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Flying Saucers & the Third Reich

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Rorschach
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« on: April 08, 2007, 03:32:00 am »

Flying Saucers and the



Hitler and the Third Reich led the world into a decade of terror in the first half of the 20th century that culminated in World War II. Technology played a greater part in that war than in past conflicts and the Germans developed an amazing array of secret weapons in a short time. Were flying discs part of the Luftwaffe arsenal? And, if so, was this secret looted and used by the Allied victors after the war?

Some of the German war-time technical advances are well known. The first military jet was the German Heinkel 178 which flew in 1939. In 1943 the Germans also deployed the only jet fighter to go into regular service during the war: The Messerschmitt 262. This German jet could easily overtake the fastest Allied aircraft. Only Hitler's misguided orders that the planes be outfitted as bombers, instead of defensive fighters, saved Allied aircraft from devastating casualties.

Cruise missiles, a staple of current advanced arsenals, were also first used by the Third Reich during the war. V-1 flying bombs were launched from German-held territories across the channel into England. The "buzz bombs," as they were sometimes called because of the sound of their impulse jet engines, could outrun most Allied aircraft making the V-1's almost impossible to stop. The V-1's weakness was its guidance system (a problem solved in modern cruise missiles by the use of computer-controlled radar). Because it couldn't hit a pinpoint target, the V-1 could only be used to cause random terror, not wipe out truly important military assets.



A V-2 rocket ready to launch.
 
The V-2 rocket (left) was the predecessor of the Intercontinental Ballistic Missiles that filled the nuclear arsenals of the Soviet Union and the United States during the Cold War. It traveled up to 225 miles at five times the speed of sound. A single hit could demolish a city block. During the war the V-2 killed 2724 civilians and injured another 6467. Like the V-1, though, it lacked a guidance system that would have allowed it to strike at important targets.

The Germans even developed a rocket-powered fighter, the Me 163. Though it never was put into regular service, it was the first aircraft to fly faster than 600 miles an hour.

Is it possible that the list of secret weapons produced by Nazi Germany included flying saucers? Did they actually deploy disc shaped fighters or at least experiment with them?

Some of the earliest stories about German flying saucers date back to an inventor named Victor Schauberger. Schauberger was born in Austria in 1885 and was considered by many to be a crackpot. Schauberger himself said, "They call me deranged. The hope is they are right..." Schauberger believed that machines could be designed better so that they would be "going with the flow of nature" rather than against it.

One of Schauberger's projects was to produce a flying machine, saucer shaped, that used a "liquid vortex propulsion" system. His theory was that "if water or air is rotated into a twisting form of oscillation, known as a 'colloidal,' a build-up of energy results, which, with immense power, can cause levitation."

According to stories Schauberger built several models (right), one of which was almost five feet in diameter and was powered by a 1/20 hp electric engine. Some reports indicated that one of the models actually flew. There are also reports that, according to letter Victor Schauberger wrote to a friend, a full-sized prototype of one of his designs was constructed using prison labor at the Mauhausen concentration camp. This craft flew on February 19th of 1945 near Prague and obtained an altitude of 45,000 feet in only 3 minutes. The letter goes on to say the prototype was destroyed by the Nazis before it could be captured by the Allies.

 



Schauberger's models.
 
After the war Schauberger moved to the United States, where some contend he worked on secret projects for the U.S. government. He died in 1958, apparently claiming his ideas had been stolen.

Another German designer involved with the Nazi effort during the war was Rudolf Schriever. Schriever, along with some other engineers named Habermohl, Miethe and Bellanzo, apparently came up with several disc-shaped aircraft designs that used more conventional power sources than those Schauberger envisioned. One of Schriever's drawings shows an egg-shaped cockpit surrounded by a rotating fan-like disc that provided the lift. A Mieth drawing depicts a smooth flat saucer with an elongated hump on its back for the cockpit. Both would have been powered by jet engines.

As with Schauberger, there were reports that some of these designs were actually built. The Schriever machine was said to have been tested in 1945 and to have reached an altitude of 12 kilometers in a little over three minutes. It had a top speed of 2000 kilometers an hour.

There is no real, solid evidence, though, that a test flight ever took place and Schriever himself, who relocated to the United States after the war, indicated that any prototypes of the craft were destroyed, before flying as the Germans abandoned their facilities in the face of advancing Allied troops.

Stories also persist that the Germans's also had developed small automatized flying discs. One version was called the Feuerball. Another, capable of vertical takeoff, was referred to as the Kugelblitz. According to stories, these craft were only armed with devices designed to interfere with the electronics of nearby airplanes.

The Feuerball and Kugelblitz stories seem to parallel tales of "foo-fighters" told by Allied pilots during the war. Despite this it seems unlikely that Feuerballs and Kugelblitzs were ever actually built or flown. The "foo-fighters" observed were probably some purely natural phenomena. No Allied plane ever reported being attacked by a foo-fighter and it is likely that if the Germans had invented a device capable of tracking planes as well as the foo-fighters apparently did, they would have soon armed it with some effective weapon.

So were there really any German disc-shaped aircraft? It seems likely that there was certainly some experimentation with the concept within the Reich. Disc-shaped aircraft have several advantages, including low stall speed and low drag, even at high speeds. The rounded shape can also lower the craft's radar profile making it "stealthy." For these reasons German designers did consider using disc shaped aircraft, as did the U.S.

The low stall/drag of the shape was particulary imporatant to the Germans at the end of the war. Months of bombing had reduced German runways to rubble. A saucer shaped craft could have lifted off the ground like a vertical-takeoff-and landing (VTOL) aircraft without a runway at all.

It is certain that they produced some models or prototypes, though, it is unlikely that if these machines flew they obtained the outstanding climb and speed figures some stories suggest. These stories may be difficult to disprove, though, since in the chaos at the end of the War, many records were lost or destroyed.

Rumors are likely to continue that the Nazis developed flying saucer technology that was then stolen by the United States and the Soviet Union after the war. This latter suggestion is not wholly without merit, since US and USSR rocketry development after WWII owed a lot to German scientists who were recruited to assist in the superpowers Cold War space programs through an operation known as "Paperclip." There are records, exposed by author Jim Wilson in a Popular Mechanics article in July 1997, that suggest that at least two brothers, Walter and Reimar Horten, were sought by the United States after the war because of their participation in German military saucer programs.

Some saucer stories about Germany developed after the War, rather than during it. In particular there is a book, UFOs: Nazi Secret Weapons? in which the author, Ernst Zundel, suggests Hitler escaped at the end of the war to establish a flying saucer base in Antarctica at the entrance of a hole that leads to a hollow "inner Earth."

Since science has pretty well established that the Earth isn't hollow, it seems these stories can be disregarded. As for the existence of other German WWII flying discs, though, it is possibility that may never fully be disproved.

http://www.unmuseum.org/germufo.htm
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Rorschach
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« Reply #1 on: April 08, 2007, 03:44:41 am »



Schreiver Flying Disc



Photos above and below of alleged Nazi
flying saucers. Both
are considered hoaxes. T



The concept of "flying saucers" has become synonymous with that of UFO, and by logical extension, to "extraterrestrial spacecraft." The truth is that these concepts are not necessarily related.
 
Long before Kenneth Arnold initiated the modern age of the societal phenomenon known as UFO, there were already "flying saucers" that had little in common with spacecraft from other planets.
 
Any enthusiast of aviation history will have encountered sketches of "flying saucers" and discoidal aircraft more than once in aviation catalogues and publications. In his own day, Leonardo Da Vinci had already sketched the outlines of circular vehicles: war wagons, movable fortresses, and other artifacts which, had they been endowed with the power of flight, would be the perfect ancestors of our "flying saucers."
 
During the 1930's, a number of circular wing aircraft were built in the United States, some of which would eventually confuse ufologists, who took them as evidence of UFOs which had crashed on American soil. On one hand, H. Zimmerman conducted several tests in 1932 with a variety of circular wing aircraft inside a wind tunnel in order to prove the lesser degree of distension in their extremities. The results of these tests were published in
"Technical Report 431," issued by NACA (known today as NASA), producing a genuine sensation and leading to the creation of US patent 2,108,093. A practical use for them would be found later on in the "Chance Vought 173" whose maiden flight occurred in 1942.
 
In its February 1989 issue, the German magazine Flugzeug published the following report made by a German aviation official who, allegedly, been the protagonist of the astonishing sighting involving a "flying saucer" at the Prag-Gbell (formerly Praha-Kbely) aerodrome in 1943. The controversial report follows:
 
"Place of Sighting: C 14 Flight School at the Prag-Gbell aerodrome. Date of Event: August/September 1943, supposedly on a Sunday (I seem to recall there were no services on that day. The weather was good, dry and sunny. Kind of Observation: "I was with my flight comrades on the air strip, more precisely, near the school buildings, some 2000 meters away from the arsenal (located to the extreme left). See adjoining diagram.
 
The device was inside the hangar: a disk some 5-6 meters in diameter. Its body is relatively large at the center. Underneath, it has four tall, thin legs. Color: Aluminum. Height: Almost as tall as a man. Thickness: some 30 - 40 cm., with an rim of external  rods, perhaps square orifices.
 
The upper part of the body (almost a third of the total height) was shrunken over the upper half of the disk. It was flat and rounded. See the attached sketch for the lower
half.
 
Along with my friends, I saw the device emerge from the hangar. It was then that we heard the roar of the engines, we saw the external side of the disk begin to rotate, and the vehicle began moving slowly and in a straight line toward the southern end of the field. It then rose almost 1 meter into the air. After moving around some 300 meters at
that altitude, it stopped again. Its landing was rather rough.
 
We had to leave the area while some custodians pushed the vehicles toward the hangar. Later on, the "thing" took off again, managing to reach the end of the aerodrome this
time.
 
Afterwards, I made a note in my flight log of the members
of the FFS C14 who were present at the moment: Gruppenfluglehrer (group flight instructor) Ofw. Michelsen;  Fluglehrer Uffz. Kolh und Buhler; Flugschüler (flight students): Ogefr, Klassmann, Kleiner, Müller, Pfaffle, Schenk, Seifert, Seibert, Squarr, Stahn, Weinberger, Zoebele, Gefr, Hering, Koza, Sitzwohl, Voss, and Waluda."
 
Certainly, even Flugzeug's editors treat the report cautiously: "the device described by these observers is antithetical to those described by Schreiver, Habermohl, Miethe, and  Bellonzo with their vast basic dimensions." And these German experts cannot be mistaken, since it is known to all of those who are well-versed in aeronautics that during the history of Nazi aviation at least two circular-wing aircraft were built, and fifteen others were   designed, although there remains the possibility that the object supposedly tested at Prag-Gbell was one of the prototypes destroyed by the Nazis in order to keep it from
falling into Allied hands after the fall of the Third Reich.
 

http://www.members.tripod.com/uforeview/naziufo.html
 
« Last Edit: April 08, 2007, 03:46:18 am by Rorschach » Report Spam   Logged
Rorschach
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« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2007, 03:49:46 am »

 
Nazi Flying Saucers Part II

Milton Keynes, England, it's not the kind of place where we expect to get new information on  real life flying saucers. But after our recent report on a shaped aircraft in Canada, top secret  American saucer projects and Germany's development of craft like this during World War II,  a SIGHTINGS Researcher received A letter from viewer D. Robin Stowell.



 A typesetter by trade, Stowell alerted us to the book, Brighter Than A Thousand Suns. An authoritative history of the race to build the first Atomic Bomb. Stowell typeset the original manuscript nearly forty years ago. And never forgot this brief reference to a Nazi Saucer that  could out-maneuver any allied aircraft.
 Four decades after publication, Stowell found a copy of the out of print reference book and  confirmed what he had long remembered. The footnote describes German Saucers that were  forty five yards across, capable of reaching speeds over Mach One and climbing to an  elevation of nearly eight miles. Some experts believe that these Nazi Saucers could have been  responsible for the legendary Foo Fighter sightings over Europe late in World War II. But if  they were, it still does not explain Foo Fighters spotted over the Pacific during the same  period.

There were a number of brilliant German scientists and engineers working on flying disc-shaped craft, many of which used traditional rocket/jet propulsion  techniques...but some,  apparently used methods far in advance of anything commonly known at that time. Or now, for that matter
 
 Dr. Richard Miethe whose group allegedly built saucer craft at Breslau, came to Canada after  the war and worked on saucer designs with the A.V. Roe Company on a joint
 American-Canadian project which 'officially' produced only a barely functional 'hovercraft'  type 'saucer.' Most researchers today consider the Roe 'saucer' nothing less than a diversion.  What was Miethe really working on?



 Another highly-advanced group was led by Dr. Viktor Schauberger, who worked in Austria at  the Kertl factory in Vienna. Schauberger's incredible craft allegedly utilized a tornado-like vortex which produced magnetic effects said to cause levitation. Two Schauberger models,  both made of copper, were said to have been built with one of them successfully test flown.  The story goes that it flew so well, in fact, that it impacted the inside roof of the hangar and was destroyed.

 The SS which was apparently overseeing this and all German saucer research, allegedly stopped further experimentation after accident, dismissed Schauberger, and took all of his  work and wizardry to some other location for further development. After the war, Schauberger was lured to the US by an alleged CIA front company and was then duped into signing a  contract in English (he knew only German) giving the company all rights and title to his  inventions, concepts, and designs. He was then returned to Austria...and died five days later.

 As stated earlier, many of the German saucer craft were predicated upon known, if quite exotic, technology. Our source for the extraordinary drawing below has been thoroughly interviewed over a lengthy period of time and is known to be of impeccable integrity. We  have seen some of the hundreds of wartime documents from his long service with the    Horten brothers, including personal correspondence from them to him.

 When queried as to how he was able to obtain the drawing of the disc craft below, he would only say, "Sneaky...sneaky. No one was ever to know anything about this...I had to get the drawing from a friend who was very close to the project." He said he would never
 compromise his friend by disclosing his identity.




Our source described how he was stationed at an airbase in Prague during the war while undergoing advanced mechanical training and also doing some teaching. On a number of occasions during his time at the base he heard, what he believes, was the disc-shaped  vehicle shown in the drawing below being test flown.  We say 'heard' because all those living on, or even near,  the test area of the base were utterly forbidden to look out the windows...under penalty of being shot on the  spot. In fact, all the windows in homes facing the test area were blacked out. No exceptions.  He described the sound of the craft as absolutely 'deafening.' This would come as no surprise,  given the 5 engines...three for lift and two for forward thrust...indicated in the drawing below.  This is a simple overview schematic of the craft which does not, obviously, reflect the finished detail of the pilot(s) controls, seating, and final interior configuration of the operational model.

 Our source said the engines were nottypcial jet engines but were kerosene-fueled turbines of a  type which he was told were capable of producing very high speeds. The drawing in his  possession and shown here may be of the Schriever disc which was said to have used rotating  metallic vanes set within the perimeter of the disc to achieve vertical lift similar to produced  a helicopter. Once airborne, the two thrust turbines took over to push the craft on its way. Our source says he believes the first test flight occurred in 1942.

 What happened to these craft after the war? Our source says that both the Russians and Americans were aware of the ultra-secret German disc research programs and had an agreement they would not shoot the discs down or apparently bomb the research facilities because the craft posed no hostile threat...unlike the facilities at Peenemunde. The eventual outcome of the war was a virtual certainty and both countries wanted the disc technology as one of the prime spoils of war.

 As research continues probing the advanced German WWII programs, it is becoming more  evident that at least some of the early - and current - UFO sightings may be directly related to,  and descendants of, disc craft like the one depicted in this newly unearthed historic drawing.

http://www.members.tripod.com/uforeview/nazi2.html
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Rorschach
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« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2007, 03:53:35 am »


Secret flying discs of the Third Reich
compiled by UFO Area

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
German Flying Saucer - VRIL THULE
 














http://www.ufoarea.com/misc_nazi_ufos3.html
« Last Edit: April 08, 2007, 03:56:13 am by Rorschach » Report Spam   Logged
Rorschach
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« Reply #4 on: April 08, 2007, 03:58:56 am »

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« Reply #5 on: April 08, 2007, 04:01:12 am »

Secret flying discs of the Third Reich
compiled by UFO Area







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« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2007, 04:03:05 am »

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« Reply #7 on: April 08, 2007, 04:06:09 am »






http://www.ufoarea.com/misc_nazi_ufos.html
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