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WOW, JUST WOW...........

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Author Topic: WOW, JUST WOW...........  (Read 11867 times)
Byron
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« Reply #390 on: June 15, 2009, 02:01:42 am »

Quote
First of all, as stated, it's not called a "defense" force, but Obama did call it a "SECURITY" force and stated that he was "committed" to building it.  Shouting the same erroneous sentences in all caps is not helping your argument in the slightest either, Byron.

Sure it does.  The point remains that there is nothing that has come down the pike in terms of this current proposal, and I doubt that it will either.  The perfect time to slip it in there would have been the Kennedy Service bill, it isn't there, and he would have to start separate legislation to get it passed, or put it in something else, which he won't do because it would be too controversial.

Quote
Programs and acts can come from the executive branch e.g. the Patriot Act was designed in the Justice Dept of Bush's cabinet.  The New Deal was FDR's series of economic programs, not congress'.

He can propose whatever he wants, if he wants funding for it, it has go through Congress, just like the New Deal did.   Smiley  And the Patriot Act still had to be introduced into Congress by a member.  Prior to that, of course, it was just sitting in someone's drawer someplace, waiting for the right time.  It is, 1000 pages, of course, so it was not written up after September 11th. 


Quote
Next you are trying to say that none of the plans articulated by Obama during his campaign, or in speeches after the election, can be discussed because they don't exist yet.  Maybe in your little world, but everyone else is watching for his campaign promises to materialize.

You can discuss them all youj want, heck the internet has all sorts of misinformation on it, but unless there is a specific proposal, introduced into Congress for us all to look over, everything is simple speculation.

Quote
Of course, that isn't strange to Obama supporters because he can do no wrong in their minds, and they have 'faith' in him!

I don't think Obama supporters have complete 'faith' in him.  During the campaign, for instance, I had some issues with his vote on FISA.  He is still much better than any of the alternatives that were out there - Hillary, McCain, Ron Paul.  Hillary, for instance, was even more hawkish than Obama, and, since she took more money from the insurance companies than any other candidate, I doubt that we would see any real change in there.


Quote
But when I tried to get Al Gore elected in 2000, and my vote as well 1/2 million other votes didn't matter (Gore had won the popular vote by this margin), and some scandalous, shady shenanigans took place down in Florida which aborted the recount of a miscount, and Bush II became our unelected President, I realized that presidents aren't elected, but rather selected.

That's true, give the Republicans an opportunity and they will steal an election every time!  But the secret is not to just give up on the process, but to show up in such great numbers that they simply can't steal it from us.

Both parties are way too controlled by money, but only about half the Dems are while all the Republicans are.  Therein lies the hope for this country:  we have to start campaign finance reform and we have to get the money out of politics.  Public funding of campaigns, something both Obama and Biden have talked about would do it.


Quote
If Obama pulls all the troops out of Iraq, scales back the military instead of increasing it (because it certainly doesn't need to be increased for any rational reason if we are withdrawing from Middle Eastern wars), doesn't implement a mandatory youth brainwashing service program, nor a giant civilian national security force, then I'll breathe easier.

According to the agreement we signed with Iraq, all the troops are supposed to be out of there by 2011.  And if we get Bin Laden in Afghanistan, we'd be out of there, too.  We don't need our military to stop terrorist attacks, all we need is to build some schools and hospitals in these place so the terrorists there have no support network.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2009, 02:16:54 am by Byron » Report Spam   Logged

Win One for the Lion



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Volitzer
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« Reply #391 on: June 15, 2009, 02:06:30 am »

@


                                                   http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VP9SBZxCo9Q&feature=related

Hannity belongs to the neocon side of the NWO cult.  He should talk.
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Harconen
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« Reply #392 on: June 15, 2009, 02:12:48 am »


                                                         



                                                                    Judge snubs admin. on Gitmo files

By JOSH GERSTEIN | 6/9/09 11:12 PM EDT

President Barack Obama’s plan to empty the Guantanamo Bay prison appeared to suffer another blow on Tuesday, after a federal judge bluntly rejected the administration’s plea to limit access to information gathered by a presidential task force reviewing the cases of the 240 men detained there.


U.S. District Court Judge Thomas Hogan also accused the government of dragging its feet and gave Justice Department lawyers a tongue-lashing for failing to comply with existing court orders dating as far back as February.


In a sharply worded ruling from the bench, Hogan said he was unconvinced that sharing the task force information with detainees’ lawyers would interfere with the reviews Obama has ordered as part of his plan to close the prison camp by January. The judge also said the court could not be in a position of denying detainees the right to use information that could help their cases.


“I see no reason why the court can’t move ahead with its litigation promptly, just because of discovery from one database that would somehow bring to a halt all the president’s efforts,” Hogan said skeptically from the bench at the conclusion of a two-hour hearing on the government’s proposal.


Hogan also faulted the Justice Department for “a fundamental misunderstanding of the judicial process and its relation with the executive, and its failure to abide by court orders that have been issued and are outstanding.”


“The executive cannot order what the courts should do,” the judge said.
 


Before Hogan’s ruling, Justice Department attorney James Gilligan argued that it would take a team of 10 to 20 government attorneys four to 12 months to sort through all of the task force’s information in the 50 or more cases, get it reviewed by other government agencies and provide it to the detainees’ lawyers. He said the orders to produce task force information were “of terrible concern to us.”


“It’s obvious you’re going to have to get more lawyers,” the judge said. He suggested that with the downturn in the economy, Justice “could find 10 to 20 attorneys to do the work.”


Hogan noted that Obama’s order setting up the task force and vowing to close Guantanamo came about four months ago. However, the judge said he had to adhere to a Supreme Court ruling issued nearly a year ago which instructed lower courts to conduct “prompt” hearings on the so-called habeas corpus cases brought by most of the war-on-terror prisoners at Guantanamo.
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Harconen
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« Reply #393 on: June 15, 2009, 02:16:35 am »

“The president’s executive order you feel trumps the Supreme Court’s order?” the judge asked Gilligan.


“No, we don’t,” Gilligan replied. He said the delays were simply a matter of logistics. “It’s an unavoidable reality when you’re talking about a database with 2 million pages of documents. ... It can’t be done quickly.”


In court papers, the government said full searches would actually involve multiple databases run by a variety of agencies.


Hogan called the government’s arguments “exaggerated” and said its estimates were mere “generalities.” He accused the government of setting up a “Hobson’s choice” where detainees — some of whom have been held without charge for more than seven years — could have their cases heard immediately or could wait as long as another year for evidence that might undermine the government’s case to hold them.


“We’ve seen clients lose heart and in some cases lose their minds,” attorney Dan Malone of Dechert LLP said, arguing on behalf of the detainees against the government’s plan. “It’s not efficient. It’s not just.”


Malone said the government’s claims that the orders required task force personnel to sift through the information themselves were wrong.


Hogan’s ruling applied to about 50 cases being considered by seven federal judges in Washington. However, he said the government was free to seek relief from the individual judges. About 240 prisoners remain at Guantanamo and the vast majority have court challenges pending.


Obama said last month that about 50 detainees have been cleared for release or transfer to other countries, though finding countries willing to accept them has proven difficult.


The judge also chastised the Justice Department for “rather egregiously” failing to comply with court rules requiring consultation with the opposing parties.

A spokesman said Tuesday night that the department was reviewing Hogan’s ruling.
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Volitzer
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« Reply #394 on: June 15, 2009, 02:20:17 am »

With all this Porkulus money Obama is well on the way of destroying the dollar.

How many countries have abandoned the dollar under Bush 43 and Obama 44 ??

Let's see if Obama signs the bill to audit the Federal-Reserve who caused America's economic plight at the request of the Bilderbergers and the IMF.

As for my dis-establishmentarian-ism  Grin  who is always carrying the anti-discriminatory torch regarding 3rd, 4th and 5th parties.  If Republicans are so free-market why not compete with Libertarians, Socialists, Constitutionalists as well as Greens on a national level in all 50 states.  First tho each party must get on all state ballots in all 50 first.

The truth is the NWO is behind all this corruption, it has been proven yet people still keep going back and forth between the 2 established Bilderberg-controlled parties.  It's like a dull-witted woman vascillating between abusive boyfriends time and time again.

I just prefer Constitutional-compatibility with my candidates.   Wink
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Volitzer
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« Reply #395 on: June 15, 2009, 02:22:56 am »

“The president’s executive order you feel trumps the Supreme Court’s order?” the judge asked Gilligan.


“No, we don’t,” Gilligan replied. He said the delays were simply a matter of logistics. “It’s an unavoidable reality when you’re talking about a database with 2 million pages of documents. ... It can’t be done quickly.”


In court papers, the government said full searches would actually involve multiple databases run by a variety of agencies.


Hogan called the government’s arguments “exaggerated” and said its estimates were mere “generalities.” He accused the government of setting up a “Hobson’s choice” where detainees — some of whom have been held without charge for more than seven years — could have their cases heard immediately or could wait as long as another year for evidence that might undermine the government’s case to hold them.


“We’ve seen clients lose heart and in some cases lose their minds,” attorney Dan Malone of Dechert LLP said, arguing on behalf of the detainees against the government’s plan. “It’s not efficient. It’s not just.”


Malone said the government’s claims that the orders required task force personnel to sift through the information themselves were wrong.


Hogan’s ruling applied to about 50 cases being considered by seven federal judges in Washington. However, he said the government was free to seek relief from the individual judges. About 240 prisoners remain at Guantanamo and the vast majority have court challenges pending.


Obama said last month that about 50 detainees have been cleared for release or transfer to other countries, though finding countries willing to accept them has proven difficult.


The judge also chastised the Justice Department for “rather egregiously” failing to comply with court rules requiring consultation with the opposing parties.

A spokesman said Tuesday night that the department was reviewing Hogan’s ruling.

The American CIA is beihnd all false-flag operations save the cost of internment and just let them go already.   Roll Eyes

Good article Harconen.
« Last Edit: June 15, 2009, 02:24:06 am by Volitzer » Report Spam   Logged
Harconen
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« Reply #396 on: June 15, 2009, 04:03:57 pm »



The American CIA is beihnd all false-flag operations save the cost of internment and just let them go already.   Roll Eyes

Good article Harconen.
[/quote]

 Interesting thing, they are "closeing" one camp, and on other side, they are opening new FEMA camps  Huh

“We’ve seen clients lose heart and in some cases lose their minds,” attorney Dan Malone

The cruel people do cruel things. 
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Volitzer
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« Reply #397 on: June 15, 2009, 04:09:04 pm »

We should use the FEMA Camps for all those fractional-reserve bankers and those in the CFR who are trying to bring down America.
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Harconen
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« Reply #398 on: June 15, 2009, 07:01:39 pm »

We should use the FEMA Camps for all those fractional-reserve bankers and those in the CFR who are trying to bring down America.

No Volitzer.It was done in the past, by them, and it was not good solution.We must find another way.

                                   
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HereForNow
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HUH?


« Reply #399 on: June 15, 2009, 07:09:48 pm »

Volitzer you build the craft. I'll design the electro-magnetic rail launch system.
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Harconen
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« Reply #400 on: June 15, 2009, 07:47:50 pm »

Volitzer you build the craft. I'll design the electro-magnetic rail launch system.

                   Can I go with you?

                                 
                                         

                                       


                                         

                And, can my girlfriend come too?

                                         


« Last Edit: June 16, 2009, 10:59:08 pm by Harconen » Report Spam   Logged

Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
HereForNow
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HUH?


« Reply #401 on: June 15, 2009, 08:12:40 pm »

Actually, I'm thinking about a disposable craft on a one way trip to the Sun.
And ofcourse, placing these criminals aboard it and that will be that.
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Harconen
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« Reply #402 on: June 15, 2009, 08:18:41 pm »

Actually, I'm thinking about a disposable craft on a one way trip to the Sun.
And ofcourse, placing these criminals aboard it and that will be that.
LOL
It is to many of them.Better if we go on Earth II.There is no pollution there.


« Last Edit: June 15, 2009, 08:31:40 pm by Harconen » Report Spam   Logged

Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Harconen
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« Reply #403 on: June 16, 2009, 11:47:25 pm »


                                     


By PHILIP ELLIOTT, Associated Press Writer – 1 hr 11 mins ago

WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama, under growing criticism for not seeking to end the ban on openly gay men and women in the military, is extending benefits to same-sex partners of federal employees.

Obama plans to announce his decision on Wednesday in the Oval Office, a White House official said Tuesday. The official spoke on the condition of anonymity because the president hadn't yet signed the presidential memorandum.

The official said Obama would release more details on Wednesday.

The decision is a political nod to a reliably Democratic voting bloc that in recent weeks has grown frustrated with the White House's slow movement on their priorities.

Several powerful gay fundraisers withdrew their support from a June 25 Democratic National Committee event where Vice President Joe Biden is expected to speak. Their exit came in response to a June 12 Justice Department brief that defended the Defense of Marriage Act, a prime target for gay and lesbian criticism. Justice lawyers argued that the law allowed states to reject marriages performed in other states or countries that defy their own standards.

The legal arguments — including citing incest and sex with minors — sparked rebellion among gay and lesbian activists who had been largely biting their tongues since Obama won election. They had objected to the Rev. Rick Warren's invitation to participate in the inauguration despite his support for repealing gay marriage in California.

Their January protest won the invitation of Episcopal Bishop V. Gene Robinson, whose consecration as the first openly gay bishop divided and almost split his denomination.

Gays and lesbians later fretted as the White House declined to intervene in the cases of enlisted military members facing courts martial for defying the Clinton-era "don't ask, don't tell" policies. White House officials say they want Congress to repeal the policy as part of a "lasting and durable" solution, instead of intervening on individual cases.

"The president agreed that ... the policy wasn't working for our national interests, that he committed to change that policy, that he's working with the secretary of defense and the joint chiefs on making that happen," White House spokesman Robert Gibbs said last month.

In the meantime, the administration has tried to make small, quiet moves to extend benefits to gays and lesbians. The State Department has promised to give partners of gay and lesbian diplomats many benefits, such as diplomatic passports and language training.

But without a specific change in the Federal Employees' Health Benefits Program, Secretary of State Hillary Rodham Clinton's promises left out financial benefits such as pensions. Obama's move could make that shift.

Gay and lesbian activists had expected Obama to take action some time in June, which is gay pride month.

Richard Socarides, a New York attorney and former senior adviser on gay rights issues to President Bill Clinton, was taking a wait-and-see attitude on Obama's announcement.

"If it doesn't include health insurance, if he doesn't talk about the military and about the (Justice Department) brief, I think it will fall short," Socarides said in an e-mail late Tuesday. "Right now, people are looking for real action."

John Berry, the highest-ranking gay official in the administration and the de facto human resources chief for the administration, told a gay rally last weekend that Obama planned to take action on benefits soon.

Berry, who heads the Office of Personnel and Management, has repeatedly told reporters that he expected the White House to turn to legislation to give domestic partners access to federal health and retirement plans.

But Obama so far has sent only one piece of legislation to Congress — a pay-as-you-go measure that is part of his wooing of fiscally conservative Democrats.

Instead, Obama will use his signature instead of legislation to achieve the benefits parity sought by same-sex couples.

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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
HereForNow
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HUH?


« Reply #404 on: June 27, 2009, 09:21:01 am »



To explain money and it's system.
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