his lifetime, and terror was forever put in the heart of the M'shauasha. He hath turned back the Libyans who trod Egypt, and great dread of Timuris is in their hearts; their march toward the heart of Egypt hath come to an end, and their feet make no stand, but fled. The archers cast away their bows, the heart of the fleet ones is wearied with marching. They loosed their waterskins and threw them on the ground; their sacks were torn and cast away. The miserable chieftain, the fallen one of Libya, fled under the cover of night, all alone, without the plume on his head, his feet failed. His wives were taken before his face; the victuals of his repast were captured; he had no water in the skin to sustain him. The countenance of his brethren was fierce to slay him; one fought against the other among his captains; their tents were burnt and reduced to ashes; all his goods were food for the soldiers. He reached his native country lamenting, and everyone that was left over in his land was enraged: "He is punished by fate, he with the base plume!" so say all they of his city concerning him, and: "He is in the power of all the gods of Memphis, the Lord of Egypt hath cursed his name. Meryawy is an abomination to Memphis, son to son of his family forever. Baenra-Beloved-of-Amun pursueth his children, and Merenptah-Contented-With-Truth is appointed as his fate."
So saith every man to his son: "Alas for Libya! They cease to live in the goodly fashion of walking about in the field. In a single day is an end put to their wandering, and in a single year are the Tehenu consumed. Sutekh (a Libyan war god derived from the Egyptian Seth) hath turned his back on their chieftain, and their settlements are destroyed with his authority. There is no work carrying these days. It is good to hide oneself; in the cave there is safety. The Great Lord of Egypt, might and valor belong to him. Who will yet fight, knowing how he strideth forward? A witless fool is he that awaiteth his onslaught, and he knoweth not what the morrow hath in store for him that transgresseth his boundary."
So saith Ra, the Lord of All: "Egypt is the only daughter of Ra, and it is his son that sitteth upon her throne. The eye of every god pursueth him that will plunder her. Give the scimitar to my son, the upright of heart, the kindly, the gentle, Merenptah-Beloved-of-Amun, who hath cared for Memphis, and pleaded the cause for Heliopolis; who hath opened the towns that were shut up, that he might set free the many that were confined in every region, that he might give offerings to the temple, and cause incense to enter before the god; that he might suffer the great ones to keep their possessions, and the humble to return to their cities."
So saith Ptah: "Let all his (Meryawy) sins be diverted together upon his head. Let him be given to the hand of Merenptah, that he may make him vomit forth what he hath swallowed like a crocodile. Behold the fleeter catcheth the fleet, and the Sovereign will ensnare in the net him that is aware of his strength. It is Amun who shattereth him with his hand, so that he may deliver him over to his ka in Hermonthis, even to Pharaoh Merenptah."
Great joy ariseth in Egypt, and jubilation issueth forth from the towns; they walk again unhindered upon the road, and there is no fear in men's hearts. The Matoi (Nubian police) lie inert and sleep; the Niaw and Tekten (western desert tribes that served as scouts and light infantry) are in the fields,wherein they desire to be; the towns are yet once more inhabited, and he that groweth his corn (a grain, not the familiar maize) will also eat it. Ra hath turned him to Egypt. He is born destined to be her protector, Pharaoh Merenptah. The chieftains lie prostrate and say 'Shalom.' The Tehenu hath been destroyed, the land of Hatti is peaceful, Canaan is captured with every evil, Askalon is carried away, Gezar is seized upon. Yenoam is made as nothing, Israel is desolated and hath no seed, Khari is become a widow for Timuris. All lands are united in peace, and whosoever went a roaming he is subdued by the Pharaoh of Upper and Lower Egypt, Baenra-Beloved-of-Amun, Son of Ra, Merenptah-Contented-With-Truth, who is given life like Ra every day.

The following is Merenptah's Triumph Song:

To Egypt has come great joy. The people speak of the victories which King Merenptah has won against the Tehenu:
How beloved is he, our victorious Ruler!
How magnified is he among the gods!
How fortunate is he, the commanding Lord!
Sit down happily and talk, or walk far out on the roads, for now there is no fear in the hearts of the people.
The fortresses are abandoned, the wells are reopened;
the messengers loiter under the battlements, cool from the sun;
the soldiers lie asleep, even the border-scouts go in the fields as they list.
The herds of the field need no herdsmen when crossing the fullness of the stream.
No more is there the raising of a shout in the night, "Stop! Someone is coming! Someone is coming speaking a foreign language!"
Everyone comes and goes with singing, and no longer is heard the sighing lament of men.
The towns are settled anew, and the husband man eats of the harvest that he himself sowed.
God has turned again towards Egypt, for King Merenptah was born, destined to be her protector.

Erick



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

Oldreds
Member
Member # 666

Rate Member   posted 09-20-2002 08:14 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Erick,

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
2. An Intermediate Greek-English Lexicon - founded upon the 7th edition of Liddell and Scott's Greek-English Lexicon - published by Oxford University Press It's ISBN is not listed inside the cover of the book anywhere. Sorry.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The ISBN is 0199102066. You can find it by going to either Amazon or Barnes & Noble and doing a search on the title. It's still in print and goes for about $45 US.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
It follows along with, or runs parallel to, the Graham Hancock religion which preaches that scholars and academics are wrong; that history needs to be rewritten. He wants to believe, and wants others to believe that civilization developed, to a level almost equal with our own, then due to some major catastrophe regressed and redeveloped. This would have the Atlantean civilization existing inside a vacuum in time and history.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Not at all; the Mahabharata and other ancient Vedic texts describe such a global civilization. Comparing it to modern civilization in terms of technology can be misleading, particularly when viewed through Theosophic and Edgar Cayce viewpoints (for example). There has been an unfortunate history of European scholars rewriting the history of ancient Asia to fit preconceived moulds -- moulds based on Christian doctrine, in most cases. I have spoken at length with many Hindus (both scholars and lay people) regarding the antiquity of these legends, who date these legends to what we think of as the early Stone Age. They accept the rewriting of their history as just another indignity foisted on them by the British.

This is not to say that the Vedas even mention Atlantis or anything even remotely like Atlantis; they don't (despite Childress' claims). However, they do point to an advanced culture in the Indian subcontinent and certain other areas of the world during the European stone age. We know that not all cultures advance in a parallel technological evolution, and that even during the atomic age that stone age tribes still exist. That humanity's history may have had other cycles of cultural and/or technological advancement in prehistory is only odd to those who have been trained to consider it so. Taken in the measure of the rise and fall of civilizations and technologies throughout recorded history, it is not surprising at all. No, I'm not advancing the theory that the Atlanteans were as Cayce or Blavatsky suggest, or even that the Mahabharata should be taken literally. What I am trying to state is that just because archaeology and history that has been largely influenced by Judeo-Christian bias has not brought to light evidence of civilizations which predate recorded history does not mean that such evidence has not been gathered -- or that such evidence does not exist.

Now I won't go so far as to state that every one of Hancock's premises is a solid fact (nor would I with everything presented from any one viewpoint). Yet to blindly accept the European assertions that all of the ancient legends exagerrated their ages and/or other facts, is akin to accepting Aristotle's assertion that Plato invented Atlantis. Hancock may have gone too far in his extreme (not having paid overmuch attention to his theories, I cannot judge). I would just ask that you would please not go to an opposite extreme by disregarding the possibility that some aspects of academic history may indeed need to be rewritten, particularly when it comes to the histories of other cultures.


My own view is that (1) Solon was describing Santorini or a Phoenician connection as you suggest; and (2) Plato combined elements of the story that he had learned from Solon with information from other Mediterranean histories; i.e., he described several different cultures under the heading of "Atlantis," and this included the Minoans (i.e., Santorini), the Pheonicians, and quite probably the Tartessans (Iberians) during different periods, and that all of them were referred to as "Sea Peoples."

That the Iberians probably had coastal cities on the Atlantic -- we know that the Phoenicians went as far as Tintagel in England for tin, so it is at least possible -- may have contributed to the story.
Finally, we have a legend of a sunken kingdom off of Brittany called "Ys." "Ys" in some Celtic languages means "island." Perhaps "Atlantis" was simply a bastardized form of "Island in the Atlantic," and that both the legend of Ys and the legend of Atlantis originally came from a single origin. Or, it could have just as easily referred to an island within the Mediterranean (though I feel that this is a stretch personally) that was part of the Atlas mountain range.

While I find no fault in your historic reasoning regarding Solon's journey to Egypt and the surrounding details thereof (or of the basic theories underlying Santorini as a candidate for Atlantis), I do not think that it captures everything regarding the entirety of the legend.

Well, I've rambled on enough for one evening, and I hope that at least a bit of it has made sense; my apologies if it has not.

------------------
samasaMdhi, parijJA, & manISitA, antaHpratiSThita saMdhyAMzaka,
R. Bruce
(sanIyasrudra, garuDa)
--------
As I learn more, I become more aware of the limits of my knowledge.





--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 609 | From: Richmond, Virginia, USA | Registered: Dec 2001  |  IP: Logged |   

[Goliath]

 
Erick Wright

Member
Member # 1145

Member Rated:
   posted 09-20-2002 09:09 PM                   
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andre and Nile Queen,
Back to the story.

The Libyans had penetrated the buffer territory west of the Delta and were encroaching on Egyptian lands. Five groups of "Sea Peoples" had joined and armed the Libyans, and together they were all conspiring to attack the cities of Memphis and Heliopolis, which were the great administrative and religious centers near the Delta's apex.

On a spring day in 1209 BC, at dawn, the Libyans and their allies arrived ready for a pitched battle. Instead, Merenptah unleashed his archers on them and for six hours they massacred the confederation of tribes. After six hours the Libyan chief, Meryawy, fled, and Merenptah's chariotry and infantry routed the demoralized forces. The Egyptian records indicate that nearly 9,400 Libyans and Sea Peoples were killed in that single, brief encounter.

I would now like to include a couple of quotes from a paper entitled "The Sea Peoples in Sicily, Sardinia, and Etruria: A Reexamination of the Archaeological and Textual Evidence in Light of Recent Research"


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
"The Shardana, Shekelesh, and Teresh, some of the tribes of "Sea Peoples" known from their raids on Egypt during the reigns of Merneptah (1212-1202 BC) and Ramesses III (1182-1151 BC), have been associated with the Tyrhennian regions of Sardinia, Sicily, and Etruria. Originally, these connections were based primarily on etymological and philological reasoning, but there is now significant archaeological evidence of links between the western and eastern Mediterranean beginning with the Late Bronze Age."
"In this paper I will show that not only is there significant archaeological evidence from the Late Bronze Age for eastern Mediterranean contact with several (underlined) centers in the west, but that communication continued even after the period of destruction that is so evident in mainland Greece, Anatolia and the Levant."

"I suggest that some of the Tyrhennian regions do in fact owe their names to the Sea Peoples, but only in the context of Phoenician prospection, mercantilism and ultimately colonization which maintained this contact between east and west."


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

If you bear in mind that the lands supposedly controlled by the Atlanteans inside the Straits of Gibraltar included Libya from as far as Egypt, and Europe as far as the Tyrhennian regions, then there should be no doubt that the Atlantis story is, indeed, the story of the Invasions of the Libyans and Sea Peoples.

Respectfully,

Erick



--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 770 | From: Columbus, Ohio U.S.A. | Registered: Sep 2002  |  IP: Logged |