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HEALTH CARE THAT WILL KILL US

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Bianca
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« on: August 09, 2009, 08:38:57 pm »










                                                     Health care that will kill us






By John Browne
PittsburghLive
Sunday, August 9, 2009


The president's new health plan has garnered much criticism, as has his handling of the economy. Until relatively recently, America had an economy, currency and health system that was the envy of the world.

Today, the economy and currency look sick. There is an urgent need to curb entitlement spending and boost infrastructure spending to lift the economy and strengthen the currency. But the president appears intent upon a course that will boost entitlement spending at the expense of investment in infrastructure.

Much of it will be spent on a massive government health plan that threatens the physical health of Americans. In America, there is an old saying that "while the rich get richer, the poor get poorer." The proposed health plan threatens to make the sick sicker.

It is generally accepted that a solid infrastructure is an essential ingredient of a modern, economically successful economy. It also is accepted that America's infrastructure is in a state of advanced decay, needing $1 trillion to restore it to health. Some economists assert that for each trillion dollars spent on infrastructure, 3.5 million real, wealth-generating jobs are created.

Therefore, if the government were to spend $1 trillion on bringing U.S. infrastructure up to standard and a further $1 trillion on improving it, that would create 7 million jobs. This would restore both full employment and the economy.

Faced with this opportunity, it is amazing that President Obama appears to be intent upon pursuing a debt-financed, multitrillion-dollar spree on entitlements such as education and health.

While jobs will be created, they will be wealth-consuming and a drag on the economy. Furthermore, it is highly likely that the massive spending on nationalized health care actually will decrease the standard of health care in America, not raise it.

The experiences of Great Britain, Canada and Massachusetts are instructive.

Rep. Barney Frank, D-Mass., claims that Obama's new health program will be financed by defense cuts and tax increases. But he hesitates to mention that when, in the mid-1960s, the government came to Congress to finance Medicare, they gave cost projections of $10 billion over 25 years. The actual costs proved to be more than 10 times that -- $107 billion over 25 years.

How can Obama expect people to believe that his new health plan will "save money"? The truth is that it is likely to emerge as an unprecedented economic drain on all Americans.

America already has the world's best health system. Why change it?

Admittedly, there is the serious problem of some 5 percent of Americans who wish to have medical insurance but are unable to pay for it. Surely, short of an uneconomic nationalized health system, a combination of refundable tax credits and tax deductions could be designed to shrink this coverage gap.

With deep, tax-financed pockets, any government-sponsored health insurance plan soon will undersell the private, for-profit plans. Naturally, people will migrate to the cheaper government plan, bankrupting the private sector and eventually leaving the government as the only option.

Armed with this state monopoly power, the government then will be empowered to dictate, not just negotiate, both the price of drugs and procedures. The best medical practitioners will move to profitable free markets abroad, followed by key divisions of the major drug companies.

Just as in Canada and the U.K., the standard of health care will fall dramatically with breakdowns and massive consumer frustration as waiting lists lengthen dramatically and the standard of care diminishes. The end result will be a rapid rise in unnecessary deaths.

Indeed, the Obama plan envisages already a major increase in euthanasia counseling.

These are somewhat inconvenient truths. If Congress and Americans were generally aware of them, Obama's health plan would die.

Is that why is he pressing ahead so fast?

Does he have a hidden political agenda, geared more to social engineering than to the health of either the U.S. economy or its citizens?

Is he trying to replace Medicare solely to eliminate the government's massive debts to all those Americans who for many years have paid into Medicare?

America is at a crossroads. Somehow, the economy must be restructured to ensure that it consumes less than we produce. Spending on entitlements must be reduced as a proportion of gross domestic product and investment in production increased.

If the administration spends wisely, rather than politically, it could restore both the American economy and the American people to health. If not, Americans will feel far worse.
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Harconen
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« Reply #1 on: August 09, 2009, 08:55:13 pm »

OBAMA CARE FOR THE ELDERLY AND HANDICAPPED




If granny needs a $240,000 operation to live a few more years with her family is the health care rationing (or whatever PC name) czar going to approve it, or is she going to be given pain pills until the "palliative care counselor" convinces her to do the best thing for herself and her loved ones and take the "other" pill?

And why is there a provision to prosecute her relatives if they get together and pay for it out of their pockets?

Lets go for a package deal. -- since global warming solutions, minimizing oil and gas production, Cap and Tax, and the stimulus bill destruction of the economy are all sure to lead to food shortages -- lets just take the big jump and develop a Soylent Green version of Obamacare.

Putting granny on an ice floe would only feed the poor starving polar bears like the one in AlGores video. It would be much more "progressive" to put all the old grannies to better use.


HERE IS THE PART OF THE BILL THAT SAYS SO:



Section 1223, so judge for yourself:

1 ‘‘(B) An advance care planning consultation with respect to an individual may be conducted more frequently
3than provided under paragraph (1) if there is a significant
4change in the health condition of the individual, including
5diagnosis of a chronic, progressive, life-limiting disease, a
life-threatening or terminal diagnosis or life-threatening
injury, or upon admission to a skilled nursing facility, a
long-term care facility (as defined by the Secretary), or
a hospice program.
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Harconen
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« Reply #2 on: August 09, 2009, 08:59:54 pm »

ObamaCare Yay Or Nay? The Truth About Canada!


                                                             
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Harconen
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« Reply #3 on: August 09, 2009, 09:02:16 pm »

                                                   DRUGS ARE AWESOME!! Socialized Healthcare Sucks.


                                                         
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Krista Davenport
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« Reply #4 on: August 09, 2009, 11:27:47 pm »

                                                   DRUGS ARE AWESOME!! Socialized Healthcare Sucks.


                                                         

How stupid do you think people are?  According to you, you now live in the European Union, which has nothing but socialized medicine, you ex-Commie yahoo.  Cheesy
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Krista Davenport
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« Reply #5 on: August 09, 2009, 11:30:54 pm »

ObamaCare Yay Or Nay? The Truth About Canada!


                                                            

You mean the health insurance industry's truth about Canada.

The real truth about Canadian health care lies right here:

Bill Mann
TV-Radio Critic www.dcweasels.com
Posted: June 13, 2009 05:48 PM
Americans Who've Used Canada's Health-Care System Respond to Current Big-Lie Media Campaign


The scare ads and op-ed pieces featuring Canadians telling us American how terrible their government health-care systems have arrived - predictably.

There's another, factual view - by those of us Americans who've lived in Canada and used their system.

My wife and I did for years, and we've been incensed by the lies we've heard back here in the U.S. about Canada's supposedly broken system.

It's not broken - and what's more, Canadians like and fiercely defend it.

Example: Our son was born at Montreal's Royal Victoria Hospital. My wife got excellent care. The total bill for three days in a semi-private room? $21.

My friend Art Finley is a West Virginia native who lives in Vancouver.

"I'm 82, and in excellent health," he told me this week. "It costs me all of $57 a month for health care, and it's excellent. I'm so tired of all the lies and bulls**t I hear about the system up here in the U.S. media."
Finley, a well-known TV and radio host for years in San Francisco, adds,

"I now have 20/20 vision thanks to Canadian eye doctors. And I haven't had to wait for my surgeries, either."

A Canadian-born doctor wrote a hit piece for Wingnut Central (the Wall Street Journal op-ed page) this week David Gratzer claimed:

"Everyone in Canada is covered by a single payer -- the government. But Canadians wait for practically any procedure or diagnostic test or specialist consultation in the public system."
Vancouverite Finley: "That's sheer b.s."

I heard Gratzer say the same thing on Seattle radio station KIRO this week. Trouble is, it's nonsense.

We were always seen promptly by our doctors in Montreal, many of whom spoke both French and English.

Today, we live within sight of the Canadian border in Washington state, and still spend lots of time in Canada.

Five years ago, while we were on vacation in lovely Nova Scotia, the Canadian government released a long-awaited major report from a federal commission studying the Canadian single-payer system. We were listening to CBC Radio the day the big study came out.

The study's conclusion: While the system had flaws, none was so serious it couldn't be fixed.

Then the CBC opened the lines to callers across Canada.

Here it comes, I thought. The usual talk-show torrent of complaints and anger about the report's findings.

I wish Americans could have heard this revealing show.

For the next two hours, scores of Canadians called from across that vast country, from Newfoundland to British Columbia.

Not one said he or she would change the system. Every single one defended it vigorously.

The Greatest Canadian Ever

Further proof:

Not long ago, the CBC asked Canadians to nominate and then vote for The Greatest Canadian in history. Thousands responded.

The winner? Not Wayne Gretzky, as I expected (although the hockey great DID make the Top 10). Not even Alexander Graham Bell, another finalist.

The greatest Canadian ever?

Tommy Douglas.

Who? Tommy Douglas was a Canadian politician - and the father of Canadian universal health care.

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Krista Davenport
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« Reply #6 on: August 09, 2009, 11:35:39 pm »

OBAMA CARE FOR THE ELDERLY AND HANDICAPPED




If granny needs a $240,000 operation to live a few more years with her family is the health care rationing (or whatever PC name) czar going to approve it, or is she going to be given pain pills until the "palliative care counselor" convinces her to do the best thing for herself and her loved ones and take the "other" pill?

And why is there a provision to prosecute her relatives if they get together and pay for it out of their pockets?

Lets go for a package deal. -- since global warming solutions, minimizing oil and gas production, Cap and Tax, and the stimulus bill destruction of the economy are all sure to lead to food shortages -- lets just take the big jump and develop a Soylent Green version of Obamacare.

Putting granny on an ice floe would only feed the poor starving polar bears like the one in AlGores video. It would be much more "progressive" to put all the old grannies to better use.


HERE IS THE PART OF THE BILL THAT SAYS SO:



Section 1223, so judge for yourself:

1 ‘‘(B) An advance care planning consultation with respect to an individual may be conducted more frequently
3than provided under paragraph (1) if there is a significant
4change in the health condition of the individual, including
5diagnosis of a chronic, progressive, life-limiting disease, a
life-threatening or terminal diagnosis or life-threatening
injury, or upon admission to a skilled nursing facility, a
long-term care facility (as defined by the Secretary), or
a hospice program.

No health care czar,
No rationing care for the elderly,

You two Corporatist tools are just doing the work of the health insurance industry so they can keep their high profits intact and so all the 47 million uninsured in this country can keep on suffering.  That makes you sadists in my book.
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Harconen
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« Reply #7 on: August 09, 2009, 11:51:55 pm »

Do you hate other people all the time?

Is it cuz you can't find a boyfriend, I bet you can't. Cuz girls who have boyfriend are happy, and I can see that you aren't happy.

Try to release your libido and you will be better person. If you can find somebody who will be with person like you.

Now back on the topic, lets see what is real situation with Health Care in Canada.

                                                   

                                                   
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Krista Davenport
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« Reply #8 on: August 09, 2009, 11:58:52 pm »

Uh-uh, not about me.  And I just complained about your post, which I will do everytime you write something sexist about me.

You, on the other hand, are living in a Socialist country, getting Socialist health care and were born in a Communist country, which makes you a hypocrite for even coming up with all these crappy posts.
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Harconen
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« Reply #9 on: August 10, 2009, 12:04:33 am »

Yes fine, you can call me bad names (racist, etc) all the time and now you are hurt? Why cuz I posted a truth about you?
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Krista Davenport
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« Reply #10 on: August 10, 2009, 12:09:28 am »

If someone is engaged in racist behavior, than its the truth, now isn't it?  I never said you couldn't complain about me, go ahead!  Most of the mods here are female, though, and, I imagine more able to recognize sexism when they see it than you are.
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Volitzer
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« Reply #11 on: August 10, 2009, 12:15:00 am »

OBAMA CARE FOR THE ELDERLY AND HANDICAPPED




If granny needs a $240,000 operation to live a few more years with her family is the health care rationing (or whatever PC name) czar going to approve it, or is she going to be given pain pills until the "palliative care counselor" convinces her to do the best thing for herself and her loved ones and take the "other" pill?

And why is there a provision to prosecute her relatives if they get together and pay for it out of their pockets?

Lets go for a package deal. -- since global warming solutions, minimizing oil and gas production, Cap and Tax, and the stimulus bill destruction of the economy are all sure to lead to food shortages -- lets just take the big jump and develop a Soylent Green version of Obamacare.

Putting granny on an ice floe would only feed the poor starving polar bears like the one in AlGores video. It would be much more "progressive" to put all the old grannies to better use.


HERE IS THE PART OF THE BILL THAT SAYS SO:



Section 1223, so judge for yourself:

1 ‘‘(B) An advance care planning consultation with respect to an individual may be conducted more frequently
3than provided under paragraph (1) if there is a significant
4change in the health condition of the individual, including
5diagnosis of a chronic, progressive, life-limiting disease, a
life-threatening or terminal diagnosis or life-threatening
injury, or upon admission to a skilled nursing facility, a
long-term care facility (as defined by the Secretary), or
a hospice program.

No health care czar,
No rationing care for the elderly,

You two Corporatist tools are just doing the work of the health insurance industry so they can keep their high profits intact and so all the 47 million uninsured in this country can keep on suffering.  That makes you sadists in my book.

Look we are not against reform but Obamacare is just socialized medicine with delayed treatment for the elderly.

America can do better.
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Krista Davenport
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« Reply #12 on: August 10, 2009, 12:22:35 am »

Quote
Look we are not against reform but Obamacare is just socialized medicine with delayed treatment for the elderly.

America can do better.

There no delay in treatment for the elderly, that is a right wing myth.

As for "no socialized medicine, I guess that means you are against the VA and Medicare, right?  Both are government programs.

Private programs, on the other hand, are leeches that suck up everyone's money and send them into bankruptcy.
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Bianca
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« Reply #13 on: August 10, 2009, 08:12:11 am »



               








                                                             O B A M A C A R E




                                                      DO WITH LESS - DIE HAPPY


                                            RATIONING GIVES YOU YOUR FAIR SHARE
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Harconen
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« Reply #14 on: August 10, 2009, 03:26:51 pm »

If someone is engaged in racist behavior, than its the truth, now isn't it?  I never said you couldn't complain about me, go ahead!  Most of the mods here are female, though, and, I imagine more able to recognize sexism when they see it than you are.

You are trying to deflect ANY criticism of nObama by saying it's racist.

Once you're accused of racism, you're supposed to just STFU and curl up into a little ball. I will not do it cuz:

Never mind the fact that the accusation is itself racist, since it blatantly implies that -- even though the policies of all previous presidents could be treated separately from their respective race (since they were white) -- Obama's policies can't be treated separately from his respective race (since he's "black").

Who are the ones who view everything through the prism of race?  The very people who accuse everyone else of being racist.
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
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