The Meaning of Existence (Original)

[Sun Goddess]

Europa

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   posted 09-12-2005 01:25 AM                       
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Those who actually think they know the true meaning of existence are deceiving themselves. As for each of us, I think the meaning is to find what makes the most sense to each of us while we're here.

I think that each of us, in our own way, wants to make their mark on the world, something that will last beyond us, which is why so many people have children.
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Posts: 424 | From: Illinois | Registered: Jul 2005

[Sun Goddess]

Pagan

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   posted 09-18-2005 08:37 PM                       
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For instance, the Aztecs worshipped a war god called Huitzilopochtli, who took on the likeness of the sun over time. It was thought that in order to insure the sun's arrival each day, a steady supply of human hearts had to be offered in holy sacrifice (Hogg:43).
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Gee, weren't those Aztecs cool?

Somebody should also start a thread on how many grisly ways people killed one another in the ancient world! I'd do it, but again, I don't like starting threads of my own. I just like to give my opinion on everyone else's ideas!

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[Sun Goddess]

Jade Hellene

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   posted 09-19-2005 09:45 PM                       
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I would say that the meaning of existence would be to redress wrong wherever we see it. For if we do not do it ourselves, than who will..?

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Sort through the media disinformation:
http://mediamatters.org/

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[Sun Goddess]

Dawn Moline

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   posted 09-21-2005 10:34 PM                       
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My own meaning has been reduced to this: do the best you can with what life has dealt you, help others wherever you can, and try to keep busy as much as possible so I tend not to dwell too much on the hurt.

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"The unexamined life is one not worth leading."
-Plato

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Posts: 446 | From: citizen of the world | Registered: Oct 2004 

[Sun Goddess]

Dawn Moline

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   posted 10-24-2005 11:47 PM                       
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And yet, my meaning is clear. Every human being must have a purpose, for if we do not, we wither and die.

And then, I think of this, for every hurt that any of us have ever felt, there is someone that also felt that hurt before. None of us is unique and each of us is more interconnected than we can ever know, nor care to admit.

And that is why, when I see others try to hurt me, I bear them no ill will, because I know that something must have hurt them, too. The pain can be bad, true, but how much worse would it be if we did not feel? The pain tells us we are still alive, and, once we overcome it, that we will endure - maybe not always in this shape and form, but another. No sad stories here, each of us does what we can, and we endure, best as we can.

Each person has his or her time on this earth, and then withers and dies. But if we are truly all a part of the same human spirit, then each of us truly is, immortal.

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"The unexamined life is one not worth leading."
-Plato

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Posts: 446 | From: citizen of the world | Registered: Oct 2004

[Sun Goddess]

Psycho

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  posted 11-17-2005 03:03 PM                       
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Area Baby Doesn't Have Any Friends
November 16, 2005

TARRYTOWN, NY—Although he's had nearly three months to meet people, local baby Joshua Goldsworthy hasn't made a single friend, according to those who know him.

Friendless baby Joshua Goldsworthy spends another night alone.

People who have met the quiet, stay-at-home misfit say that, while he's more interesting than he was two months ago, Joshua lacks the warmth, charisma, and empathy of a suitable companion.

"It's not like I hate him—I just don't get a lot out of knowing him," said 32-year-old Gretchen Sperber, a longtime friend of the Goldsworthy family. "He's hard to read. Sometimes he'll stare at you for hours, other times he'll fall asleep right in front of you, like you're not even there."

As Bonnie and Jason Goldsworthy's first child, Joshua is predictably adored and indulged. With a toy-filled nursery, a favorite blanket, and a parent, aunt, or grandparent always close at hand, the blond, apple-cheeked little boy unquestionably receives adequate love and comfort. However, most psychologists agree that familial love cannot replace friendships with one's peers.

Visitors to the Goldsworthy home often report having negative first impressions of Joshua. Out-of-the-blue crying fits, the tendency to yank at loose hair and earrings, and copious drooling are just a few of the antisocial traits he displays. Neighbor Lena Osterberg said that, two weeks ago, she cut a visit to the Goldsworthy home short after the self-interested infant committed a "gross" indiscretion.

"I still can't imagine why he didn't excuse himself and crawl into another room," Osterberg said. "The stench filled the living room, and he just sat there and grinned."

Another acquaintance, who asked not to be identified, described Joshua's head as "bulbous" and "disproportionate," and said the baby has "pudgy, triple-creased legs."

"May God forgive me, I know it's a sin to judge people on the basis of their appearance," the anonymous source said. "But he's like a monster. If you blew him up to normal size, people would scream in horror."

Although he responds to his doting parents, Joshua often alienates those outside of his family circle, according to his pediatrician, Dr. Martin Prushow.

"He seems to take interest only in people who are willing to nurture or 'mother' him," Prushow said. "Once in a while, you can coax a smile out of him, but only if you make a smiling face yourself. He's not a terrible person, but as far as actual depth, nothing."

Among non-relatives, perhaps the most acquainted with Joshua is 16-year-old babysitter Ashley Steinhoff. Though she meets with Joshua as many as three times a week, Steinhoff was quick to distance herself from the baby.

"'Babysitter' sure, but I wouldn't say 'friend,'" Steinhoff said. "I mean, it's not like I hang out with him for free. With my actual friends, I do things just for fun, and have full-sentence conversations—not change their diapers."

Steinhoff did not rule out the possibility of a future friendship, but said that Joshua would have to "quit being a baby first."

Although it is more than eight months away, family friends are already concocting excuses to skip "Baby No-Friends'" first birthday party.

"I can already predict what will happen," Sperber said. "He'll smear cake all over himself, throw a tantrum when someone puts a party hat on him, and scarcely acknowledge his presents other than to gnaw on them. I've seen how this kid operates."
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[Sun Goddess]

Allison
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   posted 11-17-2005 07:07 PM                       
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quote:
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Originally posted by Jade Hellene:
Rather than concentrate on why the human race is here, Dawn, as each of us is apt to do from time to time, I believe we are each better off concentrating on our own individual purpose in life.
In other words, there is no one purpose for the human race. Each of us must find our own unique purpose and it is in that where we are each made whole.
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BINGO! That is exactly what I think too. I also think that understanding one's purpose is what defines our work too. And exactly WHERE does one find one's purpose, you all may ask? Well, inside oneself, of course. Everything is there. All that we need to know, it just has to be drawn out of our subconscious and processed.
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Posts: 637 | Registered: Jun 2005 

[Sun Goddess]

Allison
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   posted 11-17-2005 07:11 PM                       
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quote:
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Originally posted by Europa:
Those who actually think they know the true meaning of existence are deceiving themselves. As for each of us, I think the meaning is to find what makes the most sense to each of us while we're here.
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First sentence I disagree because you actually contradicted it with the second sentence. I do agree that it is different for each of us and we each must find our own "sense".
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Posts: 637 | Registered: Jun 2005

[Sun Goddess]

Allison
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   posted 11-17-2005 07:13 PM                       
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dammit, I double posted, sorry.......

[ 11-17-2005, 07:14 PM: Message edited by: Allison ]
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Posts: 637 | Registered: Jun 2005 

[Sun Goddess]

Aristotle

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   posted 11-19-2005 09:57 PM                       
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quote:
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Area Baby Doesn't Have Any Friends
November 16, 2005
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"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."
- Aristotle

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Posts: 357 | From: ancient Athens | Registered: Nov 2004

[Sun Goddess]

Aristotle

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   posted 11-19-2005 10:42 PM                       
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Originally posted by Allison:

quote:
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Originally posted by Jade Hellene:
Rather than concentrate on why the human race is here, Dawn, as each of us is apt to do from time to time, I believe we are each better off concentrating on our own individual purpose in life.
In other words, there is no one purpose for the human race. Each of us must find our own unique purpose and it is in that where we are each made whole.
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BINGO! That is exactly what I think too. I also think that understanding one's purpose is what defines our work too. And exactly WHERE does one find one's purpose, you all may ask? Well, inside oneself, of course. Everything is there. All that we need to know, it just has to be drawn out of our subconscious and processed.
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Allison, I know you and Jade were both making a larger point, but I, for one, don't believe that a person's work has anything to do with their purpose. If either of you are lucky enough to be employed doing something you truly believe in, I'm happy for you. Most of the people I know of these days simply do what they must do just to get by. Sad but true.

How do I measure a person's purpose and worth then? Well, what seems to be in their hearts and souls. I see poets, writers and artists in people who are working in fields in anything other than what they originally intended to be in. We like to think that we are in control of our own lives, and in many respects, we are. Too often, thogh, many people fall into the trap of reacting to what happens in their lives instead of controlling them, though.

So, maybe in the end, it is not so much what people do that define us but what we tried to do that matters the most - in my opinion, at least.

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"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it."
- Aristotle

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Posts: 357 | From: ancient Athens | Registered: Nov 2004 

[Sun Goddess]

unknown

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   posted 11-20-2005 01:21 PM                       
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I found this interesting essay on the meaning of life


http://users.aristotle.net/~diogenes/sowhat.htm

So What?
We have been given the freedom to create the reality we experience because we are supposed to learn from it.
Life is a school. We are in a protected environment. This reality is a metaphor for larger realities in which we are to eventually take part. While what we do here does not have permanent consequences, it is vital for our learning that we take it somewhat seriously. Just as school work requires serious effort but isn't supposed to be performed perfectly, we are expected to make mistakes as we try to create the world from the model that we see dimly in our minds. The mistakes we make in life, the cruel and thoughtless things we do, are really the foibles of children. Your errors do not weight eternally against your soul, and they are not put on your permanent record. Their only purpose is to teach you to improve.

Feeling guilty is worthless unless it compels you to correct the error that you have committed and reminds you to not make the same mistake again in the future. Those are the only purposes of guilt. Guilt is not to be used to berate yourself uselessly after you have done all you can do to compensate for your action. Remember, the people you hurt chose to experience that reality, although they are not usually aware of that fact.


What are we supposed to be learning as individuals?
When it comes to individuals, there are as many purposes as there are people in the world. While you may be part of larger groups and ultimately part of the entire human race and part of life on this planet, you chose this reality for specific reasons. To determine these reasons, the first places to look are at the basic facts of your life. You are rich or poor, smart, dim, clumsy, athletic, ugly or good looking for a reason. The reason is because living life under those circumstances points you in the directions you are supposed to be going. You are not supposed to be perfectly well rounded, it is usually quite helpful to be lopsided. It is that lopsidedness that provides the direction and impetus for your individual development.

Disadvantages can provide challenges for you to battle, but another very important function of disadvantages is to provide natural barriers that prompt you to put your energies in other directions. People who are physically weak compensate by concentrating on their mental life. People who are not intellectual may be highly perceptive and “intelligent” on an emotional level, but this talent is not often recognized as valuable by others. Whatever your circumstances, they have been designed to give you the experience and impetus required to accomplish the tasks you have set for yourself here.

Some people have given themselves major problems in order to learn hard lessons quickly. Others take life in measured doses as they slowly work their way toward an understanding of the true meaning of manhood or womanhood, creativity or stagnation, friendship or hatred, independence or dependence. When you have recognized the major circumstances and factors which are directing your life, you can begin to understand what trials or adventures will complete your training.

Aside from your physical situation, you have a set of metaphors which you use to interpret the world. There are many different type of metaphors used by people as described in the Why does the world seem completely insane discussion. These metaphors serve to hide some areas of life and emphasize others. The question is, are your metaphors positive, expansive and flexible, providing you with creative challenges? Or are they negative, fearful, and claustrophobic, stifling your creative impulses and smothering you with fearful dogma?

Let’s look at the characteristics of these two types of systems:

Open systems:

Base moral judgments on the actual helpfulness or harmfulness of someone’s behavior Leave large areas of behavior morally neutral, so that you have room to find compromises with others who see things differently.

Encourage you to listen to and understand people who are different from you.

Define standards of moral behavior but allow that thoughts and feelings are not controllable and are exempt from “moral” judgments.

Expect your natural inclinations to lead you into creative endeavors that will help you to find your place in the world and meet your need to act effectively.

Closed Systems:

Base moral judgments on unquestionable “lists” of what is good or bad behavior.

Encourage you to only associate with people with your beliefs and background.

Define thoughts and feelings as being good or bad, bad thoughts or feelings should be fought.

Expect you natural inclinations to be toward lazy or immoral behavior, requiring you to ignore your natural impulses and focus on ideas and activities given to you by others.

You may need to alter your metaphors before you can deal with your challenges effectively.

The purpose of groups
There are millions of different social groups in the world, political, economic, religious, philosophical, and cultural. These groups are all trying to bring their particular vision into focus and build a life that is related to the central principles of the group. Each of these groups is an experiment in progress. As time passes, the ideas that are developed within these groups either spread to the society as a whole or are abandoned as unworkable. This is a Darwinian process that develops better ideas in the same way that evolution is supposed to develop better animals. You can find more information about this notion of “idea evolution” at the Memes: Introduction site. Even groups that you personally dislike are working in your behalf, attempting to build visions of the world that might allow you to interact with the world more creatively and successfully.
Groups also serve as symbols in the social world. Groups with different beliefs than your group provide you with viewpoints you wouldn't have otherwise considered. They also represent parts of your own mind that you are not focusing on. However, if you fear those parts of your mind, this representation can degenerate into projection, which is a bad thing. See Why is there so much hate in the world?.

The race as a whole
The entire human race is a grand experiment in strengthening and focusing reflective thought and analytical intelligence to a far higher pitch than it has been expressed in other species on the planet. Humans are the only animals that can look at themselves and their world objectively, detached from immediate physical concerns. They have separated themselves from the business of physical survival in several ways. They have developed powerful methods of communication such as language and music, they have created cultural rituals and complex worlds of ideas, and they have changed their environment and built fantastic tools and toys.
Unlike animals, humans create most of their environment themselves. The main focus of most people’s lives is not on the business of survival, it is on the business of building and maintaining their civilization. Our energies are dedicated to the development, communication, and expression of ideas; to cooperative effort with others on common tasks; and to using tools to change our environment to reflect our vision. Our main attention has been turned away from the natural world for several thousand years. The development of global economies and the resulting global environmental issues are pushing us back toward an appreciation of and involvement with our natural heritage. The development of technology and the resulting alienation of ourselves from the physical world and from each other have resulted in an increasing interest in spiritual questions (such as the meaning of life). These spiritual questions are pushing us back toward a more integrated understanding of our place in the universe.

This isn’t supposed to be a turning back of the clock however. The intense objectivity and reflection developed by humanity is supposed to bring a new awareness to the task. We are not to simply take our place as natural creatures as we once did. Nor are we to attempt to subjugate the environment and our own natures as we have been doing. The forces of nature around us and within us are living, conscious things. We must learn from these forces. We must form a partnership, a symbiosis. We are to continue to try and bring our vision of life out into the physical world, but we must form and implement that vision cooperatively.

We cannot force new patterns onto the natural and psychological forces that created us and that give us our physical and mental lives. Instead, we must understand the patterns already within the world and our minds and work within them and build upon them. We must become co-creators of our world. That is the challenge for the next millennium. It's the only game worth playing.


No, Really, So What?
What does this have to do with the meaning of your life? As the contents page said, trying to speak about reality is like trying to send a kiss by a messenger. Indeed, it is as foolish as trying to use a lamp to find an honest man, which is what we were really trying to demonstrate back in ancient Greece. Meaning cannot be communicated to you through an intermediate. You've got to experience it directly. You also cannot depend on others or on a "system" to identify truth. You have to know what truth feels like so that you can identify it for yourself.
It is frustrating, but the most others can do is give you clues about what meaning and truth will look like so that you can recognize them. If anyone promises you more, steer clear. They want you to trust them instead of trusting your own nature.

Steer clear, that is, unless they really know the truth and have actually found a way to communicate it to you. Are there people like that? We haven't met them yet, but we are not discounting the possibility.
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Posts: 1756 | From: Pontiac, MI. Oakland | Registered: Mar 2005

[Sun Goddess]

Sarah

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   posted 11-20-2005 11:00 PM                       
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Judging by the people I have met in my life, most seem to have a closed system as opposed to an open one.

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"If I forget thee, O Jerusalem, may my right hand fail..." - King David, Psalms 137:5

http://www.zwoje-scrolls.com/shoah/index.html

http://www.holocaustchronicle.org/

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[Sun Goddess]

unknown

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   posted 11-21-2005 01:33 PM                       
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We are a social animal Sarah, and unfortunately it seems conformity is still king.

I try not to sound trite but unfortunately in this case I am not articulate enough to avoid it.
We all have are own path to walk, and our own lessons to learn, the circumstances of our lives keep bringing us into situations from which we can choose to learn these lessons, or relive the consequences.

We must all be allowed to make our own mistakes to choose our own paths, if we are to grow. To learn those lessons, to remove the stumbling blocks from our path.

[ 11-21-2005, 01:44 PM: Message edited by: unknown ]

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several species of small furry animals gathered together and grooving with a pict in a cave

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Posts: 1756 | From: Pontiac, MI. Oakland | Registered: Mar 2005 

[Sun Goddess]

Heather Delaria

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   posted 11-21-2005 08:43 PM                       
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You wonder how much it serves any of us to learn our own individual lessons when humanity as a whole keeps repeating the same mistakes.

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"An it harm none, do what ye will."
-the Wiccan Rede

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Posts: 637 | Registered: Nov 2004