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the Nature of God

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Aphrodite
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« Reply #45 on: December 15, 2007, 11:59:00 pm »

bluducky

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   posted 12-06-2004 06:35 AM                       
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My dear Absonite, my 'Stuff' as you call it, is more palatable, as it has more support for it.
I personally desire that you would answer to Oscar's pointed post about the Urantia Papers (located in the God Gene thread) BEFORE you attempt to indoctrinate everybody with them.

Everything must be weighed and measured in the light of fact, now is the time for the Papers to undergo this process, and I'm afraid that they might not come out supreme.



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« Reply #46 on: December 15, 2007, 11:59:20 pm »

via mars 2
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they will when we run out of toilet paper. 
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« Reply #47 on: December 15, 2007, 11:59:45 pm »

Absonite

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  posted 12-06-2004 07:19 AM                       
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ducky,
what exactly from oscar do you wish for me to respond to. I find his stuff mainly disjointed rambling. I don't bother too much with it or his opinions.
The material i have posted is self-evident regarding supremacy to previous available revelation. Some people can't see it. What has that to do with truth?
Many people couldn't see the christ. What has that to do with truth?
I don't want to get into a long discussion here about all this, I've posted enough for any normal person to discern quality of material. There is nothing more I can do. A pint can't hold a quart. Everyone has to go at their own speed, you can't force enlightenment. We are where we are at the time. Who knows what will happen tomorrow and at what rate anyone will progress spiritually. If the bible is all you can handle for now so be it. You have lots of company. It's a big cult and has room for many more.The price for entry is cheap.

Here's what Jesus has to say about the whole thing so the choice is an individual one for each person. It has nothing to do with truth or opinion.


"155:5.8 Until the races become highly intelligent and more fully civilized, there will persist many of those childlike and superstitious ceremonies which are so characteristic of the evolutionary religious practices of primitive and backward peoples. Until the human race progresses to the level of a higher and more general recognition of the realities of spiritual experience, large numbers of men and women will continue to show a personal preference for those religions of authorityĘ which require only intellectual assent, in contrast to the religion of the spirit, which entails active participation of mind and soul in the faith adventure of grappling with the rigorous realities of progressive human experience.

155:5.9 The acceptance of the traditional Ęreligions of authorityĘ presents the easy way out for man's urge to seek satisfaction for the longings of his spiritual nature. The settled, crystallized, and established Ęreligions of authorityĘ afford a ready refuge to which the distracted and distraught soul of man may flee when harassed by fear and tormented by uncertainty. Such a religion requires of its devotees, as the price to be paid for its satisfactions and assurances, only a passive and purely intellectual assent.

155:5.10 And for a long time there will live on earth those timid, fearful, and hesitant individuals who will prefer thus to secure their religious consolations, even though, in so casting their lot with the Ęreligions of authorityĘ, they compromise the sovereignty of personality, debase the dignity of self-respect, and utterly surrender the right to participate in that most thrilling and inspiring of all possible human experiences: the personal quest for truth, the exhilaration of facing the perils of intellectual discovery, the determination to explore the realities of personal religious experience, the supreme satisfaction of experiencing the personal triumph of the actual realization of the victory of spiritual faith over intellectual doubt as it is honestly won in the supreme adventure of all human existence -- man seeking God, for himself and as himself, and finding him.

155:5.11 The religion of the spirit means effort, struggle, conflict, faith, determination, love, loyalty, and progress. The religion of the mind -- the theology of authority -- requires little or none of these exertions from its formal believers. Tradition is a safe refuge and an easy path for those fearful and halfhearted souls who instinctively shun the spirit struggles and mental uncertainties associated with those faith voyages of daring adventure out upon the high seas of unexplored truth in search for the farther shores of spiritual realities as they may be discovered by the progressive human mind and experienced by the evolving human soul."

 
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« Reply #48 on: December 16, 2007, 12:00:52 am »

Fun to read this again!
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ILLIGITIMI NON CARBORUNDUM

Thus ye may find in thy mental and spiritual self, ye can make thyself just as happy or just as miserable as ye like. How miserable do ye want to be?......For you GROW to heaven, you don't GO to heaven. It is within thine own conscience that ye grow there.

Edgar Cayce
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« Reply #49 on: December 16, 2007, 12:01:26 am »

 
bluducky

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   posted 12-06-2004 05:34 PM                      
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Absonite, a few things courtesy of Oscar.

quote:
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the Bible have thousands of copies and many places existing only in its documents (as well as characters and history) were discovered later on by the archeologists' shovel in spite of criticism. Urantia book was psicographed by a seraph? It may have some truth but is just like believing too much in apocrypha manuscripts when the specialist themselves admit they have so much litter in them!

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Is this true?

yes or no.


quote:
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 http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0879759550/ref=ase_truthbeknownfounA/002-9322717-6400068
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check that out.

Link,


quote:
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First published in 1955, the Urantia Book, a 2097-page tome hailed by its advocates as the channeled wisdom of celestial beings, posits one infinite God, the great I AM, and billions of lesser gods. It contains pronouncements on evolution, cosmology, physics and quantum mechanics, which Gardner (The New Age: Notes of a Fringe Watcher) finds deeply flawed, and it includes a biography of Jesus that asserts he toured Rome and Greece at ages 28 and 29, becoming an adept of Greek philosophy, mathematics and art. The Urantia cult was founded by two former Seventh-day Adventists?Chicago psychiatrist William Sadler (1875-1969) and his brother-in-law, Wilfred Kellogg (1876-1956), a businessman. In this intriguing expose, Gardner, former Scientific American mathematics columnist, makes a strong case that the Urantia Book is filled with plagiarized passages from other cult books. He also charts bitter schisms among the Urantians and looks at other Adventist splinter groups, notably David Koresh's Branch Davidian cult consumed by flames near Waco, Tex.
Copyright 1995 Reed Business Information, Inc.

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Is THIS true?

yes or no?


quote:
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http://skepdic.com/urantia.html
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what about this?

yes, or no?

(note: that last link has a few things with which I agree, I will not throw the baby out with the bathwater)

Oscar,


quote:
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Now, if you re-read the first page you'll see Absonite maybe has a mind disorder. He first apologyzes due to his lack of words and communicative skills offends without wanting it to do so (in spite of the fact he says he literally studied thousands of books), then he uses his right to disagree with others and be skeptical but we have to exercise our faith in his source just because he says it so and doesn't allow us to be skeptical as he is, otherwise we are swine not "deserving" the pearls he has to offer. He suggests that if we don't believe in him is a waste of HIS very short available time, not ours! Can you believe this?

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Now this is very interesting indeed! Is this true, Absonite? do you really believe that, and were you truly acting in such a pious, holier-than-thou way?

We shall start with those..

NOTE: Answer the question with a simple Yes or No. With the truth, there is no middle road, Jesus himself said "Let your yes be yes, and your no, no" did he not?



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« Reply #50 on: December 16, 2007, 12:03:00 am »

Yes, everyone was at their "best" in these early threads, I feel.

It's a shame that we can't just transport the whole thread from the AR server to here, it would be a lot less work.  Angry
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« Reply #51 on: December 16, 2007, 12:03:28 am »

Dawn Moline

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   posted 12-06-2004 10:45 PM                       
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First off, I don't think we should be impugning anyone's particular faith here. It certainly wasn't my intention to impugn anyone's faith when I started this thread. Simply because the Urantia Book might have channeled information does not disqualify it as a valid source for religious study. Who knows how the Bible was originally set to paper? Would it be any less if we were told that many of the books were recited by God His (Her) self? According to some sources, it was. As for the accounts written in the book being plagiarized, well, one could say the same about the same accounts in the Bible: the flood story for instance, which has already been pointed out as a tale of possible Mesopotamian origin. It may be said that "plagiarized" is thr wrong word for such a thing. Truth is truth where and however we find it, right?
Absonite,

I sense some disappointment in you about my own personal beliefs. Well, they aren't Bluducky's, they are mine. I happened to arrive at my own beliefs independently, through my own observations of the world. Are they correct? Well, who knows what is correct? Is it that important that each of us be on the correct path? I don't think it is, the path that might be correct for you might not be correct for me. I certainly admire your faith in that material, but I cannot see the hand of a perfect god at work in any of this, and any attempts to explain God as perfect always fall short if you ask me.

Calvin,

With all due respect, each time you post something it tells me a little more about your true beliefs, whether that be intended or not. You may label me as a "pagan" all you wish, but that only shows a personal bias on your part towards any beliefs that don't happen to be yours, and certainly don't reflect an openmind.


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« Reply #52 on: December 16, 2007, 12:03:47 am »

Absonite

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  posted 12-06-2004 10:45 PM                       
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Ducky,
if i were to play your stupid silly game i would be as crazy as you and oscar. it's very difficult for me to imagine an intelligent sane person even asking the questions you and oscar have. With what you think is important it shows me that you are even more nuts than i thought you were b4. You fooled me in beginning, but water has a mysterious way of seeking it's own level. Stick with Dawn, ducky you have a lot to teach her and a willing pupil. Your time would be wasted on me and the urantia papers just simply won't measure up to your standards of excellence. I think you can see that from what I have previously posted.

 
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« Reply #53 on: December 16, 2007, 12:04:10 am »

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   posted 12-06-2004 10:55 PM                       
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There's too much argument going on in this thread about a topic that most of us will probably never completely understand. Wouldn't the best answer to the question be that God lies in ourselves and simply leave it at that?
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« Reply #54 on: December 16, 2007, 12:04:35 am »

Absonite

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  posted 12-06-2004 11:54 PM                       
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Archangel,
I think we were discussing the Nature of God, apparently it got waylayed. Besides some don't even believe there is a God and some don't believe that he resides inside and some believe he hangs out in a physical organ. So, I don't think it can be as simple as you are imagining even though you are correct.   Smiley
 
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« Reply #55 on: December 16, 2007, 12:05:00 am »

Andrew Waters

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  posted 12-07-2004 01:51 AM                       
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quote:
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It is a mass of contradictions to even suggest that God is perfect, considering the evidence
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Continue talking Dawn. You're headed in the right direction.

Eventually someone here will make an attempt, albeit futile, to reconcile your penetrating idea with their unrelenting mysticism of God and his ways to somehow diffuse your argument. Simply stated, it can't be done.

Throw ''free will'' into your next argument and see what develops as a response to that.

While you're at it insert evil and it's origins, and the profound implications it conjures up, into the fray and then take careful note of the metaphysical explanations that are sure to follow.

In the process you will note how protective and defensive some here will become in the face of undeniable evidence that attests to the very ''human-like'' attributes that were bestowed upon us as a species—from the creators...he and she.

So, Jennie Mcgrath, there is no need to feel left out of the mix. Surely your aliens and my extraterrestrials are one and the same. Ockham's razor dictates that it is so.




 
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« Reply #56 on: December 16, 2007, 12:05:21 am »

iwannano
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To quote John (Lennon) "Imagine there is no Heaven".
If you stop using the bible as a source "God" is hard to find. Gods are all over the place but only one deity is not. Suppose god and religion are just a construct of man. Be it a very smart man or very corrupt man, civilization may not have survived without it creation. When man stopped being a group of roving tribes and became a community of all there needed to be laws with penalties beyond what they could see. It is easy to see how religion came to be but I fear in the process it has also stifled curiosity. How many times have we all heard in response to why something is, "its God's will". Imagine there is no god, that the universe always was and always will be(in some fashion) and that we are just an evolutionary byproduct of its existence. I don't need a god to feel special or to love those around me and I am comfortable enough with my existence to be happy as a byproduct of the universe. Who or what created the universe doesn't bother me. I am good with it "always was and always will be".
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« Reply #57 on: December 16, 2007, 12:05:42 am »

via mars 2
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chaos is very important. it's what lends to order. some may construe chaos as disorder when in fact it is completely normal.
now, is god perfect? whatever god is, yes, in a chaotic way.

we are animals with puny minds and large hearts, easily swayed. we can kill other humans to advance the comfort of our own lives. we can drive endlessly, not thinking of the ramifications of oil - or not even care. we can buttress our security on the lives of lessers, and think nothing of it.
we are rats in a cage, knawing at each others testicles.
 
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« Reply #58 on: December 16, 2007, 12:06:04 am »

iwannano
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Rate Member   posted 12-07-2004 08:42 AM                       
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Spiritwalker pleaseee!!
Why do "we suck" because we question. If your god exists he made us to question so by doing so we are doing what we were created for.

I don't believe in god but I will defend your right to do so. The human race would not be a disappointment to god, some individuals maybe, but as a whole "she" would be proud.
 
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« Reply #59 on: December 16, 2007, 12:06:28 am »

iwannano
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Rate Member   posted 12-07-2004 10:05 AM                       
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forgive me
I actually have a pretty good sense of humor. I have gotten defensive lately about being blamed for all the worlds troubles(as a conservative agnostic American white man). Yes it is possible to be agnostic and conservative. Even though I don't believe in god I do cherish life, mine and others.
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