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What if there were no Heaven..?

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Anassa
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Posts: 55



« Reply #15 on: May 18, 2008, 09:43:13 am »


Hi guys. I hope you don't mind me butting in. I know I haven't posted in quite a while but I try to keep track of the discussions, and Dawn (bless her) contacts me occasionally to see if I'm still alive Smiley
I used to really love the discussions on the forum and on AR and jumping in if and when I thought I had a bright idea.  Seems like a long time ago when I was enthusiastic about how everything worked in the universe, why we are here, what happens when we die etc.
In the last few years I found myself no longer interested in such things as whether Jesus was real or not. It didn’t seem to matter. Only the message was important somehow.
So for the past couple of years each time I have wanted to participate, something stopped me. I felt I really had nothing of interest to impart. In fact I found myself in a process of dropping things rather than taking them up.
Every time I came across what I thought was a new insight or way forward, shortly thereafter I was forced to drop it. Each time I thought I had a handle on the so-called spiritual path, I was rudely awakened to the fact, that I didn’t, and I am grateful for that.
For the ultimate slap in the face, every ‘spiritual seeker’ should be made to read “Cutting Through Spiritual Materialism” by Chögyam Trungpa Smiley
Even before reading this book, I had thankfully stopped sharing what I was reading with my close friends, not because I don’t want to share, but because the urge not to was stronger. I was probably boring them to tears anyway Smiley
But there was a feeling somehow that I should not assume they needed to take up the ‘spiritual path’ to make their lives better or to solve their problems, no matter how much I wanted to help them in their pain.
They say if wisdom does not lead you to seek God, pain will.
I have a friend who, although she believes in God in a strictly religious (occasional) sense, lives a life bouncing between joy and pain. She is not interested in a spiritual path. Her “God-self” has chosen this way forward, and despite the pain and confusion she endures in her life, at least she is ‘living’ it fully and I am obliged to leave her alone unless she asks.
Another friend who doesn’t believe in God has this amazing philosophy on life: “I have a problem. I can’t solve it right now. I’m going for a pint”.
I admire both of these souls tremendously, and only last week came across this online book, which seems to bear out the notion that being on a ‘spiritual path’, in the sense it is known nowadays, is a meaningless concept.
When I was starting out I developed an aversion to the word ‘God’, and preferred to use such words as Universe, Divinity etc. Lately I have developed the same aversion to the word ‘spiritual’, and if someone asked me tomorrow if I think God is an old man with a long white beard, I would probably say: “Yes…why not?
Anyway here is the passage I wanted to share that resonated with my current thinking, although I can’t guarantee that I won’t change my thinking again by tomorrow 

“Giving others the freedom to be stupid is one of the most important and hardest steps to take in spiritual progress. Conveniently the opportunity to take that step is all around us every day.
No matter how confused or stupid or unloving other persons may appear to us, we have no right ever to assume that their consciousness is on a lower level than ours. They may be realizing far deeper dimensions of love. The way we see them is an explicit measure of our own vibration level.
The state of mind that most needs enlightenment is the one that sees human beings as needing to be guided or enlightened.
There is absolutely no external evidence that will tell me how much you love yourself, because I am seeing you with the limited vision of my own vibrations. In that sense, what I see is myself.
If we always stand facing the higher light, like looking into the sun, our vision of the people around us will be distorted. But if we have the light coming over our shoulders, shining through us, we will see the beauty of others, we will be open to the light coming through all forms, and know the glory of the creation.”

http://freespace.virgin.net/sarah.peter.nelson/lazyman/lazyman.html#contents

I know this thread is about the idea of heaven and initially it was a quote in the linked book that prompted me to post because I think it sums it up. The spiel above is by way of explanation of my long absence, and as usual rambled a bit Smiley

“When you learn to love hell, you will be in heaven.”
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It was a bright cold day in December and the clocks were striking thirteen.
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