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Pagan Beliefs vs. Christianity (A Second Darkness Covers the Lands)

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Author Topic: Pagan Beliefs vs. Christianity (A Second Darkness Covers the Lands)  (Read 6337 times)
Heather Delaria
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« Reply #15 on: March 08, 2007, 01:57:33 am »

Pagan classifications
Pagan subdivisions coined by Isaac Bonewits [2]


Paleo-Paganism: A Pagan culture that has not been disrupted by other civilizations or other cultures. This does not include any known cultures. Indeed, this absolutely, by definition, cannot include any sort of living culture, since all cultures have been "disrupted" by their neighbors to some extent or another.
Meso-Paganism: A group, which is, or has been, influenced by a conquering culture, but has been able to maintain an independence of religious practices. This includes Native Americans and Australian Aborigine Bushmen.
Syncreto-Paganism: A culture, which has been conquered but adopts and merges the conquering culture's religious practices with their own. This includes Haitian Vodou, and Santería.
Neo-Paganism: An attempt by modern people to reconnect with nature, pre-Christian religions, or other nature-based spiritual paths. This definition includes such religions as Ásatrú, Neo-Druidism, and Wicca.
This system of classification completely leaves out any possibility of classifying Hindu religions or Shinto as "paganism", due to Hinduism and Shinto being the religions of dominant cultures (India and Japan). Likewise, it would exclude the state religion of the pre-Christian Roman Empire.

These subdivisions are circulated on the Internet as 'anthropological' definitions of Paganism, but they do not derive from anthropology.

Pagan religions

Ancient Greek religion
Roman religion
Finnish paganism
Ancient Near East Paganism
Paganism in the Eastern Alps
Uniterranism

Neopaganism


In another sense, as used by modern practitioners, paganism is a polytheistic, panentheistic or pantheistic often nature-based religious practice, but again can be atheism sometimes as well. This includes reconstructed religions such as Hellenismos, Ásatrú as well as more recently founded religions such as Wicca c. 1960, and these are normally categorised as "Neopaganism". Although Neopagans often refer to themselves simply as "Pagan", for purposes of clarity this article will focus on the ancient religion, while Neopaganism is discussed in its own article.

This also includes religions such as Forn Sed, Celtic Neo-druidism, Longobardic odinism, Lithuanian Romuva, and Slavic Rodoverie that claim to revive an ancient religion rather than reconstruct it, though in general the difference is not absolutely fixed. Many of these revivals, Wicca, Asatru and Neo-druidism in particular, have their roots in 19th century Romanticism and retain noticeable elements of occultism or theosphy that were current then, setting them apart from historical rural (paganus) folk religion. The Íslenska Ásatrúarfélagið is a notable exception in that it was derived more or less directly from remnants in rural folklore. Still, some practitioners even of syncretized directions tend to object to the term "Neopaganism" for their religion as they consider what they are doing not to be a new thing. It must be said, also, that since the 1990s, the number of reconstructionist movements that reject romantic or occult influences has increased, even if those Neopagans who make a conscious effort to separate pre-Christian from romantic influences are still a minority.

Modern nature religion
Many current Pagans in industrial societies base their beliefs and practices on a connection to Nature, and a divinity within all living things, but this may not hold true for all forms of Paganism, past or present. Some believe that there are many deities, while some believe that the combined subconscious spirit of all living things forms the universal deity. Paganism predates modern monotheism, although its origins are lost in prehistory. Ancient paganism, which tended in many cases to be a deification of the local deity, as Athena in Athens, saw each local emanation as an aspect of an Olympian deity during the Classical period and then after Alexander to syncretize the deity with the political process, with "state divinities" increasingly assigned to various localities, as Roma personified Rome. Many ancient regimes would claim to be the representative on earth of these gods, and would depend on more or less elaborate bureaucracies of state-supported priests and scribes to lend public support to their claims. This is something paganism shares with more 'mainstream' revealed religions, as can be seen in the history of the Catholic church, the Church of England and the ancient and current trends in Islam.

In one well-established sense, paganism is the belief in any non-monotheistic religion, which would mean that the Pythagoreans of ancient Greece would not be considered pagan in that sense, since they were monotheist, but not in the Abrahamic tradition. In an extreme sense, and like the pejorative sense below, any belief, ritual or pastime not sanctioned by a religion accepted as orthodox by those doing the describing, such as Burning Man, Halloween, or even Christmas, can be described as pagan by the person or people who object to them.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paganism
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« Reply #16 on: March 08, 2007, 01:58:25 am »



The pentagram within a circle, a symbol of faith used by many Wiccans, sometimes called a pentacle.
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« Reply #17 on: March 08, 2007, 02:03:23 am »

Hi Heather

What do you think about this?


Many current Pagans in industrial societies base their beliefs and practices on a connection to Nature, and a divinity within all living things, but this may not hold true for all forms of Paganism, past or present. Some believe that there are many deities, while some believe that the combined subconscious spirit of all living things forms the universal deity.
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Heather Delaria
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« Reply #18 on: March 08, 2007, 02:12:46 am »

Well, I have to admit that the definition of modern paganism and Wicca is a lot different from what it used to be in the past. Back then, pagans did worship many deities, some still do. For me, it actually means more like worship of the earth and nature. At our best, we are one with the earth and the earth is a part of us, and we carry it with us in everything we do.
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« Reply #19 on: March 08, 2007, 02:18:07 am »

Roman persecutions in Non-Biblical Sources
Aside from the occasional lynching, the first organized, state-supported persecution of Christians is the one initiated by Nero in 64 AD, in a search for scapegoats after the Great Fire of Rome. Though accepted as fact by many, the "persecution" of Nero is considered by some to be an anachronism. The only reference we have comes from the Roman historian Cornelius Tacitus in his annals. He refers to the victims of persecution as "Christians" though this was not known to be a common label for the faith at the time. Nevertheless, the Acts of the Apostles, written by an assistant to Paul, notes the use of the term in Syria before 50 a.d. (Acts 11:26). 1 Peter 4:16 also uses the term in a letter to Asia Minor.

The text in question is:

Nero looked around for a scapegoat, and inflicted the most fiendish tortures on a group of persons already hated for their crimes. This was the sect known as Christians. Their founder, one Christus, had been put to death by the procurator, Pontius Pilate in the reign of Tiberius. This checked the abominable superstition for a while, but it broke out again and spread, not merely through Judea, where it originated, but even to Rome itself, the great reservoir and collecting ground for every kind of depravity and filth. Those who confessed to being Christians were at once arrested, but on their testimony a great crowd of people were convicted, not so much on the charge of arson, but of hatred of the entire human race.-- Book 15, Chapter 44

Some comminators believe that it is unlikely that such hatred of an obscure sect could have developed so rapidly, especially since this obscure sect did not have a distinctive name for itself and was considered by outsiders to be part of a much larger sect, Judaism. Although Church Father's emphatically try to make the case for widespread persecution of Christians at their present time and in the past, no Christian (or non-Christian) author quotes the reference to the "Neronian persecution" until the 5th century, when it is quoted by the apologist Sulpicius Severus in a work replete with anachronisms and fanciful miracles. Indeed, some "Christians", if one could call the sect in its early stages of development that, may indeed have been persecuted for their religious ideals, though it would have been mere venting of Roman anti-Semitism at the obscure "Jewish" sect after the costly and foolhardy revolts in Judea, and not particular hatred of these people for worshipping "Christus."

By the mid 2nd century, mobs could be found willing to throw stones at Christians, and they might be mobilized by rival sects. Lucian tells of an elaborate and successful hoax perpretrated by a "prophet" of Asclepius, using a tame snake, in Pontus and Paphlygonia. When rumor seemed about to expose his fraud, the witty essayist reports in his scathing essay Alexander the false prophet,

he issued a promulgation designed to scare them, saying that Pontus was full of atheists and Christians who had the hardihood to utter the vilest abuse of him; these he bade them drive away with stones if they wanted to have the god gracious.
Further state persecutions were desultory until the persecution under Diocletian and more so Galerius that began in 303 AD. The persecution under Decius from the winter of 250 to the following spring of 251 martyred Pope Fabian, Bishop of Rome, involved Cyprian, bishop of Carthage, in controversy, and figures large in the founding myths of the seven bishops sent to Christianize Gaul, but finds no confirmation outside the vita of Cyprian composed by Pontius the deacon and writings in the hagiographic tradition. Gregory of Tours glosses the persecutions in his "History of the Franks" written in the decade before 594:

"Under the emperor Decius many persecutions arose against the name of Christ, and there was such a slaughter of believers that they could not be numbered. Babillas, bishop of Antioch, with his three little sons, Urban, Prilidan and Epolon, and Xystus, bishop of Rome, Laurentius, an archdeacon, and Hyppolitus, were made perfect by martyrdom because they confessed the name of the Lord. Valentinian and Novatian were then the chief heretics and were active against our faith, the enemy urging them on. At this time seven men were ordained as bishops and sent into the Gauls to preach, as the history of the martyrdom of the holy martyr Saturninus relates. For it says: " In the consulship of Decius and Gratus, as faithful memory recalls, the city of Toulouse received the holy Saturninus as its first and greatest bishop." These bishops were sent: bishop Catianus to Tours; bishop Trophimus to Arles; bishop Paul to Narbonne; bishop Saturninus to Toulouse; bishop Dionisius to Paris; bishop Stremonius to Clermont, bishop Martial to Limoges." (Book i.30-31)

Christian sources aver that a decree was issued requiring public sacrifice, a formality equivalent to a testimonial of allegiance to the Emperor and the established order. Decius authorized roving commissions visiting the cities and villages to supervise the execution of the sacrifices and to deliver written certificates to all citizens who performed them. Christians were often given opportunities to avoid further punishment by publicly offering sacrifices or burning incense to Roman gods, and were accused by the Romans of impiety when they refused. Refusal was punished by arrest, imprisonment, torture, and executions. Christians fled to safe havens in the countryside and some purchased their certificates, called libelli. Several councils held at Carthage debated the extent to which the community should accept these lapsed Christians.

It should be noted that today massive numbers of martyrs claimed by the early Church during these persecutions are not generally accepted by scholars. Gibbon, in The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire, estimates that "the whole might consequently amount to about fifteen hundred ... an annual consumption of 150 martyrs." The Western provinces were little affected, and even in the East where Christianity was recognized as a growing threat, the persecutions were light and sporadic. Claims of martyrdom were exaggerated by the early Church Fathers in order to gain converts.

The career and writings of Cyprian, bishop of Carthage, throw light on the aftermath of the Decian persecutions in the Carthaginian Christian community. (Fuller details are at the entry Cyprian.)

Some early Christians sought out and welcomed their persecutions:

Roman authorities tried hard to avoid Christians because they "goaded, chided, belittled and insulted the crowds until they demanded their death.";193; One man shouted to the Roman officials: "I want to die! I am a Christian," leading the officials to respond: "If they wanted to kill themselves, there was plenty of cliffs they could jump off.";194; But the Christians, following Tertullian's dicta that "martyrdom is required by God," forced their own martyrdom so they could die in an ecstatic trance: "Although their tortures were gruesome, the martyrs did not suffer, enjoying their analgesic state."195 [4]

The conditions under which martyrdom was an acceptable fate or under which it was suicidally embraced occupied writers of the early Christian Church. Broadly speaking, martyrs were considered uniquely exemplary of the Christian faith, and few early saints were not also martyrs. However, suicide is murder, and is associated with treason to the faith - the very opposite of martyrdom - the way of Judas the traitor, not of Jesus the savior. This confusion of early Christians over the values of martyrdom led to some breakaways from the Church in Rome, most notably the Donatists. Their was one sect, the Circumcellions, AKA the "agonostici", Latin for "fighter", and root of our English word "antagonist", that is of special regard in this matter. The Circumcellions had come to regard martyrdom as the true Christian virtue (as Church Father Tertullian said, a martyr’s death day was actually his birthday), and thus came to disregard chastity, sobriety, humbleness, charity, and most of the other good things we today associate with Christianity. Instead, they focused on bringing about their martyrdom-- by any means possible. Since Jesus had told Peter to put down his sword in the Garden of Gethsemane, the Circumcellions piously avoided bladed weapons and instead opted for the use of blunt clubs, which they called "Isrealites." Using their "Israelites", the Circumcellions would attack random travelers on the road, while shouting "Praise the Lord!" in Latin. The object of these random beatings was the death of the intrepid martyr, who hoped that clobbering someone over the head with an "Israelite" would provoke said person to send the happy Circumcellion straight to Heaven. Since the Circumcellions did not bother themselves with chastity or poverty, they often cavorted with the opposite (or same!) sex and would kill and rob those unfortunate travelers who did not assist their "martyrdom" with a sufficiently potent counter-attack. When the "Israelite" method failed, the determined Circumcellion would obtain his martyrdom through a not-so-quick dip in the pool, or a one way ticket off the nearest cliffside. The 2nd century Martyrdom of Polycarp, records the story of Quintus, a Christian who handed himself over to the Roman authorities, but turned coward and sacrificed to the Roman gods when he saw the wild beasts in the colosseum: "For this reason therefore, brothers, we do not praise those who hand themselves over, since the gospel does not so teach." John the Evangelist never accused Jesus of suicide or self-destruction, but rather says that Jesus chose not to resist arrest and crucifixion.

Early persecutions outside the Roman Empire
In 337, a spate in the ongoing hostilities between Sassanid Persia and the Roman Empire led to anti-Christian persecutions by the Persians of Christians who were perceived as potentially treacherous friends to a Christianized Rome under Constantine. Over the next few decades, thousands of Christians died. In the 3rd and 4th centuries, Christian missionaries, most successfully Ulfilas converted the Goths to Arian Christianity, which the Goths saw as an attack on their religion and culture. The Visigoth King Athanaric began persecuting Christians, many of whom were killed. In the 5th and 6th century, Arianism became prevalent among the Goths; during their forays into Italy, Gaul (France) and Spain they destroyed many churches and killed a number of Christian clergy.

In 429 the Vandals (who were Arians) conquered Roman Africa. Catholics were discriminated against; Catholic Church property was confiscated. Thousands of Catholics were banished from Vandal held territory.

The New Catholic Encyclopedia notes that "Ancient, medieval and early modern hagiographers were inclined to exaggerate the number of martyrs. Since the title of martyr is the highest title to which a Christian can aspire, this tendency is natural". Estimates of Christians killed for religious reasons before the year 313 vary greatly, depending on the scholar quoted, from a high of almost 100,000 to a low of 10,000.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Christians
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« Reply #20 on: March 08, 2007, 02:23:09 am »

Nero Persecutes The Christians, 64 A.D.



A Roman mosaic shows prisoners
put to death in the arena
as part of a festival


A generation after the death of Christ, Christianity had reached Rome in the form of an obscure offshoot of Judaism popular among the city's poor and destitute. Members of this religious sect spoke of the coming of a new kingdom and a new king. These views provoked suspicion among the Jewish authorities who rejected the group and fear among the Roman authorities who perceived these sentiments as a threat to the Empire.

In the summer of 64, Rome suffered a terrible fire that burned for six days and seven nights consuming almost three quarters of the city. The people accused the Emperor Nero for the devastation claiming he set the fire for his own amusement. In order to deflect these accusations and placate the people, Nero laid blame for the fire on the Christians. The emperor ordered the arrest of a few members of the sect who, under torture, accused others until the entire Christian populace was implicated and became fair game for retribution. As many of the religious sect that could be found were rounded up and put to death in the most horrific manner for the amusement of the citizens of Rome. The ghastly way in which the victims were put to death aroused sympathy among many Romans, although most felt their execution justified.

Beginnings of Christian Martyrdom

The following account was written by the Roman historian Tacitus in his book Annals published a few years after the event. Tacitus was a young boy living in Rome during the time of the persecutions.

"Therefore, to stop the rumor [that he had set Rome on fire], he [Emperor Nero] falsely charged with guilt, and punished with the most fearful tortures, the persons commonly called Christians, who were [generally] hated for their enormities. Christus, the founder of that name, was put to death as a criminal by Pontius Pilate, procurator of Judea, in the reign of Tiberius, but the pernicious superstition - repressed for a time, broke out yet again, not only through Judea, - where the mischief originated, but through the city of Rome also, whither all things horrible and disgraceful flow from all quarters, as to a common receptacle, and where they are encouraged. Accordingly first those were arrested who confessed they were Christians; next on their information, a vast multitude were convicted, not so much on the charge of burning the city, as of "hating the human race."

In their very deaths they were made the subjects of sport: for they were covered with the hides of wild beasts, and worried to death by dogs, or nailed to crosses, or set fire to, and when the day waned, burned to serve for the evening lights. Nero offered his own garden players for the spectacle, and exhibited a Circensian game, indiscriminately mingling with the common people in the dress of a charioteer, or else standing in his chariot. For this cause a feeling of compassion arose towards the sufferers, though guilty and deserving of exemplary capital punishment, because they seemed not to be cut off for the public good, but were victims of the ferocity of one man."

References:
Carrington, Phillip, The Early Christian Church (1957); Davis, William Stearns, Readings In Ancient History (1913); Duruy, Victor, History of Rome and the Roman People, vol V (1883).

http://www.eyewitnesstohistory.com/christians.htm
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« Reply #21 on: March 08, 2007, 02:24:41 am »

The Burning of Rome, 64 AD


During the night of July 18, 64 AD, fire broke out in the merchant area of the city of Rome. Fanned by summer winds, the flames quickly spread through the dry, wooden structures of the Imperial City. Soon the fire took on a life of its own consuming all in its path for six days and seven nights. When the conflagration finally ran its course it left seventy percent of the city in smoldering ruins.

Rumors soon arose accusing the Emperor Nero of ordering the torching of the city and standing on the summit of the Palatine playing his lyre as flames devoured the world around him. These rumors have never been confirmed. In fact, Nero rushed to Rome from his palace in Antium (Anzio) and ran about the city all that first night without his guards directing efforts to quell the blaze. But the rumors persisted and the Emperor looked for a scapegoat. He found it in the Christians, at that time a rather obscure religious sect with a small following in the city. To appease the masses, Nero literally had his victims fed to the lions during giant spectacles held in the city's remaining amphitheater.

From the ashes of the fire rose a more spectacular Rome. A city made of marble and stone with wide streets, pedestrian arcades and ample supplies of water to quell any future blaze. The debris from the fire was used to fill the malaria-ridden marshes that had plagued the city for generations.

The Horror of Fire

The historian Tacitus was born in the year 56 or 57 probably in Rome. He was in Rome during the great fire. During his lifetime he wrote a number of histories chronicling the reigns of the early emperors. The following eye witness account comes from his final work The Annals written around the year 116.

"...Now started the most terrible and destructive fire which Rome had ever experienced. It began in the Circus, where it adjoins the Palatine and Caelian hills. Breaking out in shops selling inflammable goods, and fanned by the wind, the conflagration instantly grew and swept the whole length of the Circus. There were no walled mansions or temples, or any other obstructions, which could arrest it. First, the fire swept violently over the level spaces. Then it climbed the hills - but returned to ravage the lower ground again. It outstripped every counter-measure. The ancient city's narrow winding streets and irregular blocks encouraged its progress.

Terrified, shrieking women, helpless old and young, people intent on their own safety, people unselfishly supporting invalids or waiting for them, fugitives and lingerers alike - all heightened the confusion. When people looked back, menacing flames sprang up before them or outflanked them. When they escaped to a neighboring quarter, the fire followed - even districts believed remote proved to be involved. Finally, with no idea where or what to flee, they crowded on to the country roads, or lay in the fields. Some who had lost everything - even their food for the day - could have escaped, but preferred to die. So did others, who had failed to rescue their loved ones. Nobody dared fight the flames. Attempts to do so were prevented by menacing gangs. Torches, too, were openly thrown in, by men crying that they acted under orders. Perhaps they had received orders. Or they may just have wanted to plunder unhampered.

Nero was at Antium. He returned to the city only when the fire was approaching the mansion he had built to link the Gardens of Maecenas to the Palatine. The flames could not be prevented from overwhelming the whole of the Palatine, including his palace. Nevertheless, for the relief of the homeless, fugitive masses he threw open the Field of Mars, including Agrippa's public buildings, and even his own Gardens. Nero also constructed emergency accommodation for the destitute multitude. Food was brought from Ostia and neighboring towns, and the price of corn was cut to less than ¼ sesterce a pound. Yet these measures, for all their popular character, earned no gratitude. For a rumor had spread that, while the city was burning, Nero had gone on his private stage and, comparing modern calamities with ancient, had sung of the destruction of Troy.

By the sixth day enormous demolitions had confronted the raging flames with bare ground and open sky, and the fire was finally stamped out at the foot of the Esquiline Hill. But before panic had subsided, or hope revived, flames broke out again in the more open regions of the city. Here there were fewer casualties; but the destruction of temples and pleasure arcades was even worse. This new conflagration caused additional ill-feeling because it started on Tigellinus' estate in the Aemilian district. For people believed that Nero was ambitious to found a new city to be called after himself.

Of Rome's fourteen districts only four remained intact. Three were leveled to the ground. The other seven were reduced to a few scorched and mangled ruins."

References:
Duruy, Victor, History of Rome vol. V (1883); Grant, Michael (translator), Tacitus, The Annals of Imperial Rome, (1989)

http://www.eyewitnesstohistory.com/rome.htm

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« Reply #22 on: March 08, 2007, 02:54:50 am »

Hi Heather

I think thats a beautiful philosophy
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« Reply #23 on: March 08, 2007, 08:33:03 pm »

From "CONCERNING VAÏNÄMOÏNEN MYTHOLOGY OR THE BOCK SAGA " at www.bocksaga.com  information on "heathen", originally "Hiden" culture:


The revival of original Hiden (perverted to “heathen”) culture envisioned and undertaken at the original site of Hel 10,011 years ago, did not ultimately succeed as planned. It was a shock, following 50,000,000 years of evolution, for various brown, yellow, red and black Vaner to 9,011 years ago begin meeting distinctly arctical blonde, white-skinned, blue- or green-eyed Vaner coming from the north, often leading strange domesticated arctical animals, which had also evolved under the ice i.e. within Odenma during Atlandis,and had never before been seen by tropicals. Some additional white Aser and later Vaner were breaking with the reconstructed system in Hel and, taking their supporters with them, going their separate ways, creating systems of leaders and followers (abandoning the guidance of a shared system wherein all are equal) in playing a variety of parts and establishing very different roles and agenda concerning human harmonization with – or abandonment of -- Nature’s Law and the guidance of Oden, which became mispronounced and misunderstood as Odin, Woden, and other degenerations of the original, and even virtually worshipped as some kind of “god”.

For nearly eight millenia a number of individuals bearing only partial knowledge and understanding of the original system otherwise being regenerated, turned their backs upon it. Using what knowledge they had acquired they sought to create systems of their own rather than follow in the Bock family plan i.e. as part of the plan et. Seriously and radically reforming any and all cultural institutions they usurped, they based their edicts upon existing conditions and partial, incomplete knowledge and understanding, often replacing understanding with belief and force. In some cases their inspiration was seriously degenerated by a new malaise and disease that spread wherever they went: personal ambition, greed, and an ego-centric Oden-ignorant urge to wield un-na tor al powers over others.

On noteworthy occasions, a few of these, under faulty guidance, allowed themselves to become worshipped as “superior” or “divine” beings, “demi-gods” or “gods”, a concept foreign to the Vaïnämoïnen system but ones that humans will kill and die for to this day.

The Hiden pipol, those living in Hiden time, Paradiset, had neither need nor reason for any system of belief. The human family as a whole, while it was composed of its five et or branches, was given means of understanding the workings of universal laws in nature upon and through all life-forms sharing this bal. They could be understood in kela of life processes within the one human family culture, based upon, nurtured by and distinguished as processes rooted in Alphernas Beten, the ring of 23 sounds, invested as they are with meaning that unfolds and imparts to the entire species -- with impeccable logic, honesty, and truth -- the plan for human existence. (Plan means plan, recall, and Et means branch or family. Hence planet, the plan for the human et, which included all co-existing life forms upon Earth, naturally, as perceived and experienced by this one As Van speaking human family system.)

The ho man – human -- family during Paradiset was neither a lofty, impractical, unattainable ideal nor a merely intellectual abstraction but a living, daily and lifetime, social/cultural entity – organism – in which every person and every perdaughter could play a particular role and become a living example of one facet of the whole. Each would have the opportunity to become exemplar to all the others – the entire family – in cultural position understood in the ring – in the sounds – Alphernas Beten. At any given time, Aka and Ok -- Matar and Alfader -- were either mother and father, grandmother and grandfather, great grandmother and great grandfather, or great-greats, to every human being alive. That is, theirs was a real family.

The Rot linguistic system detailing this information can now be challenged, experienced, examined and verified by any human being(s) willing and able to approach it. One can, for oneself, kela its function in the human brain, using oneself as the matrix, the laboratory, the system’s fertile ground, and one can share this kela with others to distinguish between that which is na tor al (natural) -- logical, honest and true, and that which is norm al - normal -- unnatural, illogical, dishonest and false. In no way can the written word accommodate the majestic potential of such a positively profound, mentally “electrifying” process and morally regenerating activity.

The Hiden (say “hee-den”) people had no concept of a god, any god, nor any deity. Rather, Alphernas Beten afforded to Aser profound understanding of eight powers in creation, four masculine and four feminine, manifest to human perception as, and given the names: Hel, Bock, i, Oden, Ra, Tor, Frej, Freja, and upon this understanding, developed and maintained via kela of sound logic , sound logic that rings true , the breeding and information system was founded and continually renewed, taking however a very different form in the ringlands than it did inside Odenma, while yet entirely dependent on the system radiating from Odenma, rolling out from Hel, in which the pipol in each ringland played their part. This will be detailed later and elsewhere when we present or discuss the breeding and information system at greater length.

The Hiden system, then, was based upon a linguistically instructed brain-connected superconducted genetically-informed bio-chemically activated and today scientifically demonstrable transmission and understanding of nature and natural law created by what we might today agree at least – if nothing more – to refer to, regard and appreciate as some form of obviously “Higher” intelligence.

The major religious systems are based upon belief, and require belief. Not only belief in a so-called “god”, but belief in the so-called “divinity” of at least one principal male figure (why never a woman?) to whom has been attributed supernatural powers in which one is absolutely required to believe. In such a system, the believer is robbed of and denied use of the capacity with which, and the freedom in which, to understand. Failure or refusal to believe the dictates of religion and self-appointed religious officers and bureaucracies have resulted in punishment, crusade, torture and painful death. All of this perpetrated in the name of human beings trying, in certain noteworthy instances at least, to encourage peaceful ways among otherwise brutish peoples who had devolved into a grotesque state of insanity -- a state in which one human being would actually and willingly be moved to inflict harm, pain, or even death upon another, the lowest most abominable state into which supposedly intelligent and potentially good humans can possibly degenerate.

Perhaps the major, most ruthless and relentlessly successful attack upon the Hiden (now “heathen”, with all of its negative connotations) culture, and providing ample evidence of the extent of human devolution since the end of Pa ra dis et, was sustained over many centuries by a bloodthirsty bureaucratic organization using the good name of a personage known as Jesus the Christ (one of the more than twelve sons of Bock living, according to the Saga, approximately 2,000 years ago, a man who never intended to harm anyone) to create a profitable imperium, the Roman Catholic Church.

A logically accurate picture of this historical period can now, using Rot as the instrument, be constructed for the first time. This is a vital undertaking given that today many beliefs dating from Biblical times are seminal to contemporary culture and directly influence the politics that determine human impact upon the ecosystem of this biosphere.

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Thus ye may find in thy mental and spiritual self, ye can make thyself just as happy or just as miserable as ye like. How miserable do ye want to be?......For you GROW to heaven, you don't GO to heaven. It is within thine own conscience that ye grow there.

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« Reply #24 on: March 13, 2007, 01:59:48 am »

Thanks Unknown, I gather your earth philosophy is similar..?


Rockessence,

Quote
Rather, Alphernas Beten afforded to Aser profound understanding of eight powers in creation, four masculine and four feminine, manifest to human perception as, and given the names: Hel, Bock, i, Oden, Ra, Tor, Frej, Freja, and upon this understanding, developed and maintained via kela of sound logic , sound logic that rings true , the breeding and information system was founded and continually renewed, taking however a very different form in the ringlands than it did inside Odenma, while yet entirely dependent on the system radiating from Odenma, rolling out from Hel, in which the pipol in each ringland played their part
Thanks Unknown, I gather your earth philosophy is similar..?


Rockessence,

Quote
Rather, Alphernas Beten afforded to Aser profound understanding of eight powers in creation, four masculine and four feminine, manifest to human perception as, and given the names: Hel, Bock, i, Oden, Ra, Tor, Frej, Freja, and upon this understanding, developed and maintained via kela of sound logic , sound logic that rings true , the breeding and information system was founded and continually renewed, taking however a very different form in the ringlands than it did inside Odenma, while yet entirely dependent on the system radiating from Odenma, rolling out from Hel, in which the pipol in each ringland played their part

A Norse god named Ra?

Don't you think that humanity would be a lot better off if it were to still believe in an all-powerful female deity?

A Norse god named Ra?

Don't you think that humanity would be a lot better off if it were to still believe in an all-powerful female deity?  That way, I think that humans would place a greater value on nurturing and life.
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« Reply #25 on: March 13, 2007, 02:41:47 am »

Yes, I agree with what you said, I am just a half-ass toaist myself.
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"There exists an agent, which is natural and divine, material and spiritual, a universal plastic mediator, a common receptical of the fluid vibrations of motion and the images of forms, a fluid, and a force, which can be called the Imagination of Nature..."
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« Reply #26 on: March 13, 2007, 02:57:41 am »

Whatever works, right?  I don't know of anyone that perfectly follows all the cannons of their religion. You have to do what feels right.
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« Reply #27 on: March 13, 2007, 02:59:48 am »

Thats right!

Hey thats the great thing about being a toaist, there are no cannons to follow.
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"There exists an agent, which is natural and divine, material and spiritual, a universal plastic mediator, a common receptical of the fluid vibrations of motion and the images of forms, a fluid, and a force, which can be called the Imagination of Nature..."
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« Reply #28 on: March 13, 2007, 04:24:22 am »

Heather,

Some places where RA is mentioned:

"Frej and Freja, the first Bock and Svan (cf English “swan”) bore 12 sons and 7 daughters, at least. The first son was C po il Marinen, called Ra, and the first daughter Maia (cf English May and maypole). These first born became king and qvena (king and queen) of the entire human family being procreated; although they did not themselves bear children. They represented the Moon and wisdom upon Earth among humans, while Bock and Svan, their parents, represented the Sun and generation. Only very recently, in Egypt, but several millennia ago, was Ra first misappointed to represent and thus became associated with the Sun."



"The 12th son of Bock and Svan received, at the age of 7, the title Lil Bockin, and at age 27 (after, among other preparations, having listened to the saga for 20 years) Lil Bockin was given, like his father, the title and role of Bock (progenitor; procreator), and he then mated with his generation’s svan, the ma tar (Earth mother), bearing 12 sons and 7 daughters (at least), the first born of each being Ra and Maia, the 12th son again Lil Bockin becoming Bock at age 27 and beginning, with Svan, the most beautiful and healthy woman on Earth, to continue this basic round of 12 sons and 7 daughters (at least) comprising the Bock or Piroet family (say “pirouette” as in French, please), the first or head family among the Aser, inside Odenma, before Ice Time. The retiring Bock became Ok (say “ooo co”, co as in coat) or Per, while the retiring Svan became Aka (ah-kah). Hence all pipol were per sons or per daughters. "

"
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ILLIGITIMI NON CARBORUNDUM

Thus ye may find in thy mental and spiritual self, ye can make thyself just as happy or just as miserable as ye like. How miserable do ye want to be?......For you GROW to heaven, you don't GO to heaven. It is within thine own conscience that ye grow there.

Edgar Cayce
Heather Delaria
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« Reply #29 on: March 18, 2007, 11:45:50 pm »

Hi Rockessence,

The Ra in the Bock Saga certainly sounds a lot less powerful than the one in the Egyptian myths.  Are you sure he's the same person?

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