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WOW, JUST WOW...........

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Author Topic: WOW, JUST WOW...........  (Read 13007 times)
iwannano
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« Reply #300 on: June 12, 2009, 05:08:14 pm »

Harconen is what I am talking about when I say educate/convince. Even without knowing his personal story I can see no reason why he wouldn't be telling us the truth from his heart unless it is some new thing that makes you cool to describe how miserable living under a dictator can be.

You may say it will never happen here but these things don't happen overnight. The change is gradual until one day you wake up to a completely different country where it is your duty to work to support those who don't but vote the right way.

What can one do? Question everything, think things all the way through, think 10 years down the road, educate others with what you know and/or think, act with your vote and if that doesn't work act will civil disobedience. That was a sentence full of verbs but not the verb "wait" as in wait for someone else to do it for me.
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Harconen
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« Reply #301 on: June 12, 2009, 06:02:34 pm »

Harconen is what I am talking about when I say educate/convince. Even without knowing his personal story I can see no reason why he wouldn't be telling us the truth from his heart unless it is some new thing that makes you cool to describe how miserable living under a dictator can be.

You may say it will never happen here but these things don't happen overnight. The change is gradual until one day you wake up to a completely different country where it is your duty to work to support those who don't but vote the right way.

What can one do? Question everything, think things all the way through, think 10 years down the road, educate others with what you know and/or think, act with your vote and if that doesn't work act will civil disobedience. That was a sentence full of verbs but not the verb "wait" as in wait for someone else to do it for me.
       Thak you iwannano.You can see throe things.When I was finished army service in JNA, it was 1990.I was 19, and my paymant on jobe was about 2000$.Todey, for same job you have 300$.During 90-is it was abour 3-5$.Sanctions, like on Kuba.It's ended at 2000.Betwean 1990 and 2000, we have 4 war's,about 960.000 victims of war.
       I was angry on my President about that, like this yung man on Bush ( and worse ).But he was not  guilty.Bush also, Obama too.Not guity.NWO is.
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Harconen
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« Reply #302 on: June 12, 2009, 06:32:48 pm »

Victor Davis Hanson, a professor of classics and a brilliant conservative, deconstructs Obama’s many, many lies:

Politicians often go back on earlier promises, and they often exaggerate (remember Obama’s “10,000” who died in a Kansas tornado [12 perished], or his belief that properly inflating tires saves as much energy as offshore drilling can produce?). But the extent of Obama’s distortions suggests that he has complete confidence that observers in the media do not care — or at least do not care enough to inform the public.

The “Big Lie.” Team Obama says that Judge Sotomayor misspoke when she asserted that Latinas were inherently better judges than white males. Yet the people around Obama knew before Sotomayor was nominated that she has reiterated such racialist sentiments repeatedly over many years.

~snip~

Obama is a postmodernist. He believes that all truth is relative, and that assertions gain or lose credibility depending on the race, class, and gender of the speaker. In Obama’s case, his misleading narrative is intended for higher purposes. Thus it is truthful in a way that accurate facts offered by someone of a different, more privileged class and race might not be.

~snip~

our president is a product of a multicultural education: Facts either cannot be ascertained or do not matter, given that the overriding concern is to promote an equality of result among various contending groups. That is best done by inflating the aspirations of those without power, and deflating the “dominant narratives” of those with it.
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HereForNow
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HUH?


« Reply #303 on: June 12, 2009, 06:43:46 pm »

Let's hear the very words of JFK about a global conspiracy.
Look them up and what is going on is there.




http://bulletins.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=bulletin.read&authorID=200013926&messageID=6471074200
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Harconen
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« Reply #304 on: June 12, 2009, 09:31:00 pm »

 Cool

Now we can talk.And act.

HereForNow, 9000 karma + to you.
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Ignis Natura Renovandum Integra
Byron
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« Reply #305 on: June 13, 2009, 12:12:47 am »




"Let's agree to speak to the issue without verbally assaulting the person." 


Not his style, Horus......


A little projection going on here, Bianca?  How many names have you called Obama supporters?  Would you like me to go back and compile a list for you?  Just in the last page, you called them "groupies."

In any event, you can feel free to go back into my posts and see if I have called you any names, I haven't.
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Win One for the Lion



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Byron
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« Reply #306 on: June 13, 2009, 12:20:42 am »

Quote
No "dude", I am the guy from Montenegro.
And with my life experience, I can smell the ashes, when it is about to come.Just because of NWO I have 15 years of: war, depresion, inflation and all of South Europe - Balkan horrors.Yes, I know who is the real enemy.So, I am "qualified" to give you advice.Don't talk like that about your ex President Bush.See the action that hi did, plan of action, and see continuity of that plan todey, plan 100 years old.Forget Bush, Obama, Klinton, Kennedy.See behind things, and you will see the future of ashes, if you don't wake up.

My apologies, I misread you quoting Horus and mistakenly applied it to you.

But that does not change the fact that you are, in fact, most of you, in error.  If you certainly saw no "danger signs" of upcoming fascism with Bush and his many war crimes, you are certainly not in any position to attribute these same sorts of motives to Obama.  The fascism was under Bush, it has not continued under Obama.

Most of his actions - closing Guantonomo, drawing down the troops in Iraq, trying to keep the pictures of detainee abuse from being released, are an attempt to mop up the mess that Bush has left for him, they are NOT an attempt to seize new power.

If and when he starts ethnic cleansing like Milosevi, then you can tell me that I was wrong, until then, these ideas you have are simply a conspiracy theorists' fantasy.
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Win One for the Lion



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Byron
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« Reply #307 on: June 13, 2009, 12:54:26 am »

Quote
BTW, Byron, my apologies for insulting your intelligence with the "GED" comment. I didn't take kindly to being called a "fearmonger full of crap".  Let's agree to speak to the issue without verbally assaulting the person.  Wink

Fine by me, I don't have any hard feelings.

Quote
My comparison of Obama's proposed "civillian defense force" (to enforce "national security objectives" -whatever those are- and to be of equal strength and power to the existing military) to the formation of Nazi SS is a valid, historical comparison. 

First off, there isn't a "civilian defense force," it isn't even in the budget.  I am aware that there is a lot of propaganda about it on the internet, but do some homework and you will see he is not talking about a civilian army but a pool of volunteers with special skill set's, (Dr.s lawyers, engineers, etc.) who can be called upon at need to pitch in and do things the military is to stretched or unqualified to do.

With many of the National Guards sent overseas in Iraq, it is only logical to have some more reserves!  It is not a draft, there are no uiniforms, he is simply talking about public service, again, like Kennedy did with the Peace Corps.

What you are referring to is one speech, taken out of context, and blown up by the right wing media.  Look up his actual proposal, as oppposed to read the media propaganda.
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Win One for the Lion



Healthcare is a Right, Not a Privilige
Byron
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« Reply #308 on: June 13, 2009, 01:21:38 am »

Quote
BTW, Byron, my apologies for insulting your intelligence with the "GED" comment. I didn't take kindly to being called a "fearmonger full of crap".  Let's agree to speak to the issue without verbally assaulting the person.  Wink

Fine by me, I don't have any hard feelings. And I would also like to apologize to you for calling you an old geezer.  Smiley

Quote
My comparison of Obama's proposed "civillian defense force" (to enforce "national security objectives" -whatever those are- and to be of equal strength and power to the existing military) to the formation of Nazi SS is a valid, historical comparison. 

First off, there isn't a "civilian defense force," it isn't even in the budget.  I am aware that there is a lot of propaganda about it on the internet, but do some homework and you will see he is not talking about a civilian army but a pool of volunteers with special skill set's, (Dr.s lawyers, engineers, etc.) who can be called upon at need to pitch in and do things the military is to stretched or unqualified to do.

With many of the National Guards sent overseas in Iraq, it is only logical to have some more reserves.  It is not a draft, there are no uiniforms, he is simply talking about public service, again, like Kennedy did with the Peace Corps. Again, if you had no issues with Kennedy's plan, you shouldn't have any problem with Obama's.

What you are referring to is one speech, taken out of context, and blown up by the right wing media.  He uses the word, "army" rhetorically, not literally. Look up his actual proposal, as oppposed to read the media propaganda:

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/query/z?c111:H.R.1388:
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Win One for the Lion



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Byron
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« Reply #309 on: June 13, 2009, 01:37:53 am »

Quote
I've worked my ass off for 30 years to get to a comfortable point in my life and now I'm supposed to feel guilty because I can afford a nicer house, a nicer car or purchase a better private health care plan than someone just out of school. That's the dirty little secret no one talks about, the evil rich are supposed to be the guys who make all their money exploiting the less fortunate but more than likely the evil rich are people like most of you here who work, save, buy a house and sell it years later for more than you paid for it. Yes, that one year profit puts you in the evil rich category. That is the other secret of the evil rich group is that it is constantly in flux, one year your on the list and the next year you are not.

I am saying all that because although it may sound nice to want everyone to have health care we can't afford it and laying the burden on someone else, on top of being unfair, isn't sustainable. Not only do we never say thank you to those evil rich who pay most of the taxes but we demonize them for being rich because it makes us feel better when we hit them up for more of THEIR money.

I don't want my government telling me what kind of car to drive, how green my house should be or how much money I should make and we have a president now who believes that is the role of government and that scares me.

iwannano, I don't doubt that you worked hard and don't resent you for finally having things that you aspired to having.

What about all the people at GM and Chrysler who have been recently been laid off, as well as the millions of others that have also been laid off during this recession?  Do you think that any of them worked hard?  You are damned right they did, and they deserve better than a system where Wall Street plays fast and loose with the rules, where politicians are all bought and paid for by the rich corporations and where outsourcing has sent ALL our manufacturing overseas.

And, getting to heath care, GM and Chrysler may have never gone bankrupt had they not had to pay legacy costs for all their retirees health insurance.

And that is why we need NATIONAL HEALTH CARE.  You are not paying for other peoples' health care, we all are!  Your premiums rise because the only way people without health care get medical attention is to go to the emergency room.  Did you know that 61% of the people who declare bankruptcy in this country do it because of medical bills?  All it takes is one serious illness, heart disease or cancer, to wipe you out. People, in their declining years, deserve to go out with some dignity, not to let how much money they make decide whether they live or die.

Oh, and the decline in this country began with Reagan, when all the outsourcing started.  We used to manufacture everything here and were the worlds biggest exporter, now we are the worlds biggest importer and make nothing!  All  because of Reagan and his successors (even Clinton) practicing Reaganomics.  NAFTA, negotiated by George H.W. Bush, and signed by Clinton, was the death knell for American manufacturing. 

That is why I really have a hard time with everyone here apparently trying to blame Obama, ALL your prior leaders have betrayed you.
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Win One for the Lion



Healthcare is a Right, Not a Privilige
Winter Soldier
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« Reply #310 on: June 13, 2009, 02:01:11 am »

The comparisons with Hitler are actually more apt when dealing with Bush than Obama.  Both Hitler and Bush used false flag operations as excuses to seize more power for themselves: Hitler with the Reichstag Fire and Bush with the 9/11 attacks.

Too often in this country have its people laid down and allowed its government to steal their civil liberties.
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Bianca
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« Reply #311 on: June 13, 2009, 06:28:35 am »










                                                       Just Make Stuff Up



                                             President Obama’s war on the truth.






By Victor Davis Hanson
National Review
June 12, 2009

In the first six months of the Obama administration, we have witnessed an assault on the truth of a magnitude not seen since the Nixon Watergate years. The prevarication is ironic given the Obama campaign’s accusations that the Bush years were not transparent and that Hillary Clinton, like her husband, was a chronic fabricator. Remember Obama’s own assertions that he was a “student of history” and that “words mean something. You can’t just make stuff up.”

Yet Obama’s war against veracity is multifaceted.

Trotskyization. Sometimes the past is simply airbrushed away. Barack Obama has a disturbing habit of contradicting his past declarations as if spoken words did not mean much at all. The problem is not just that once-memorable statements about everything from NAFTA to public campaign financing were contradicted by his subsequent actions. Rather, these pronouncements simply were ignored to the point of making it seem they were never really uttered at all.

What is stunning about Obama’s hostile demagoguery about Bush’s War on Terror is not that he has now contradicted himself on one or two particulars. Instead, he has reversed himself on every major issue — renditions, military tribunals, intercepts, wiretaps, Predator drone attacks, the release of interrogation photos, Iraq (and, I think, soon Guantanamo Bay) — and yet never acknowledged these reversals.

Are we supposed to think that Obama was never against these protocols at all? Or that he still remains opposed to them even as he keeps them in place? Meanwhile, his attorney general, Eric Holder, is as voluble on the excesses of the Bush War on Terror as he is silent about his own earlier declarations that detainees in this war were not entitled to the protections of the Geneva Convention.

Politicians often go back on earlier promises, and they often exaggerate (remember Obama’s “10,000” who died in a Kansas tornado [12 perished], or his belief that properly inflating tires saves as much energy as offshore drilling can produce?). But the extent of Obama’s distortions suggests that he has complete confidence that observers in the media do not care — or at least do not care enough to inform the public.

The “Big Lie.” Team Obama says that Judge Sotomayor misspoke when she asserted that Latinas were inherently better judges than white males. Yet the people around Obama knew before Sotomayor was nominated that she has reiterated such racialist sentiments repeatedly over many years.

Obama complained that his deficits were largely inherited — even though his newly projected annual deficit and aggregate increase in the national debt may well, if they are not circumvented, equal all the deficit spending compiled by all previous administrations combined.

The president lectures Congress on its financial excesses. He advocates “pay as you go” budgeting. But he remains silent about the unfunded liabilities involved in his own proposals for cap-and-trade, universal health care, and education reform, which will in aggregate require well over a trillion dollars in new spending on top of existing deficits — but without any “pay as you go” proposals to fund them.

By the same token, his promise that 95 percent of Americans will receive an Obama “tax cut” is impossible. Remember, almost 40 percent of households currently pay no income taxes at all — and the $1.7-trillion annual deficit will necessitate a broad array of taxes well beyond those assessed on incomes above $250,000.

Obama talks about cutting federal outlays by eliminating $17 billion in expenditures — one-half of one percent of a $3.4-trillion budget. Here the gap between rhetoric and reality is already so wide that it simply makes no difference whether one goes completely beyond the limits of belief. Why would a liberal “budget hawk” go through the trouble of trying to cut 10 or 20 percent of the budget when he might as well celebrate a 0.5 percent cut and receive the same amount of credit or disdain? If one is going to distort, one might as well distort whole-hog.

Outright historical dissimulation. On matters of history, we now know that much of what President Obama says is either not factual or at least misleading. He predictably errs on the side of political correctness. During the campaign, there was his inaccurate account of his great-uncle’s role in liberating Auschwitz. In Berlin, he asserted that the world — rather than the American and British air forces — came together to pull off the Berlin Airlift.

In the Cairo speech, nearly every historical allusion was nonfactual or inexact: the fraudulent claims that Muslims were responsible for European, Chinese, and Hindu discoveries; the notion that a Christian Córdoba was an example of Islamic tolerance during the Inquisition; the politically correct canard that the Renaissance and Enlightenment were fueled by Arab learning; the idea that abolition and civil rights in the United States were accomplished without violence — as if 600,000 did not die in the Civil War, or entire swaths of Detroit, Gary, Newark, and Los Angeles did not go up in flames in the 1960s.

Here we see the omnipotent influence of Obama’s multicultural creed: Western civilization is unexceptional in comparison with other cultures, and history must be the story of an ecumenical, global shared brotherhood.
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Bianca
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« Reply #312 on: June 13, 2009, 06:32:07 am »








The half-, and less-than-half, truth. At other times, Obama throws out historical references that are deliberately incomplete. To placate critical hosts, he evokes the American dropping of the bomb. But he is silent about the impossible choices for the Allies — after Japanese atrocities in Manchuria, Korea, the Philippines, Iwo Jima, and Okinawa — facing the necessity of stopping a Japanese imperial killing machine, determined to fight to the death.

He lectures about equivalent culpability between Muslims and Americans without mentioning American largess to Egypt, Jordan, and the Palestinians. He mostly ignores American military efforts to save Muslims in Afghanistan, Bosnia, Kosovo, Kuwait, and Somalia — and American criticism of Russia’s and China’s treatment of their own persecuted Muslim minorities.

When Obama contextualizes the United States’ treatment of Muslims, does he do so in comparison to the Chinese treatment of the Uighurs, the Russians in Chechnya and Afghanistan, or the European colonial experience in North Africa?    

When he cites European colonialism’s pernicious role in the Middle East, does he mention nearly 400 years of Ottoman Muslim colonial rule in the Arab-speaking world? Or the Muslim world’s own role in sending several million sub-Saharan Africans to the Middle East as slaves? By no stretch of the imagination is purported Western bias against Islam commensurate with the Islamic threats that have been issued to Danish cartoonists, British novelists, the pope, or German opera producers.

Obama surely knows that a mosque is acceptable in America and Europe in a way that a church is not in most of the Gulf States, or that Muslims freely voice their beliefs in Rotterdam and Dearborn in a way Westerners dare not in Tehran, Damascus, or Riyadh.

Here we see the classic notion of the “noble lie,” or the assumption that facts are to be cited or ignored in accordance with the intended aim: Interfaith reconciliation means downplaying Muslim excesses, or treating Islamic felonies as equivalent with Western misdemeanors.

Why has President Obama developed a general disregard for the truth, in a manner far beyond typical politicians who run one way and govern another, or hide failures and broadcast successes?

First, he has confidence that the media will not be censorious and will simply accept his fiction as fact. A satirist, after all, could not make up anything to match the obsequious journalists who bow to their president, proclaim him a god, and receive sexual-like tingles up their appendages.

Second, Obama is a postmodernist. He believes that all truth is relative, and that assertions gain or lose credibility depending on the race, class, and gender of the speaker. In Obama’s case, his misleading narrative is intended for higher purposes. Thus it is truthful in a way that accurate facts offered by someone of a different, more privileged class and race might not be.

Third, Obama talks more than almost any prior president, weighing in on issues from Stephen Colbert’s haircut, to Sean Hannity’s hostility, to the need to wash our hands. In Obama’s way of thinking, his receptive youthful audiences are proof of his righteousness and wisdom — and empower him to pontificate on matters he knows nothing about.

Finally, our president is a product of a multicultural education: Facts either cannot be ascertained or do not matter, given that the overriding concern is to promote an equality of result among various contending groups. That is best done by inflating the aspirations of those without power, and deflating the “dominant narratives” of those with it.

The problem in the next four years will be not just that the president of the United States serially does not tell the truth. Instead, the real crisis in our brave new relativist world will be that those who demonstrate that he is untruthful will themselves be accused of lying.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2009, 01:47:49 pm by Bianca » Report Spam   Logged

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HereForNow
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HUH?


« Reply #313 on: June 13, 2009, 01:24:21 pm »

Hmm it seems that everything one can study about the awakening as we call it.
Is showing merit and has tested possitive.
The results of this are as followed.

1. We are manifesting all of this for the sake of a singular energy we are directing.

2. Everything that has been said here is being said differently but continuously.

3. This is appearent in a flowing pattern which consists of the same informations and ideas expressed.

4. Outside of what we discuss, people out there are reading us and finding something in what we are all discussing being something that they agree or disagree with strongly. Suggesting that what they feel personally is correct. The energy produced is not good energies because it makes nothing better.

5. No matter what we beleive is or isn't, the facts about everything. We also have to remember individual enviroments. As some people here are in school. Some working 8 to 12 hour days. Some are Moms and Dads. Some are teachers and still others who come to learn. It plays a huge role in the ways we preceive all things.

Questioning the world around is good. Questioning your own reasoning, is looking beyond what you think you know. This starts with what we learn about who and what we are outside of all the nonsence and chaos. These things we share with one another are good for making us more expressive.
However what knowledge of agenda is going to change the "Now" of our own motivations?
None I'm affraid! People must show better things in spirit and in all things that follow in order to endure.
Without this singal act of change regaurdless of the acts of others. We can change the world and the outcome of what follows. Standing at the base of a mammoth tree we look above to the many branches leading off the body of this divine creature.

As does our understanding, branch off of from the root.
So must what we learn about our real selves at their roots.
We are a baby in relation to the complete family in what we are connected with.
Forget what we learn blindly from outside of ourselves.
Embrace your feelings as a part of your better judgements.

Sure I will admit that I don't support Obama.
Sure I will also admit that I also don't support politics or many worldly ways.
One of the big reasons I refuse these things is because look at everything.
We can trust nothing we see nor hear from each other and even ourselves.
Yet no one here can say that everything in their own lives is perfect.

We take that something someone else is expressing is what they beleive. However many who post here answer before learning the whole picture. I catch myself doing it. You can agree or disagree that some of you might do this. However before we debate that too. Read you own posts from time to time.
Go back a year and see you having just about the same conversation about something that your having now. Somewhere in all of it you can see where your thinking was swayed and where it remained consistant with the majority. And you can see where your messages remained the same.

Right or wrong doesn't matter here.
Everyone is wrong. Everyone is right.
Debate result at the moment is being pulled in the direction of what is right and wrong.


 Roll Eyes
That can't be decided at the moment because we are all from different enviroments and systems.
What we think we know, is naturally going to be different.
We are not looking at this from a bird's-eye point of veiw sorta speak.
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HereForNow
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HUH?


« Reply #314 on: June 13, 2009, 01:47:37 pm »


 Wink


Main stream.


White House.
« Last Edit: June 13, 2009, 01:53:11 pm by HereForNow » Report Spam   Logged

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