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Atlantis and the Azores

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Wind
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« Reply #30 on: May 04, 2009, 01:29:16 pm »

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« Reply #31 on: May 06, 2009, 10:53:32 pm »

Hi Wind,

Excellent to note Tolkien's inspired work!  I got into Middle Earth about the same time as I did Atlantis (circa 1981?) and I have read those books so many times I've lost count! It was apparent to me immediately as I read the Akallebeth in the Silmarillion that this was an Atlantis knock-off and the Quenya name of Numenor as  Atalante is soooo obvious!

As far as the Azores go, a geologist named Wyman Harrison (who writes under the name "William Hutton") believes that the capital island of Atlantis was the Azores Plateau and has even developed a new geophysical theory for how the entire Atlantic seafloor can raise or sink by the action of a magma super plume. 

The link to this theory and couple of other articles on the Mid Atlantic Ridge are no longer available (except to paying subscribers) but I think they may have been archived by others on the Web.  I'll see if I can't track them down as they would be useful to this thread perhaps, and to others in the Scientific Atlantis board as well.

My Best,
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« Reply #32 on: May 06, 2009, 11:35:20 pm »

Quote
The link to this theory and couple of other articles on the Mid Atlantic Ridge are no longer available (except to paying subscribers) but I think they may have been archived by others on the Web.  I'll see if I can't track them down as they would be useful to this thread perhaps, and to others in the Scientific Atlantis board as well.

Thank you Horus, that would be great if you could find that information Smiley

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« Reply #33 on: May 24, 2009, 06:03:48 am »

Dear........WIND,

Bear with me please:

AZORES,  CANARIES are islands but NOT 'Atlantis ' which was NOT an I-oceanic-sland like CAYCE  & DONNELLY  fabricated in their " ( Yucatan-)
Readings"


OCEAN originally meant RIVER,

Dear TITAEA/ Theresa thought that she was more clever than the Other -MAIN STREAM- Theorists because she  knew that OCEAN meant originally " RIVER " in ancient Greek !  So She reasoned that if Atlantis was a "NESSOS - OKEANIKOUM" that that logically should be read  as :" RIVER- ISLE " () But she chose the wrong RIVER to promote her OFF the MAIN - STREAM idea on !

AFRICA and the west Atlantic OCEAN are thus fake names for Atlantis location ! they are  new geographical  names invented by the Romans AFTER Plato died.
Strangely enough NO atlantologists ever wondered WHY Plato would refer to ASIA(-MINOR.), which is a Latin name that crept -up AFTER his death
I have asked several Forummembers for a comment on this fact but nobody dared to frofess his ignorance on ANCIENT  MAPS !
the other day BIANCA got cross with me for mentioning Columbus arabic names giving in America !( ignoring my " evidence "inscribed on 'her' copies !)

Originally ( south-)ARABY was named SAFFARICCA or IPHRICA that name travelled with immigrants to: the Latin Province of  North- Africa

LYBIA originally was in ETHIOPIA on ancient MAPS that name is still there as:" Lybia sub sive Aethiopia or sub Sive Aegypto
Immigrants broufght that name to North- Africa and forgot all about the original PROVENANCE of that name !

COLUMBUS " Arabian" America largely ignored "-- Cry   Shocked   Cry

In America Columbus gave arabic names to Sea-Shores strange that uptil now NOBODY wondered why on Earth would Columbus do that
to: " India- Nova " Dr Simon Wiesenthal in his book " SAILS of HOPE" ( dd 1975.)explained why, but his book is ignored and not a bestseller amongst atlantologists.

CONCLUSION:

Americans that wonder why COLUMBUS gave arabian ( and no indian.) Names to America don't know their history ! The Name" INDIA NOVA "was an AFTERTHOUGHT!  ia if you don't get it: Columbus expected to land in ARABY not INDIA but since Vasco- da GAMA reached India before Columbus did, in 1498 he had to go with the political bandwaggon and named his" Arabian America" suddenly " INDIA- Nova".

ASIA in Plato's time was NOT Turkey again;
it was a ROMAN general who re-named it ASIA( Minor in 133 bc thus long AFTER PLATO's DEATH.`
none of the AO-atlantology memberswondered how Plato could have ever referred to a name
that was invented after his death because Turkey during Plato's time was named ANATOLIA/ Seleucia  & PERGAMUM.\

" BIANCA" would call this hairsplitting and " No Evidence" of this kind could convince her that ASIA-Minor was the name for Turkey AFTER Plato died !

So, How stupid or gullible must any atlantologist be to ignore these facts of Ancient cartography ?

To say that my discovery is not important is to say that  Plato's 10.000 bc or 900 before SOLON is not a translation mistake!
whilst better learned archaeologists all say that Plato's Atlantis is a bronze age civilisation ! Knowing GOLD but NO - IRON !

I don't mind beiing named a " TROLL " by dear  'BIANCA' she does not UNDERSTAND, that she cherishes falsh traditions too.
But If she says that my statements are invaluable without written proof ( from whom ? after 2.000 years of ignorance !)
and I explain in vain why Plato's " Latin, Textus -Receptus " is corrupted over the years
my painstaken explanation is not taken serious or dear ROBERT says thatv my evidence /explanation is too long or too short !

Only MARIO has sofar commented on my Subscript with disbelieve ofcourse !
« Last Edit: May 24, 2009, 07:40:56 am by BlueHue » Report Spam   Logged

( Blue's)THEORY, locating"original" Atlantis( in Aden-Yemen.)
1: ATLANTIS =Fake=Latin name, original Greek: ATHE(=a Region in Aden)
2: Atlantic-OCEAN=Greek: RIVER-of-Atlas+also" Known "World-OCEAN(=Red-Sea)
3: Greek-obsolete-Numeral 'X' caused Plato's Atlantisdate:9000=900
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« Reply #34 on: May 24, 2009, 09:17:36 am »

Please comment on my Short subscript THANK  YOU !

If you read that passage carefully in its proper context you will find that it does not refer to Atlantis but to antediluvian Greece -the great peninsula of Hellas which sank into the Aegean leaving behind the Cyclades islands as "bones of a wasted body". I only know this because I got busted for it myself a few years ago! [/quote]

I got busted for it too Horus Embarrassed  It was quite embarrassing Grin
[/quote]
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( Blue's)THEORY, locating"original" Atlantis( in Aden-Yemen.)
1: ATLANTIS =Fake=Latin name, original Greek: ATHE(=a Region in Aden)
2: Atlantic-OCEAN=Greek: RIVER-of-Atlas+also" Known "World-OCEAN(=Red-Sea)
3: Greek-obsolete-Numeral 'X' caused Plato's Atlantisdate:9000=900
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« Reply #35 on: May 25, 2009, 10:31:11 pm »

Quote
Please comment on my Short subscript THANK  YOU !

BlueHue I've already commented on your subscript and I'm not going to do it again! Angry

Here's my three rules of thumb for you.

Winds 3 Red Rules Of Thumb For BlueHue

1. If you have no proof then it’s just a theory!

2. If you belittle and ridicule other peoples theories it’s just plain rude!

3. If you canvas your un-provable theory across a forum it’s considered spam, trolling, and inconsiderate.
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« Reply #36 on: May 29, 2009, 11:14:24 pm »

I copied this from a thread started by Arcturus, heres the link if you want to check it out!

http://atlantisonline.smfforfree2.com/index.php/topic,9564.0.html

Quote
Strabo's Geography & His 5 Missing Isles in the Atlantic

He mentions five cities outside the Pillars of Hercules, in the eastern Atlantic that are no longer on any maps:

Gymnesiae
Erytheia
Hera's Island
Ebusus
Ophiussa

One or all of these could have something to do with the legend of Atlantis

These five cities are the Hesperides, which I believe to be none other than the Azores!
« Last Edit: June 02, 2009, 10:01:30 pm by Wind » Report Spam   Logged
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« Reply #37 on: May 29, 2009, 11:16:08 pm »

Hesperides

In Greek mythology, the Hesperides (Greek: Ἑσπερίδες) are nymphs who tend a blissful garden in a far western corner of the world, located near the Atlas mountains in Libya, or on a distant blessed island at the edge of the encircling Oceanus, the world-ocean.
According to the Sicilian Greek poet Stesichorus, in his poem the "Song of Geryon", and the Greek geographer Strabo, in his book Geographika (volume III), the Hesperides are in Tartessos, a location placed in the south of the Iberian peninsula.
By Roman times, the garden of the Hesperides had lost its archaic place in religion and had dwindled to a poetic convention, in which form it was revived in Renaissance poetry, to refer both to the garden and to the nymphs that dwelt there.

The Nymphs of the Evening
Ordinarily the Hesperides number three, like the other Greek triads (the Three Graces and the Moirae). "Since the Hesperides themselves are mere symbols of the gifts the apples embody, they cannot be actors in a human drama. Their abstract, interchangeable names are a symptom of their impersonality," Evelyn Harrison has observed; nevertheless, among the names given to them, though never all at once, are Aegle ("dazzling light"), Arethusa, Erytheia (or Erytheis), Hesperia (alternatively Hespereia, Hespere, Hespera, Hesperusa, or Hesperethoosa). Lipara, Asterope and Chrysothemis are named in a Hesperide scene of the apotheosis of Heracles (romanised to Hercules) on a late fifth-century hydria by the Meidias Painter in London They are sometimes called the Western Maidens, the Daughters of Evening, or Erythrai, the "Sunset Goddesses", designations all apparently tied to their imagined location in the distant west. Hesperis is appropriately the personification of the evening (as Eos is of the dawn) and the Evening Star is Hesperus. In addition to their tending of the garden, they were said to have taken great pleasure in singing.
They are sometimes portrayed as the evening daughters of Night (Nyx) and Darkness (Erebus), in accord with the way Eos in the farthermost east, in Colchis, is the daughter of the titan Hyperion. Or they are listed as the daughters of Atlas, or of Zeus and either Hesperius or Themis, or Phorcys and Ceto.

Erytheia ("the red one") is one of the Hesperides. The name was applied to the island close to the coast of southern Hispania, that was the site of the original Punic colony of Gades (modern Cadiz). Pliny's Natural History (4.36) records of the island of Gades: "On the side which looks towards Spain, at about 100 paces distance, is another long island, three miles wide, on which the original city of Gades stood. By Ephorus and Philistides it is called Erythia, by Timćus and Silenus Aphrodisias, and by the natives the Isle of Juno." The island was the seat of Geryon, who was overcome by Heracles.

The Garden of the Hesperides

The Garden of the Hesperides by Frederick, Lord Leighton, 1892.
The Garden of the Hesperides is Hera's orchard in the west, where either a single tree or a grove of immortality-giving golden apples grew. The apples were planted from the fruited branches that Gaia gave to her as a wedding gift when Hera accepted Zeus. The Hesperides were given the task of tending to the grove, but occasionally plucked from it themselves. Not trusting them, Hera also placed in the garden a never-sleeping, hundred-headed dragon named Ladon as an additional safeguard.
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« Reply #38 on: May 29, 2009, 11:18:19 pm »

I'm not the only one who feels this way, the following is taken from

http://www.tekarno.com/tenerife_legends.htm

Tenerife In Legends

The Dark Ocean

A dangerous Ocean full of monsters.
A few - it would appear very few - sea explorers reached the Canary Islands during ancient times.
The islands lie in the Atlantic Ocean, the so-called "Dark Ocean", into which very few sailors dared to venture. Furthermore, the ocean current called "Canaries Stream" flows in a southwesterly direction before veering to the west to sweep the unwary ocean vessel off to the end of the world, as it was believed during centuries.
Those few Phoenicians, Greeks and Romans who reached the islands and managed to return home to tell their story, surrounded the Canaries in a mist of magic and legend.
According to the Mediterranean sailors' tales, the Atlantic Ocean was inhabited by all kind of
monsters which destroyed the vessels and devored their daring crews. You could find at any moment giant whirlpools, storms caused by angry gods or... the end of the world. Once arrived at the world's edge, which was thought to be a flat disc, the unwise seamen would fall into the abyss.
In the opinion of some historians, there was an economic or militar reason for some of these legends. The Phoenicians, skillful sailors and trademen, knew
some Atlantic searoutes along the African and European coast. They were not interested at all in having other people as competitors, so they tried to keep visitors at a distance by means of spreading awful rumours and legends.

The Atlantis

The lost continent, the lost civilization.
For centuries, even after the Spanish conquest, it was believed that the islands were the uppermost peaks of the lost continent of Atlantis of which Plato wrote in his "Timeos and Critias".
Atlantis was a big island, "larger than Libya and Asia together", located beyond the Columns of Hercules (the Strait of Gibraltar). It was the dominion of Poseidon, god of the Sea, and it was inhabited by the Atlants, descendants of its first king Atlas, son of the god and a mortal women.
Atlantis was immensely wealthy and the Atlants were the most advanced people of the world. In the center of the continent raised the great capital town with the Palace and the Temple of Poseidon. Its scientists transmitted their skills and civilization knowledges to other peoples, with whom they maintained peace
Atlants observed their laws of justice, generosity and peace for many generations. But in time they degenerated and became greedy and warlike. Others add that they discovered the secrets of the gods, secrets of cosmic energies and forces which could destroy mankind.
Atlants observed their laws of justice, generosity and peace for many generations. But in time they degenerated and became greedy and warlike. Others add that they discovered the secrets of the gods, secrets of cosmic energies and forces which could destroy mankind.
About 11,500 years ago Zeus, king of the gods, punished the Atlants. In the course of a single night volcanoes and tidal waves destroyed the big island in a disaster of cosmic proportions.
According to the legend, only the islands of Azores, Madeira, Canaries and Cape Verde remain from Atlantis. These were the lost continent's highest summits. But its palaces and temples are still to be found in the bottom of the sea, a sea which took its name from Atlantis: the Atlantic Ocean.
"Its steady palaces inhabited by dolphins,
its meadows and gardens carpeted with seaweed..."
(Jacinto Verdaguer - "La Atlántida")

The Garden of Hesperides

The garden full of Golden apples.
Hesiod -a Greek poet of the 8th century b.C.- wrote about the legendary Garden of Hesperydes. The story starts with Atlas.
Atlas was a Giant, titan Japeto's son. The titans were defeated by Zeus, king of the gods, who confined them in the Tartarus -the hell. Atlas had fought the war on his father's side. According to some opinions, Zeus condemned Atlas to support the vault of heavens upon his shoulders. Other maintain that an angry Perseus showed him Medusa's head thus converting him into a high mountain that supported the sky. Be that as it may, Atlas had to hold up the sky beyond the Columns of Hercules -the Strait of Gibraltar.
Atlas had three daughters, the Hesperydes: Egle, Eritia and Aretusa. The three lived in the most westernly land of the world, some wonderful islands in the Atlantic Ocean, a Garden of Eden where weather was always mild and where golden apples grew on the trees. Goddess Gea (Mother Earth) made sprout those apples as a wedding gift to the king and queen of the gods, Zeus and Hera.
The Hesperydes cultivate the Garden, but a fierce dragon looked after it. It was called Ladon, and it had hundred flame-spewing heads.

Hercules -also called Herakles-, the greatest hero of ancient times, had to perform twelve very difficult tasks, almost impossible to accomplish, the "Twelve Labors of Hercules". Labor number eleven consisted in stealing the Hesperydes' Golden Apples.
Hercules found Atlas supporting the sky near the Ocean, in the mountains which we call today Atlas (Morocco). Since the Garden of Hesperydes' dragon knew Atlas, Hercules persuaded him to go to the islands and steal the apples, while he stayed as supporter of the sky in his place. Atlas went to the Garden in which he could enter since the dragon recognized him, killed the monster, stole the golden apples and returned to the place where Hercules stayed. Atlas, tired of his task, intended to leave Hercules with the burden upon his shoulders, but the hero managed to cheat him. He passed him the burden again and fled with the apples.
And the Garden of Hesperydes? Did it lose its Golden Apples forever? No! They ended by returning to the islands, since they were given to goddess Athena, who gave them back to the gardeners, the Hesperydes.
Concerning Ladon, the watch-dragon killed by Atlas... it lives on in their children, the dragon-trees. According to the legend, the blood flowing from the dragon's wounds fell all over the Garden of Hesperydes. A dragon tree sprouted from each blood drop. Dragon trees -dracaena drago- have massive trunks from which raise a bunch of twisted branches, Ladon's hundred heads. When a piece
of bark or a branch are broken, the tree "bleed" a dark-red sap called "dragon-tree blood", which can be used with medical purposes. Dragon trees grow slowly, but they can live for several centuries.
There is a specimen at Icod de los Vinos -Tenerife- which is called the "Thousand-year old Dragon Tree".
The Guanches, Canarian natives, revered the places where these trees grew as specially meaningful and full of energies. Today, several superstitions of the Canarian folklore are still refered to a dragon tree, growing lonely at the edge of a crag or a cliff.
When the traveler approaches the Canaries by sea, he can glimpse the misty form of the Teide floating over the clouds many miles before arriving at the islands.
When we imagine how it looked when the volcano has been in eruption, we shall understand how the legend was born of a fierce fire-spewing dragon who watched over a wonderful Garden where the Golden Apples grew...
Herakles in Garden of Hesperides

The Ghost island of Borondón

The canaries are seven islands, but one more is still searched.
The Canaries are seven islands... but an eigth isle is still searched! It is the ghost island, the mysterious one, the island of San Borondón. San Borondón is the Canarian name of Saint Brendan or Saint Brandan of Clonfert (480-576 d.C.), an Irish monk who plays the lead in one of the most famous legends of the Celtic culture: the voyage of Saint Brendan or Brandan to the Promised Land of the Saints, the Islands of Happiness and Fortune.
ó
The Irish poem tells that Brendan was a monk of Tralee, County Kerry. He was ordained priest in the year 512 d.C.. He sailed with 14 other monks on a small vessel which went far away in the Atlantic Ocean. The legend tells about their adventures, how they took with them along their voyage three other monks, their encounter with fire-hurling demons, with floating crystal columns, with monstruos creatures as large as an island.
Brendan and his fellow travellers landed on island where they found trees and other sort of vegetation. They said mass,
and suddenly the island started to sail. It was a gigantic sea creature and they were on its back. After many
vicissitudes Brendan managed to go back to Ireland. Many base on this legend the affirmation that Irish sailors reached possibly in the High Middle Ages the shores of North America or Newfoundland, Iceland and other Atlantic isles.
When the Canaries were conquered throughout the 15th century, stories were insistently told about an eigth island which sometimes was seen to the West of La Palma, El Hierro and La Gomera. When sailors tried to reach it and approached to its shores, mountains and valleys, the island was covered by mist and vanished. The island was obviously identified as mythical Saint Brendan's whale-island, and was called "San Borondón" in the Canary Islands.
People believed firmly in its existence, and there were even detailed accounts from an odd sailor or two who swore that they had landed on the island and explored it before the land had sunk again into the Ocean. In some international treaties signed by the Kingdom of Castille it was stated, concerning the Canary Islands, the Castilian sovereignty over *the islands of Canaria, already discovered or to be discovered*; just in case... The island was called "Aprositus", the Inaccesible, and in other versions of the legend is named "Antilia" or "Island of the Seven Cities", cities which were supposed to have been founded by seven legendary bishops.
The archives of the 18th century inform about official inquiries by the authorities of El Hierro, where tens of witnesses declared having seen the bewitched island from the summits of El Hierro's mountains. An expedition in search of the island sailed from Santa Cruz de Tenerife as a result of this inquiry.
The persistence of this legend in the islands' folklore is amazing. San Borondón is still alive in the islands' people imagination. There is probably no one islander of Tenerife, La Palma, La Gomera or El Hierro who sometime has not
looked from the mountains of his island into the sea, searching the lost island of San Borondón in the western
horizon where the sun sinks in the cobalt-blue waters of the Atlantic Ocean.
"Let the Guanche drums resound
and the conch shells blow,
for the mysterious island
is appearing in the midst of the waves;
here comes San Borondón,
showing up in the mist
like a queen
with the surf as suite..."
"San Borondón", Cabrera/Santamaría

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« Reply #39 on: May 29, 2009, 11:28:34 pm »

Quote
quoteAccording to the legend, only the islands of Azores, Madeira, Canaries and Cape Verde remain from Atlantis. These were the lost continent's highest summits.

Atlas had three daughters, the Hesperydes: Egle, Eritia and Aretusa. The three lived in the most westernly land of the world, some wonderful islands in the Atlantic Ocean

Atlas was the king of Atlantis supposedly! his daughters were the Hesperides, so this makes me think that the Azores = Hesperides = Atlantis?


If this is so then the Kingdom of Atlantis also spread to the mainland because the city of Erytheia, later known as Gades is modern Cadiz Spain

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« Reply #40 on: June 04, 2009, 10:49:05 am »

Hesperides

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« Reply #41 on: June 04, 2009, 10:53:18 am »

From reading the stories about the Hesperides, it is my guess that this are just another twist on the Eden, tree of the life story.

The Garden of the Hesperides = The Garden of Eden?  Maybe!

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« Reply #42 on: June 04, 2009, 11:40:15 pm »

It would seem plausible to conclude that the Atlantean civilization spread to the mainland since Plato more or less said so.  He said that they had control of Europe to Italy and Africa to the boundaries of Egypt (Libya).  That had they won this so called war, then Egypt and everyone who was not yet under the Atlantean control, would become slaves.  Therefore, as I've said many times many ways, Atlanteans still exist - it's just that we do not know who they are.  Atlantis did a brisk trade with numerous other countries.  She supposedly had Triremes in her harbours before Triremes were ever invented.  Very advanced she was, indeed.  So IF Atlantis did exist, then she had survivors who were spread all across Europe and Africa and pretty much every nation in the Med. area and beyond has Atlantean blood in their veins. 

What's the most common DNA again?
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An open-minded view of the past allows for an unprejudiced glimpse into the future.

Logic rules.

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« Reply #43 on: June 05, 2009, 01:28:49 pm »

HESPERIDES is the arabic TERM for a WELL-watered garden in an OASDES
while the outlook ios in a vast sand desert 1
MAYBE THIS WILL SPRING TO MIND

if someone would sell you the Hesperid garden region but without the WELLS !
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( Blue's)THEORY, locating"original" Atlantis( in Aden-Yemen.)
1: ATLANTIS =Fake=Latin name, original Greek: ATHE(=a Region in Aden)
2: Atlantic-OCEAN=Greek: RIVER-of-Atlas+also" Known "World-OCEAN(=Red-Sea)
3: Greek-obsolete-Numeral 'X' caused Plato's Atlantisdate:9000=900
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« Reply #44 on: June 05, 2009, 04:32:32 pm »

HESPERIDES is the arabic TERM for a WELL-watered garden in an OASDES
while the outlook ios in a vast sand desert 1
MAYBE THIS WILL SPRING TO MIND

if someone would sell you the Hesperid garden region but without the WELLS !

The Greeks were not and are not Arabic, and thus did not speak Arabic so there would be no similarity between Greek and Arabic words! 

The Hesperides were the daughters of Atlas who every Atlantean researcher knows was the king of Atlantis!   Maybe not literal daughters however.   I am beginning to believe that these daughters were kingdoms of the Atlantean empire.

Five Kingdoms

Gymnesiae
Erytheia
Hera's Island
Ebusus
Ophiussa
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