Science, the Bible & Evolution

[Brooke]

oscar

Member
Member # 1390

Rate Member   posted 12-13-2005 08:54 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
www.answersingenesis.org/docs/4145.asp
www.innovations-report.com/html/reports/medicine_health/report_13412.html
www.s8int.com/adamsrib.html
www.hon.ch/News/HSN/514201.html
www.sitchin.com/adamgene.htm
www.sitchin.com/primate.htm
www.sitchin.com/adam.htm
www.sitchin.com/images/adam1.jpg
www.s8int.com/article1-simple.html
www.origins.rpi.edu/clayandtheoriginsoflife.html
I know Brooke is uncapable to read all the links I provided and make intelligent comments. You can read about ribs and clay (even type "montmorillonite" that helps the cell to use RNA as main process in life. Sumerian and Hebrew record knew better than the modern discoveries backing up that account.
Sorry Brooke, I tried to have a logic argument with you and provided specific data. If that pisses you off and the only thing you will answer is the same litter "is a fact, is a fact, is a fact", no logic conversation is possible.
I don't have the time or energy to teach everything your incompetent brain ignores. You quote the text making fun of it. Do you have any idea what's the meaning of 'soul' in Hebrew? The word is "nephesh" also meaning blood and life. Human beings (Adam means "man") breath with the nostrils and yet what provides oxygen is blood taking it from lungs and then carrying it to the whole body. Adam becoming a living soul but his name and all these words are linked with blood, important in the process of becoming a LIVING soul and the word "neshama" meaning "breathing".
You feel too cocky but I have to say you're not like Ishtar. She's smart, learns and even contradicts with wisdom. You're just another empty head passing by. You know nothing of my faith cos I haven't said all the things I believe. I agree with some concepts of creationist but not all of them. There are many alternatives that fit like a glove with Deluge geological evidence, not just the canopy but the water under the surface of the earth in Panthalassa and Pangea times.
Spock out!

--------------------
inca
 

[Brooke]

oscar

Member
Member # 1390

Rate Member   posted 12-13-2005 09:06 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I reckon you're sceptical person. Okey dokey. Lemme remind you scientists have discovered there's 5 times more water hidden in molten layers of rock near earth's core than water in oceans. So the "poetry' used not only in the Bible hides scientific truth:
www.thetruthishere.com/canopy.html
http://news.nationalgeographic.com.news/2002/03/0307_0307_waterworld.html
www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1998/11/981114120138.htm
www.sciencedaily.com/releases/1997/12/971217071316.htm
www.seekers.100megs6.com/UFOManOceansUnderEarth.htm
Deep water locked away in crystal lattices instead of pooling in Jules Verne's giant underground seas of his Journey To The Centre of the Earth.
An example of poetry in case you didn't notice (before I rest my case with your incompetence) is the craftman working with clay to make pots. Has it ever occured to you the movement of the clay in order to make a jar or a pot? Rotatory right? Well, my dearrrr preciousssss ignorant, the Bible says in the book of Job, that the earth is like the clay in the hands of that artist before science discovered rotation of the planet. In fact of you wanna talk about math and concepts of 360 degrees, 7th day (sabbath) in a year of 365 days and 12 months and 12 hours by day and night we can still rewind things from the past, including Hebrews, Mayans, Sumerians and Egyptians. Hence we still follow myth in science. Bye bye stupid!

--------------------
inca
 

[Brooke]

Ishtar

Member
Member # 736

  posted 12-13-2005 09:11 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, we certainly are a miracle, regardless,

http://www.reasons.org/resources/apologetics/design_evidences/200406_fine_tuning_for_life_on_earth.shtml

--------------------
“Ad initio, alea iacta est.”
And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
it's Later Than You Think
 

[Brooke]

oscar

Member
Member # 1390

Rate Member   posted 12-13-2005 09:21 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ishtar, thanks for the link. There have been many documentaries of the device in Ararat. The region is difficult to climb and it's difficult to say if what has been found is the ark or not mainly due to the environment. Yet, the very fact a huge object has been found there and known for generations with the testimony of several climbers and even people who have photographed the object which is large makes us think what other thing could be? Unless people get cynical and deny everything as 100% bull$hit which is even as absurd as believe everything without investigation.
Stupid people would think all mountains of the planet had the same size as today and wonder about Andes or Himalayas high mountains with snow in Deluge times! It's a geological scientific fact that mountians were smaller in the past and they have been increasing size with the passing of time due to several reasons too many to explain for them now...

--------------------
inca
 

[Brooke]

johnee

Member
Member # 1580

  posted 12-13-2005 09:30 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If Adam and Eve were the last thing created, before their creator took the seventh day off, then on what day were they created?

Duh, it wasn’t day five was it now. 

[Brooke]

oscar

Member
Member # 1390

Rate Member   posted 12-13-2005 09:31 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regarding your last link, I can only say this, Ishtar. Scientist DO TRUST in laws of the universe but most of them in arrogance believed it's possible to be laws without Lawgiver!!! When they observe a rudimentary head of arrow, they admit someone (unknown) made it. Yet they watch DNA with so many letters of information and could fit thousands of volumes of Britanic Encyclopedia and yet they say it's the result of ...how can I express it....chain reaction of coincidences! The math used by Stephen Hawking in that sense has been defied by other physicists.

--------------------
inca
 

[Brooke]

oscar

Member
Member # 1390

Rate Member   posted 12-13-2005 09:36 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Johnee. First I repeat according to Hebrew text we're not dealing with "creation" but merely "formation". The couple was formed ending the 6th day like "Adam" Arnold Schwarzenegger in 6th Day (Freemason hidden message).

--------------------
inca

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posts: 3395 | From: belo horizonte, brazil | Registered: Feb 2003  |  IP: Logged |   

[Brooke]

johnee

Member
Member # 1580

  posted 12-13-2005 09:52 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Created or formed on the sixth day, agreed oscar, not the fifth as Brooke corrected me in another string. Trashing the first page of the bible seems to have become an internet obsession, the world wide web is my best candidate for the **** of Babylon. 

[Brooke]

Ishtar

Member
Member # 736

  posted 12-13-2005 10:13 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
best candidate for the **** of Babylon.

boy you got that right

and oscar i never thought about the mountains being smaller, yes they would have been,

--------------------
“Ad initio, alea iacta est.”
And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
it's Later Than You Think
 

[Brooke]

Ishtar

Member
Member # 736

  posted 12-13-2005 10:41 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.kaibab.org/geology/gc_geol.htm

--------------------
“Ad initio, alea iacta est.”
And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
it's Later Than You Think
 
http://forums.atlantisrising.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=15;t=000522;p=2

[Brooke]

Tom Hebert1
Member
Member # 2835

  posted 12-13-2005 11:37 AM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
That is the orthodox view. But do you believe it? 

[Brooke]

Ishtar

Member
Member # 736

  posted 12-13-2005 03:48 PM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I got sidetracked Tom, I am still working on the mountain thingy.

--------------------
“Ad initio, alea iacta est.”
And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.
it's Later Than You Think
 

[Brooke]

Ishtar

Member
Member # 736

  posted 12-13-2005 04:10 PM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
http://www.nwcreation.net/noahsightings.html
 

[Brooke]

Brooke

Member
Member # 2806

Member Rated:
   posted 12-13-2005 09:29 PM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Gee Oscar, it’s obvious I touched a nerve with you else you wouldn’t have left me posts riddled with such insults and anger. Oscar! Why so defensive? Don’t tell me you’re one of those pinheads that needs to have science confirm his faith in every way possible! Are you that insecure in your beliefs? Well, I have news for you, IT DOESN’T.
You have to reach to make even the most transparent corroboration. Your buddies here, Johnee and Ishtar might support everything you have to say, but creationism is the joke of the scientific community and everyone else know it.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm quoting Hebrew words you didn't even know. I was specific using knowledge written by Maimonides and others centuries ago. You're depending on your own interpretation quoting from Christians. I said inform yourself better.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

What you’re talking about is an interpretation, genius. Maimonides wrote millennia after the Bible was written. How is he anymore qualified to say what the original writers of the Bible meant?

The literal interpretation, based on the genealogies in Genesis and later parts of the Bible, both Jews and Christians have independently worked backwards to find the implied time of the Creation of the world, around the beginning of the 4th millennium BC. This is based on a literal reading of the creation account and the bases that the six days in which God created the heavens and the earth were 24-hour days, that Adam, Eve, and the Garden of Eden existed.

And eight out of ten fundies still believe that.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I said the Bible is not a scientific book and yet what is mentioned is scientific. I'm quoting data for the readers to read, you write your opinion without even knowing Hebrew words. Pathetic! It's not needed to paste ALL THE TEXT, just write specific part to help us understand your point of view step by step.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

You’re in no position to talk down to me. You’re a zealot, not a scientist, searching through science for anything to justify your faith. If you were really a scientist, you would actually be interested in finding out how it all began. You’re not interested in the truth, you wouldn’t even bother to make statements like “evolution didn’t happen” or whatever garbage way you phrased it if you were. Any fool can see that evolution did happen to some extent and only Bible thumping fundies are the ones that try and say it played no part at all.


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Bible doesn't say what you think is saying in "traditional" way. The very Genesis 1:1 says "in the beginning heaven and earth was created" . All possible time -including millions of years- are including in that "beginning" which is an echo of the Big Bang, a term invented by people like Fred Hoyle who were using it as mythology. I quoted Job which mentions earth hangs on "nothing" which is the same thing scientists say now while other civilizations believed earth was upon elephants, turtles, etc. It seems you ALSO ignore comparative mythology.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Bunk!
The first damned line in the Bible is, “In the beginning God created heaven and earth.” It couldn’t get more clearer than that! Do you want to discuss science and the Bible or do you want to keep trying to revise things so you don’t have to discuss it?


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
When you wrote "Sure, you're trying to impress science upon sections of the Bible where it isn't even there. The Bible doesn't say any of that stuff. Only, "And God said let there be light." I recomend you TO READ THE TEXT I'M QUOTING IN ISAIAH AND SEARCH THE MEANING OF THE HEBREW WORD MEANING BLACK FIRE. Not "only" what you think was written. Also be aware that was Jewish mysticism known by them and not stupid ignorant Christians. I specifically showed you the text to read and it seems you lack that skill as well.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Why? Because I don’t agree with you? 99% of the scientific community doesn’t agree with you and the other 1% are brainwashed by their upbringing. The Jews who wrote the Bible could not POSSIBLY have known how the universe was created, like I said before. Or did someone from heaven tell them? So any translation that might fit anything to do with modern science would be (at best) a vague coincidence.
By your own mythos who was even there in the beginning but God??
Why would God even tell any of them how he did it?
Do you realize how dumb you look to even keep arguing this point?
Man, use some logic, will you?

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In fact in Genesis it says "let there be" and not "create" which is additional evidence of what I said. I don't wanna impress but if my saying upset you is due to the fact I'm impressing you and that won't be admitted by you. Hehehehe!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Oh, yeah, I’m impressed alright. By how much of a hopeless ZEALOT you turned out to be!

[ 12-13-2005, 09:31 PM: Message edited by: Brooke ]

--------------------
"The most incomprehensible thing about our universe is that it can be comprehended." - Albert Einstein
 

[Brooke]

Brooke

Member
Member # 2806

Member Rated:
   posted 12-13-2005 09:33 PM                       
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brooke, it seems the one who is trying to teach faith in evolution here is you as religious person. I'm not even talking about God or my faith. I'm discussing the Bible cos that the theme too but I could also mention Brahma's Big Day and Night which is very similar to "modern" concept of Big Bang and Big Crunch or I could write about Chinese myths about dwarfs and "eggs" a term used in modern "science". So, let me say you haven't developed telepatic habilities to ay for sure you know my faith cos I haven't written about that. Even when you make fun of the I Am What I Am youy're quoting from a poor translation of "eyeh asher eyeh" that in no case was I Am (that's "ani hu" in case you wanna know and is not present in the text of the revelation of God's name).
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Don’t back away from your beliefs!
You’re a Christian fundie that only accepts the science that supports what you’ve been taught since a youngster about God and the universe. Creationists like yourself are always trying to poke holes in evolution, but it is still the most plausible theory, Just because a few clues might be missing doesn’t mean the entire theory is invalid. Religious fundamentalists are the only ones that suggest it does.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The repetition "is a fact is a fact is a fact" doesn't make it a fact but a clear and subjective feeling about what you want it to be. I quoted genetic specialist Rebecca Cann and I could show more but it seems you're not providing enough data.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

How much more data should I provide?
Most people who study this already know the reasoning behind the Big Bang and Evolution. Say the word and I’ll explain it to you again.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The text in Hebrew doesn't mention "modern" clasification of animals. It's just a word written BEFORE SCIENTISTS DID THE MODERN CLASSIFICATION.If you can't see that, you're not ignorant (which is not a sin anyway), you are imbecil!!!
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Way to back off on your earlier gaffe that “genes” were mentioned in the Bible. You call ME the imbecile.
IMBECILE!


quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The text mentions "kind".
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

every creeping thing of the earth after his kind.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I suppose there are not too many philosophers and inventors in human female because much % of women are interested in other things. Not lack of intelligence but other use of brain hemisphere. Is happening with you.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I’m not the one who believes every creeping thing after it’s kind was loaded aboard a 400 ft long ark, Oscar, YOU ARE.

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 I told you, if you wanna open a tread about evolution, go ahead and make my day. This is not the isssue so don't beat around the bush. In the text it never says Noah had to put ALL THE ANIMALS OF THE PLANET. That is absurd and the text doesn't say that unless I'm taking with someone who can only read a fistful of translations ignoring Hebrew. Two or 7 of a "kind" indicates a specification known by Noah and so I said do your homework and you will know how many mammals , birds , reptiles, etc, were needed to form all possible species on earth. I won't do it. You just repeated the same stupidity you wrote before.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Read it yourself:
6:17 And, behold, I, even I, do bring a flood of waters upon the earth, to destroy all flesh, wherein is the breath of life, from under heaven; and every thing that is in the earth shall die.
6:18 But with thee will I establish my covenant; and thou shalt come into the ark, thou, and thy sons, and thy wife, and thy sons' wives with thee.
6:19 And of every living thing of all flesh, two of every sort shalt thou bring into the ark, to keep them alive with thee; they shall be male and female.
6:20 Of fowls after their kind, and of cattle after their kind, of every creeping thing of the earth after his kind, two of every sort shall come unto thee, to keep them alive.
If you’re going to call the Bible stupid, I guess your God will get you for that.

[ 12-13-2005, 09:34 PM: Message edited by: Brooke ]

--------------------
"The most incomprehensible thing about our universe is that it can be comprehended." - Albert Einstein