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the A.R.E.'s Investigations into the Atlantic

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Author Topic: the A.R.E.'s Investigations into the Atlantic  (Read 4210 times)
Desiree
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« on: April 03, 2007, 03:02:46 am »

Hi all, this topic will be devoted to some conversations I had with Dr. Greg Little at the other forum, edited, in interview fashion (my questions will be in black, Greg's responses will be the ones in blue). I'm printing it all not just so that other people can see what we have already talked about, but so all the info can be gathered in one place.

A little background first on Greg's credentials from his appearances on Coast to Coast:

http://www.coasttocoastam.com/guests/75.html

Dr. Gregory Little holds a master's degree in psychology and a doctorate in counseling from Memphis State University. He is co-editor of Ancient Mysteries, a monthly newsletter for members of the official Edgar Cayce organization, The Association for Research and Enlightenment. Beginning in 1997, Greg began investigating a portion of the psychic readings of Edgar Cayce, which specifically covered the history of ancient America. This research culminated in the books “Mound Builders,” “Ancient South America,” and “Secrets of the Ancient World.”

In 2003 Greg and his wife Lora, took over the A.R.E.’s long running Search for Atlantis project, which focuses on the Bahamas area. During 2003, Greg and Lora made numerous trips to Bimini and Andros Island investigating sites that had initially been discovered in an extensive satellite imaging project as well as enigmatic underwater formations photographed from the air in the 1960s. They found that all of the sites had natural or modern explanations. But unexpectedly, on what they had initially planned to be their last day on Andros, they discovered a massive, three-tiered stone platform under shallow water.


My friend, Nekozuki and I started out talking about the pyramids off of Vero Beach, and that was where Greg first entered the conversation:
« Last Edit: April 03, 2007, 03:47:43 am by Desiree » Report Spam   Logged

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Desiree
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« Reply #1 on: April 03, 2007, 03:03:59 am »

I have a good friend (Berthold Schwarz) who lives in Vero Beach and says the underwater pyramid formation there is genuine. Schwarz, a psychiatrist, knows the man who supposedly discovered it. I've wanted to explore that area with a form of side scan sonar (front-scan, actually) for years but it keeps being put off. Thanks for reminding me of it. I'm always doubtful of such things, but it's in the realm of possibility. We may do that at the beginning of one of our trips to the area this spring or summer.

The Bahamas are a paradise of sorts, yes, outside of the few big cities. The Great Bahama Bank hasn't really been explored archaeologically. Bimini, parts of Andros, and parts of Cay Sal have been the long-term focus of ongoing expeditions. All of us in our small group want to do some sort of evaluation on the Great Bahamas Bank. Its generally 3 to 20 feet deep. But it has vast amounts of sand on the bottom. We've been across the entire thing on water and "eliminated" several seeming anomalies on it—circles mainly.

For that matter, Andros still has vast areas completely unexplored, especially the high ridge running down the entire island. Later this summer we plan on a small land surface survey of the ridge, at least 5 miles or so of it. Its pocked with caves, but no one has ever examined the surface for archaeological sites or clues.

Islands and other areas are for sale, rather cheap. The Mennonites have a huge farm on Andros. The land is free if the person can produce anything for export for a period of years. Of course, it can be hot, filled with biting bugs, phone and electricity can be spotty, and the largest grocery store is about the size of a 7-11. Still, for those who don't want in the fast lane, or an urban area, a place like Andros is ideal.

Greg Little
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Desiree
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« Reply #2 on: April 03, 2007, 03:05:35 am »

Q. Hi Greg, thanks for the information, I'm glad we could finally encourage some investigation into the Vero Beach pyramids.

Say, I was reading some of your articles yesterday you wrote on our Yucatan search for the Hall of Records back in 2004. Did anything ever come of that?
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« Reply #3 on: April 03, 2007, 03:06:13 am »

Desiree:

We made a dvd video of the Yucatan (Piedras Negras) trip. It included an excursion to Cerritos, Tikal, and a few other spots. There are two specific places at Piedras Negras that probably lead to a tunnel system into what is called the "Acropolis" there. One is a definite: Pyramid O-13 has a tunnel under it leading to "somewhere." Several groups have tried to open it unsuccessfully...the inner rubble collapses as the tunnel is dug. There is a large sum of research money awaiting use for work there, but a US university has the current excavation rights, so that is a complication.

There is no doubt that Cayce spoke of 3 identical record halls and the locations of all 3 are pinpointed, at least to general location: Bimini, Piedras Negras, & Giza. Our new ARE Press book (Edgar Cayce's Atlantis) is an official ARE position-statement on this. The "alleged" controversy regarding Piedras Negras (PN) isn't really controversial. PN is it...and it is in the Yucatan Peninsula. Bimini was the site of another one, and Cayce detailed that quite a bit in many readings. A large, high tech project at Bimini will take place this summer to try to find it, and Cayce said it was underwater. Work at Giza is dead for the moment.

A variety of people, some of whom use aliases, have caused confusion in all of this. Everyone is entitled to opinions, and some opinions are obviously better than others. The ARE's position on the 3 record halls, and ours, is clearly detailed in several places, so there isn't any reason to take that further. The geologists' 1970s-80s reports on Bimini were not just flawed, but are ridiculously wrong. In one case, a hoax was perpetrated by skeptics.

Regarding Bimini, where it stands now is that it has been confirmed that the so-called "Bimini Road" was a breakwater of an ancient harbor. There is another harbor area there too, more recent, yet still ancient. The formations appear to be the remains of a maritime culture operating perhaps between the years 8000 BC to 3000 BC. Formations at Andros and Cay Sal appear to be harbors utilized by the same culture. A lot will happen this summer.

Greg Little
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Desiree
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« Reply #4 on: April 03, 2007, 03:07:15 am »

The Carolina Bays Event was used in our book on Cayce and an earlier book we did. Andrew Collins introduced me to the idea, and he got it from Otto Much's book. The US Geological Survey found that a sudden flash fire hit the entire Bahamas during the late pleistocene and burnt forests found under water (and under 6-feet of silt) off Florida have confirmed that a disaster did hit somewhere between 8500-10,000 BC.

Collins will be in the US in June.
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Desiree
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« Reply #5 on: April 03, 2007, 03:07:55 am »

Hi Greg, I found your video online but the clips don't seem to come up for me, must be my computer:
http://www.mysterious-america.net/yucatanhallclips.html

Anyway, I have been reading up on this and the Yucatan Hall of Records sounds more accessible than the Egypt Hall of Records anyway. I guess this was written by Lora?


quote:
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Links between Piedras Negras and the Maya Creation Stories

Our research also revealed that the Maya creation stories contain many aspects that resemble Cayce's story of the Atlantean immigrant Iltar who, with 10 companions, arrived in the Yucatan in 10,500 B.C. transporting the Atlantean records. Piedras Negras is linked to the Maya creation story in several ways. First, it contains an altar upon which is carved the creation story and some very old pre-Maya dates (5,000, 4,000 and 3114 B.C.). It is also the location where the firestone emblems were carefully placed by the Classic Maya. In addition, one of the ruling families at Piedras Negras was named Turtleshell who claimed to be descendants of the gods. Also, the turtleshell was a sacred symbol for the Maya since it is the place from which the gods (Atlanteans?) were said to have emerged during the last creation (August 14, 3114 B.C.).

Even more compelling is the fact that the Maya creation story directly involves the 3 stars making up the belt of Orion. Several pyramid alignments at Piedras Negras show the characteristic Orion placement earlier identified at Giza by Bauval and Gilbert. Perhaps more startling is the finding that several pyramids at Piedras Negras show astonishing alignments with Orion at both the beginning of the current Maya era (on August 13, 3114 B.C.) and its end (December 22, 2012 A.D.). And these represent only a small sampling of the many correlations found between Piedras Negras and Cayce's story.

In recent years, Brigham Young University has been conducting digs at the site. Brigham Young archaeologists have found that several pyramids at the site were built over older structures made with megalithic stones indicating the possible existence of a more ancient pre-Maya civilization. These pyramids are located in the same area that The Lost Hall of Records indicates as the likely site of the Hall of Records. The early excavations at Piedras Negras are also detailed in the book with numerous pictures and illustrations (some dating to 1895 expeditions at the site).
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http://www.cyberspaceorbit.com/areatlanx.htm

I guess that Brigham Young is the university that still has the excavation rights? Is there anyway that A.R.E. can make a deal with the university and excavate, too?

How old were the earliest pyramids that were built over, is there any estimation?

I also saw a special with John Van Auken on "Digging for the Truth," where he points out a stela before the Sphinx, depicting two Sphinxes, each one sitting on a house. Since he identifies this as the Hall of Records, wouldn't that mean that there are two underground chambers there, not one?
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Desiree
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« Reply #6 on: April 03, 2007, 03:09:11 am »

Hey Greg, did you ever investigate this location mentioned by Dr. Ray Brown, or see the crystal mentioned here?


quote:
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One particularly interesting piece of information in the above reading is the reference to Bimini. In 1969, steps were discovered leading down under the ocean at Bimini. These have always been believed to have once formed part of Atlantis although it appears that little further excavations or explorations have ever taken place on this site.

Another unusual crystal find bears directly upon the use of crystals as the generator of a universal form of power. In 1970, Dr. Ray Brown, a naturopathic practitioner from Mesa, Arizona, was scuba diving with friends near the Bari islands, Bahamas, in an area 20 miles from the edge of a submarine drop-off called the Tongue of the Ocean.


During the dive, Brown became separated from his companions, and in trying to rejoin them, suddenly saw a strange pyramid shape looming up against the aquamarine light. The pyramid was situated 22 fathoms down, stood 120 feet high, with only 90 feet projecting out of the sea floor shifting sands. Brown was at first struck by how smooth and mirror-like the stone surface of the structure was, with the joints between the individual blocks almost indiscernible.

Swimming about the capstone, which the Arizona diver thought looked like lapis lazuli, he discovered an entranceway and decided to explore further. Passing along a narrow hallway, Brown finally came to a small rectangular room with a pyramid-shaped ceiling. What was amazing was that the room contained no algae or coral growing on the inner walls. They were completely spotless.

In addition, though Brown had brought no flashlight, he could nevertheless see everything in the room perfectly. It was very bright and well lit, but no direct light source was visible. Brown's attention was drawn to a brassy metallic rod 3 inches in diameter hanging down from the apex of the centre, and at its end was attached a many-faceted red gem, which came to a point. Directly below the rod and gem, sitting in the middle of the room was a stand of carved stone topped by a stone plate with scrolled ends.

On the plate rested a pair of carved metal bronze-coloured hands, life-sized, which appeared blackened and burnt, as if having been subjected to tremendous heat. Nestled in the hands, and situated 4 feet directly below the ceiling rod gem point, was a crystal sphere 3-1/2 inches in diameter.

Brown first attempted to pry loose the ceiling rod and red gemstone, but neither would budge. Turning back to the crystal sphere he found it easily separated from the bronze hand holders, and left the pyramid with it. As he departed, Brown felt a presence, and heard a voice from somewhere telling him never to return.

Fearing that his unusual prize might be confiscated as salvage-treasure by the U.S. government, Dr. Brown did not disclose the existence of the strange crystal or his experiences until 1975, when he exhibited the crystal for the first time. He displayed the crystal only a half dozen times, but each time witnesses have seen or have been sensitive to strange phenomena directly associated with it.

Deep inside the crystal form one gazes upon three pyramid images, one in front of the other, in decreasing sizes. Some, entering into a meditative or alpha brainwave state of consciousness, are able to clearly see a fourth pyramid, in the foreground of the other three.

Psychic Elizabeth Bacon of New York may have hinted at the significance of the image. In a trance reading on the mysterious sphere, she received the message that the object had once belonged to Thoth, the Egyptian god whom ages ago buried a secret vault of knowledge at Giza, near the three great Pyramids there. Do the positions of the three pyramid images in the crystal hold a key to finding a fourth, as yet unfound subterranean pyramid, that is the fabled Hall of Records?

From the side, the internal images dissolve into thousands of tiny fracture lines, and Brown feels these may be electrical in nature, like some form of microscopic circuitry. From still another angle, and under special conditions, many witnesses have been able to see a large single human eye staring out serenely at them. Photographs of this eye have also been taken.

Like the mysterious crystal skull of Central America, Dr. Brown's crystal sphere is the source of a variety of paranormal events. People have felt breezes of ionic winds blowing close to it; cold and warm layers surround it at various distances; other witnesses have been phantom lights, heard voices, or felt strange tingling sensations around it.

A compass needle placed next to the sphere will spin counterclockwise, then begin turning in the opposite direction when moved only two inches away. Metals are temporarily magnetised in close contact with it. There are even recorded instances where one person has been temporarily healed of an ailment by touching the crystal sphere, but then the next person to come into its range took on the symptoms of the ailment of the other person, as if the crystal could draw out and then activate human disorders at will.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://pyramidmesa.netfirms.com/hall1.html

I never realized how interesting looking for this must be!!
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Desiree
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« Reply #7 on: April 03, 2007, 03:10:15 am »

Des:

The long quote regarding the Maya and PN may have been written by Lora. I'm not sure. But it appears to discuss the 1999 book, The Lost Hall of Records. A lot has happened since then.

The Yucatan clips: after clicking on one, they load automatically, but you have to use Quicktime. Windows media won't play them. They are large files, 10+ mb. If you have a slow connection, they take time. If you have Quicktime installed, a large "Q" will appear in the middle of your screen until the movie loads.

Actually, The University of Pennsylvania now has the rights to PN. BYU gave them up several years ago after they decided to cease work there.

PN is typically dated to maybe 400 BC or so, at the earliest. But there are multiple layers of older structures under all the structures there. Despite all the work that has been done there, the site has barely been touched. But it truly is in ruins. It is an incredibly difficult place to get to. How far down the structures go is simply unknown in most cases. Following Cayce's statements, there is some area there that would date to circa 10,000 BC. But it's buried. It isn't the entire site, just a small part of it where a special temple housing the records was made.

John was showing the "Dream Stella" between the paws of the Sphinx. The Stella shows chambers under a Sphinx-like figure. But John is simply using it as an indication that something lies under the Sphinx. Cayce's readings on the Hall of Records there gave details about where the opening to the chamber was, but it is somewhere under the Sphinx. The Sphinx actually has a 40-ft tunnel under it from the rear, a tunnel in a side, and two smaller ones on the feet and side. These have all been sealed, but we managed to see the 40-ft one in 1996. Cayce's "Hall of Records" tunnel begins in front of the Sphinx at a spot where a cave or tunnel was verified by gpr (ground-penetrating radar) and then a small drop camera was inserted. It is in the Sphinx Temple area. It has not been explored since it was seen in the late 1990s.

Ray Brown is now dead. He did, in fact, travel around giving lectures with a crystal he claimed he took from an underwater pyramid off the Berry Islands. These are a small group of Bahama Islands far North of Bimini. A friend of Brown's told me a few months ago that after Brown died the crystal disappeared, meaning it was taken. I never saw it but have heard opinions from others..they did not view him as credible. I have tried to verify the magical claims surrounding it, and I can't find any verification by witnesses at all. I have spoken to many people who held the stone and heard the lectures.

Because of the things we've done in the Bahamas, I take all claims of underwater pyramids in the region quite skeptically (in the real sense of the term). Once a story gets out, even if it is later corrected by the person who released the story, it gets rehashed as if it remains unsolved. For example, the alleged "pyramids" off Cay Sal. They were first found by side scan sonar, as were many other underwater "pyramids" in the Bahamas. After a year--or often more--after making the report, the discoverer returns to the site and finds one of two things: nothing at all ... or a heap of sand. Sand easily heaps into mounds and pyramid shapes on the bottom there, but it can come and go from one storm to the next. (Moving pyramids?) When we started spending our own money running down such claims, it became apparent that the smart thing to do was to genuinely and honestly follow each "mystery" or the claim to the end--meaning solve it. Our goal was to take each mystery, one-by-one, and solve it by doing whatever it took. Assuming one has the time, the energy, the resources, and a workable plan, it can be done. That's what we started doing. The score thus far is pretty simple: the huge, underwater multiringed "stone circle of SW Andros"--a 1969 mystery--solved: natural.

Andros Temple (1968) underwater site--solved: sponge pen.

Rebikoff's "e"--a 1969 mystery--solved: natural.

The numerous underwater circles off Andros and Bimini--solved: all natural but one. The one exception was a modern building material dump site.

Cay Sal satellite anomaly--a 2006 mystery--solved: natural.

Bimini Road--solved: a breakwater forming a harbor. (New mystery: who made it and when?) (Another mystery: hoax perpetrated by skeptics who claim the Bimini Road is completely natural.) (Bigger mystery: why have hundreds of so-called scientists allowed the skeptics' hoax regarding Bimini to be sustained for so long when it was so easy to uncover?)

New Mystery: stone anchors. Why are there dozens of Phoenician-like stone anchors spead out over a one-mile long, underwater swath about a mile from the Bimini Road. Why are there five stone circles associated with the anchors?

Andros Platform (underwater stone formation) (2003)--solved: a breakwater (New mystery: who made it and when?)

Anguilla Arc (mystery dating to 1970s): probably breakwater.

Of course we found a lot of other intriguing things, but they remain ... well ... unsolved.

There is a lot more to do, more than my lifetime.

Greg
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« Reply #8 on: April 03, 2007, 03:11:26 am »

Hi Greg, thanks for the detailed response. I'm a but bummed that so many of the things reported in the Caribbean have turned out to be natutral. On the other hand, at least you have a result as opposed to not knowing. And it also shows your own sincerity about your own research.

Ray Brown wasn't convincing? Can you say in what way? I've also been reading about a guy named David Zink (?) who found a statue of some sort in the waters of the Bahamas, have you ever spoken to him?

A bit disappointed that Cay Sal turned out to be nothing more than piled sand. Are you sure?
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Desiree
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« Reply #9 on: April 03, 2007, 03:12:10 am »

Greg, you've probably seen this floating around the Internet. It's a list of Atlantic Ocean findings from the last 30 or so years. You've already mentioned the Bimini Wall and Ray Brown, how many of these other things have you checked into?


quote:
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RUINS

1. City on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean off Spain, found by Dr. Maxine Asher's expedition in 1973 and reported by UPI. Asher was Interviewed and evidence was Witnessed by Steve Omar, director of the M.I.N.D. International Research Agency, Maui, Hawaii.



2. Pyramid explored by Dr. Ray Brown on the sea floor off the Bahamas in 1970. Brown was accompanied by 4 divers who also found roads, domes, rectangular buildings, unidentified metallic instruments, and a statue holding a "mysterious" crystal containing miniature pyramids. The metal devices and crystals were taken to Florida for analysis at a university there. What was discovered was that the crystal amplified energy that passed through it. Brown interviewed by M.I.N.D.



3. Ruins of roads and buildings found off Bimini Island in the 1960's by the photographed and published expeditions of Dr. Mansan Valentine. Steven Forsberg, co-founder of the Lahaina Times newspaper dove into these ruins in 1982 to witness them first hand. Similar ruins were also photographed off Cay Sal in the Bahamas. The ruins are of the same construction as the oldest city ever found on land, according; to archaeologists, in Tiahuanaco, Bolivia, where a calendar was uncovered that shows the exact position of the stars and planets 27,000 years ago. This is more than 20,000 years BEFORE the oldest civilizations in school history books!



4. Similar underwater ruins found off Morocco and photographed 50 to 60 feet underwater.



5. Dr. David Zink found in 1957, off the Bahamas coast, a stylized marble head, building block cast in a mold and a construction piece drilled by a bit, as well as a stone column that he reported radiated energy. Forsberg of M.I.N.D. interviewed Dr. Zink and obtained the photographs.



6. A ruined harbor like complex discovered on the sea floor off Bimini by Captain John Alexander.



7. The deep sea diving submarine Aluminaut discovered a well preserved paved road on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean make of blacktop magnesium oxide, running along the sea floor from Florida to South Carolina.



8. Temple pillars, buildings, statues, wide curving boulevards with smaller avenues branching out like spokes in a wheel, majestic temples and pyramids videotaped by Captain Reyes Miraga on the Spanish named salvage ship "Talia" .



9. A huge 11 room pyramid found 10,000 feet under water in the mid Atlantic Ocean with a huge crystal top, as reported by Tony Benlk.



10. Several acres of white marble-like ruins found on tile ocean floor off Cuba reported by Lieceser Hemingway.



11. Mysterious dome structures reportedly seen in clear water by several pilots in the Straits of Florida.



12. Soviet expeditions to the Atlantic Ampere Seamount resulted in photographs of ruins destroyed by lava (like the Aztecs and Mayans wrote Atlan was destroyed by). This discovery was in the New York Times newspaper May 21, 1978. The photos were developed by the Academy's Petrovsky Marakuyev and reported by the deputy Director of the Soviet Academy of Science's Institute of Oceanography, Professor Aksyonove, who also reported ruins found off Cadiz, Spain in the same area as Dr. Maxine Asher's previous discovery.



13. 1981 expedition of P. Cappellano discovered mysterious ruins with strange symbols on them on the sea floor off the Canary Islands.




14. 1977 report of a huge pyramid found off Cay Sal in the Bahamas, photographed by Ari Marshall's expedition, about 150 feet underwater. The pyramid was about 650 feet high. Mysteriously, the surrounding water was lit by sparkling white water flowing out of the openings in the pyramid and surrounded by green water, instead of the black water everywhere else at that depth.



15. An urn brought to the surface by Dr. Asher's expedition.



16. The foundations of a 100 by 75 foot structure photographed on the sea bottom off Andros Island.



17. A sunken city about 400 miles off Portugal found by Soviet expeditions led by Boris Asturua, with buildings made of extremely strong concrete and plastics. He said "the remains of streets suggests the use of monorails for transportation". He added that he brought up a statue.



18. A six foot column or spire protruding from a double circular gear-like base embedded in the ocean floor, with peculiar light emanations from the bottom of the shaft showing up in photos taken by Dr. William Bell in 1958.



19. Pillars found on the Atlantic floor in 1969 by Robert Fero and Michael Grumley, a chunk of which was carved from rock NOT found anywhere in that part of the world.



20. A road off the Bahamas explored by Dr. Manson Valentine.



21. Dimitri Rebikoff, using his underwater platform and a special collecting lens, reported ruins found encircling an underwater freshwater spring.



22. Marble Acropolis underwater across five acres of fluted columns raised on pillars.



23. Heinrich Schilemann, the man who found and excavated the famous ruins of Troy {which historians thought was only a legend), reportedly left a written account of his discovery of a bronze vase with a metal unknown to scientists who examined it, in the famous Priam Treasure. Inside it are glyphs in Phoenician stating that it was from King Chronos of Atlantis! IDENTICAL pottery was found in Tiahuanaco, Bolivia.



24. Twenty researchers, including archaeologists, a marine biologist, geologist, and cartographer dove onto ruins on the sea floor off Bimini in 1975 and brought back artifacts from which they concluded that the walls and roads were made of materials not found in that part of the world.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/atlantida_mu/esp_atlantida_5.htm#discovery
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« Reply #10 on: April 03, 2007, 03:12:54 am »

Des:

Don't get bummed out, because the genuine finds there are quite intriguing. This field has had so many mysteries (detailed in a host of 1960' and 70's books) that it's about time they get solved. Solving the old ones led to new ones, new ones that have been documented.

There were three things about Cay Sal I mentioned. Cay Sal is huge. The alleged pyramids off NW Cay Sal: sand. The recent strange satellite image of an area inside the Cay Sal Bank was investigated by us three weeks ago. It is formed by sand and bottom grass.

But the Anguilla Arc located off NE Cay Sal, at the island of Anguilla appears to be a harbor with a breakwater. We have some samples in for testing now.

Regarding Ray Brown, I never met him. The various people I have talked to about him stated that he wasn't very convincing. I doubt the accuracy of the overall story. The Berry Islands have been thoroughly investigated. If a pyramid was there, as large as he stated it was, I think it would have been validated.

Asher did, indeed, find and film quite a bit on the bottom off Cadiz, Spain. Well-formed stone blocks as well as other blocks that look like modern concrete slabs. It may be the same area lots of others have "discovered" since then.

"Ruins of roads and buildings found off Bimini Island in the 1960's by the photographed and published expeditions of Dr. Mansan Valentine. "

The above refers to the Bimini Road as well as the marble and cement columns discovered there.

"Similar underwater ruins found off Morocco and photographed 50 to 60 feet underwater. "

The above may refer to an ancient harbor area.

5. Dr. David Zink found in 1957, off the Bahamas coast, a stylized marble head, building block cast in a mold and a construction piece drilled by a bit, as well as a stone column that he reported radiated energy."

The date of the above is screwy. Zink found the marble head near the Bimini Road in the late 1970s during ARE-sponsored expeditions.

"6. A ruined harbor like complex discovered on the sea floor off Bimini by Captain John Alexander. "

Again, this refers to the Bimini Road.

"7. The deep sea diving submarine Aluminaut discovered a well preserved paved road on the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean make of blacktop magnesium oxide, running along the sea floor from Florida to South Carolina. "

I've read a bit about the above. Probably a natural formation.

"8. Temple pillars, buildings, statues, wide curving boulevards with smaller avenues branching out like spokes in a wheel, majestic temples and pyramids videotaped by Captain Reyes Miraga on the Spanish named salvage ship "Talia" . "

Again around the Bimini Road, as well as Moselle Shoals north of Bimini. We took great video of wrecks and granite blocks at Moselle, but I haven't used the film yet.

"9. A huge 11 room pyramid found 10,000 feet under water in the mid Atlantic Ocean with a huge crystal top, as reported by Tony Benlk. "

I'm stumped. How would anyone know there were 11 rooms in a pyramid that was an astonishing 11,000 feet?

"10. Several acres of white marble-like ruins found on tile ocean floor off Cuba reported by Lieceser Hemingway. "

Hemmingway was theEditor of the Bimini newspaper and the brother of Earnest. He made this report after seeing white stuff in the water from a plane. It is assumed marble because it was white. We made a long and extensive aerial survey in the same areas, but not closer than 50 miles of Cuba. Didn't see it and I doubt that what he saw was precisely what he reported.

"11. Mysterious dome structures reportedly seen in clear water by several pilots in the Straits of Florida. "

That's true, Sand humps that come and go with storms and hurricanes.

"12. Soviet expeditions to the Atlantic Ampere Seamount resulted in photographs of ruins destroyed by lava (like the Aztecs and Mayans wrote Atlan was destroyed by). This discovery was in the New York Times newspaper May 21, 1978. The photos were developed by the Academy's Petrovsky Marakuyev and reported by the deputy Director of the Soviet Academy of Science's Institute of Oceanography, Professor Aksyonove, who also reported ruins found off Cadiz, Spain in the same area as Dr. Maxine Asher's previous discovery. "

The Soviets made a lot of reports in the 1970s that haven't panned out. But there's a lot of interesting stuff in the Mid-Atlantic Ridge. The Cadiz area does have stone blocks on the bottom.

"13. 1981 expedition of P. Cappellano discovered mysterious ruins with strange symbols on them on the sea floor off the Canary Islands. "

The Canaries have pyramids and Thor Heyerdahl's work showed that they did make some sort of carvings and engravings. I don't know about any underwater work there, but Andrew Collins suggested we do an expedition there.

"14. 1977 report of a huge pyramid found off Cay Sal in the Bahamas, photographed by Ari Marshall's expedition, about 150 feet underwater. The pyramid was about 650 feet high. Mysteriously, the surrounding water was lit by sparkling white water flowing out of the openings in the pyramid and surrounded by green water, instead of the black water everywhere else at that depth. "

Sand mounts and probably "whitings."

"15. An urn brought to the surface by Dr. Asher's expedition. "

The above is reliable.

"16. The foundations of a 100 by 75 foot structure photographed on the sea bottom off Andros Island. "

This refers to the Andros Temple first reported in 1968. In our 2003 book we discussed it thoroughly and visited it. It is still there along with many other similar structures. They are sponge pens. Valentine wrote several artiucles about it and unfortunately what he wrote in the popular press does not match what he wrote in scientific journals. It's a sponge pen, formed by piles of stones placed on the bottom. Sticks are then vertically stuck into the stones. A sponge pen is utilized to allow the tidal flows to wash out collected (dead) sponge.

"17. A sunken city about 400 miles off Portugal found by Soviet expeditions led by Boris Asturua, with buildings made of extremely strong concrete and plastics. He said "the remains of streets suggests the use of monorails for transportation". He added that he brought up a statue. "

I don't know anything about this.

"18. A six foot column or spire protruding from a double circular gear-like base embedded in the ocean floor, with peculiar light emanations from the bottom of the shaft showing up in photos taken by Dr. William Bell in 1958. "

No one else has ever found it despite great efforts made. It was found about 300 yards off S. Bimini. Based on the photos and descriptions, Bill Donato (and I) agree it's a ship mast.

"19. Pillars found on the Atlantic floor in 1969 by Robert Fero and Michael Grumley, a chunk of which was carved from rock NOT found anywhere in that part of the world. "

The above refers to the marble and cement columns found off Bimini near the Road site. The marble (and cement for that matter) do not come from the Americas. The idea that it's stone not found anywhere was a misinterpretation or gross exaggeration. The cement columns are still there. The 2 marble ones were taken.

"20. A road off the Bahamas explored by Dr. Manson Valentine. "

Refers to the Bimini Road. Strange, isn't it.

"21. Dimitri Rebikoff, using his underwater platform and a special collecting lens, reported ruins found encircling an underwater freshwater spring. "

There were several finds at Bimini this is referring to. Several stone formations, that we have not found--and we have looked for them--were formed by circular arrangements of stone. We did find 5 stone circles there, but none had springs that we could tell. There was also a land discovery in a mangrove swamp where someone had found a well and made a stone circle around it.

"22. Marble Acropolis underwater across five acres of fluted columns raised on pillars. "

Again, it's the Bimini Road and nearby finds of columns.

"23. Heinrich Schilemann, the man who found and excavated the famous ruins of Troy {which historians thought was only a legend), reportedly left a written account of his discovery of a bronze vase with a metal unknown to scientists who examined it, in the famous Priam Treasure. Inside it are glyphs in Phoenician stating that it was from King Chronos of Atlantis! IDENTICAL pottery was found in Tiahuanaco, Bolivia. "

I'm clueless about this.

"24. Twenty researchers, including archaeologists, a marine biologist, geologist, and cartographer dove onto ruins on the sea floor off Bimini in 1975 and brought back artifacts from which they concluded that the walls and roads were made of materials not found in that part of the world."

Again, it talks about the Bimini Road. The marble and cement are not from th Bahamas. Some of the stones had micrite in them, not a Bahamas variety.

I hope this helps. The skeptics have a field day with misinformation. What I find scientifically interesting is that the skeptics have themselves gone to the same lengths of misrepresentation, exaggeration, the making up of facts, and dubious science to discredit what is really there.

Greg
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« Reply #11 on: April 03, 2007, 03:14:07 am »

Hi Greg, thanks for answering my questions in such detail. I'm a bit disappointed that that giant 11 room pyramid in the middle of the Atlantic (9) never came to anything. Have you ever heard about this Tony Benik guy or know anything more about it? As for number 23, someone started a thread on it over in Atlantis and decided it was a hoax, too. A lot of hoaxes involved with this!

Here are somre more findings from another thread I wonder if you might know something about, some have already been talked about:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
ANCIENT FOUNDINGS
Did Atlantis exist in the Atlantic Ocean?

We summarize our arguements, referring the most important findings about Atlantis. The evidences was drawn up by the Museum of Atlantis.

1. At the bottom of the Atlantic Ocean was found basalt glassy lava of a mainland and not undersea volcano.
2. In 1898 special machinery brought into the surface of the Atlantic Ocean from 2800 m depth, a rock island 15000 years old which came from a mainland volcano.
3. In the summer of 1927, a crystal cranium from quartz with a movable jaw was found in the jungle of the British Honduran (Central America)!
4. In 1977, with echo sounding machinery, a pyramid was localized in depth of 300 m near the triangle of Vermuda.
5. In Bimini islands which are in the Bahamas islands were found (in 1969) sunk large stones squared or rectangulared of 600 square metres extend similar to those which were found by professor Jacques Cousteau in the small island Dias of Krete (in 1976).
6. In a mountain of Perou in Piscos Bay a very ancient trident (Atlant's symbol) is displayed which is made of white stones with phosphoric brightness "stabbed" in the slope. It has 250 m length and sides of 3,8 m width. This trident leads to a marked airport shaped flat space in Nasca plain which is located 160 km from Pisco. Wide airstrips and radiated corridors are discerned which stand out because they shine. They are formed by rack fragments. When you see this space from above it gives you the impression of an airport with geometrical lines and signs like in the modern airfields.
7. The gravestone with a carved pilot which was found in Palenkoue, near the temple of the Atlants of Mexico
8. The undersea ruins which were found through Soviet research with head the academic Accenof near Madera and the 9500 years smoothed marble stone which was drawn up by the Rusians from the undersea central Atlantic slope (mountain rage)
9. Some very ancient buildings of America belong to this technique of the most ancient buildings of Europe and North Africa as well as many architectural decorative shapes which are similar to both civilizations.
10. Geologists admit that between the Big and the Small Antilles there was land, which was sunk. Furthermore, that the Azores islands and in their extend Madera and the Canary islands are emerged summits of a big undersea volcano mountain range where often happen earthquakes and explosions.

General conclusions

All these foundings show that the large continent of Atlantis was surrounded by the Atlantic Ocean. Its geographical extend approach more to the Central America, the Big and the Small Antilles and the Bahamas, included the space of the Atlantic Ocean up to the Sargassai Sea, expanded normally up to Bermuda and an oblong extend of it reached as far as to the Azores. It was also surrounded by many small islands (sea maps of Atlantis).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.atlantida.gr/engArxaiaEbrimata.htm
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« Reply #12 on: April 03, 2007, 03:14:44 am »

Greg, did you ever here anything more on the Scott Stone? The last report on them seems to be from four years ago:


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Press releases - November 3m 2002 - Dateline: Miami, Florida - Update on the Scott Stones Research:

The Scott Stones Explorers and Research Team is happy to finally reveal, to the public, thrilling news concerning the long-sought, and much-famed Hall of Records.

The members of the Team say that now with the National Geographic Society having joined hands with Dr. Hawass, the A.R.E. having pitched in its lot with the promoters of witchcraft, and one particular notable (with the help of his friends) apparently about to announce the 3real2 location of Ancient Atlantis the truth can finally be told. The Team says that the lines of decision have now been drawn, more clearly than ever; and the entire lot of big-shots have shown themselves to be completely and utterly confused.

By May of 1998, the Scott Stones Explorers and Research Team had announced, in no uncertain terms, that the Legendary Atlantis described by Sais, Solon, and Plato had been unequivocally identified. Then, in December of 1998, the Team announced that the Hidden Entrance to the famed Hall of Records had Actually Been Located! The Team now reports that this almost universally ignored entrance announcement, which was made nearly four years ago (see the 21 DECEMBER 1998 press release) was the Epitome of Understatements; since, by the time this announcement was issued, the Hall of Records, Itself, Had Already Been Opened and its Precious Records Already Recovered!

Not only, say the Team, were the actual, long-sought records from Atlantis actually Discovered and Recovered by 1998; but, fortuitously, By the Final Week of December 2001, this Entire Collection of ancient records had been completely translated from beginning to end!

To get some perspective on this complicated matter, they say, we need to draw an analogy. They direct our attention to the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls, saying: When the Dead Sea Scrolls were discovered, it was a long time before the general public was allowed to actually view the finds. Those who had possession of the records wanted to see what the records had to say, before they released them to the public. Well, it was no different with the newly discovered records of Atlantis! The finders, first, wanted to see what the records actually had to say. And, according to the Team, even if they had shown these records to the public, no one could have read them!

The Team previously revealed that the ultimate decipherment of this entire set of ancient records only became possible through the inspired insights and masterful research, delivered over the years, by Professor Scott; with the final important breakthroughs not coming until October of 2001 when, suddenly, they finally and unexpectedly broke open the last lock and deciphered, what turned out to be, an ancient Atlantean account of the Shifting of the Poles, which occurred near the end of the last Ice Age!

The Team relates that the guidance, which Professor Scott provided through his research and teachings, afforded the original keys to unlock the Thirty-Two Precious Tablets (see 04 AUGUST 2000 press release) and provided them with the necessary tools to finally decipher the hidden significance of the Ancient Maps (see the 14 JULY 2001 press release), which were discovered within the 3Hall of Records.2

The Team says the data that was derived from their work, during 2001 now makes it possible to dive directly onto the most important locations of the famous Isle of Poseidon.

As the Team reported, in July of 2001; the very location of the capitol of the Isle of Poseidon (the Ringed City of Poseidia) had been accurately determined through the decipherment of data contained in several, precious, Atlantean Maps. Another location, they say, that is of extreme interest to them, is the City of Alta; where the records of the Empire were once held. Alta, according to the researchers, could well prove to be a far greater prize in mankind1s overall understanding of the development of civilization. For this reason, they say that verifying the exact location of Alta now stands as one of their top priorities!

Setting up expeditions, say the explorers, is our next major goal. We've pretty much just taken a rest from the work, during the past ten months. We are anxious to begin organizing the coming dives. Refining the translation of the records that have been recovered although an extremely important aspect of this research will most likely be put on a back burner for the present; and could remain a secondary concern for quite some time; should we be fortunate enough to score additional, and perhaps, more elaborate records from Alta, the major Records City itself.

The Team reports that, in one respect, it has been somewhat disappointed! They say that things might have proceeded in a different and much more productive manner; explaining that, in their view, tens of thousands of people could have been going to work on refining the translation of these already opened records. Nonetheless, they sigh, in the most resolute of manners; None of these records will be released none of them until someone either confirms our work or someone shows a sincere desire to help us in our expeditions to obtain the needed photographs and scientific proof from the main city of Poseidia.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.crystalinks.com/scottstones2.html
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« Reply #13 on: April 03, 2007, 03:15:26 am »

Des:

First, the so-called Scott Stones...hmm.

Andrew Collins went to see him and was more than disappointed.

Richard Wingate's 1971 book, Lost Outpost of Atlantis, probably discussed and depicted the same thing (in photos). There is a "modern" breakwater in Miami that has stones on it that came from Bimini in 1926. A hurricane hit Miami in 1926, causing damage. So US barges went to Bimini where they dredged up many large blocks transporting them to Miami to repair the damage. Many of the stones have holes drilled in them, and on one side a "star-like" pattern is found around the hole. Wingate surmised that some advanced form of drilling was used. (It is a debated point, even among believers. Modern drilling produces the same effect.) I and others assume that the Scott Stones are the same thing as the stones Wingate found... Wingate's book is not well-known.

As to the discovery of the center city and the Hall of Records, it is quite improbable. Since they claim to have obtained and translated the entire contents of the Hall of Records in 2001, where is the translation, photos, and other proofs?

The last paragraph of their press release says it all. If they have tablets, artifacts, and any sort of proof at all they can put forward, I could essentially guarantee enough financing for what they seem to want. Show one tablet, one artifacts, even a photo. Are they saying they went to Giza or somewhere else without a single camera? Not one photo? Since they recovered the materials in the Hall, are they saying that no one has been able to take a single photo since then? Did they discover the Center City and forget to have a camera or a video? When Andrew Collins visited Scott he could have gotten them the attention they needed, if they had showed him anything. But he was shown nothing whatsoever. The affair was a major imposition on Andrew.

As I related in the November article I put out on Bimini, I understand and agree with the science assertion that "extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof." That's why we have photographed, filmed, and taken the gps on every site and place we have visited. That's why we have presented detailed articles and many supporting photos and video. We've given all serious researchers anything they asked for. Our goal has been to get to the truth about such things. That's why we don't like to mention Atlantis when we talk about the Bimini research. What is there is a breakwater that seems to have been used circa 3000-4000 BC. Ditto with Andros and Cay Sal. It doesn't match Cayce's Atlantis dates or Plato's. It is...what it is.

In reference to the statement that ARE witchcraft was involved at Giza, it's more than laughable. Florida State University has an endowed Chair in archaeology named after Joe Schorr. Schorr and Joe Jahoda, both of whom are ARE members, had gpr (ground penetrating radar) done in front of the Sphinx. After an anomalous cavity was found, a drop camera was inserted into it. There is a "cave-like" tunnel there that makes a 90 degree turn, moving under the Sphinx. That occurred in the late 1990s.

Since then, more gpr has been done at Giza in that specific area, that's it.

In his new book (to be released in July 06), Andrew Collins does reveal a possible entrance point to this tunnel system. This "opening" does exist, but access to it is more than limited.

Without something to support their claims--a photo or artifact--one has to be a bit skeptical about the claims being made by the Scott "group".

Greg
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« Reply #14 on: April 03, 2007, 03:16:01 am »

Let me correct one error I made. Andrew Collins went to Florida to meet with DuVal.

Greg
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