Atlantis Online

Satellite Discoveries & Alternate Archaeology => the Bock Saga => Topic started by: Mario Dantas on April 16, 2008, 12:15:44 pm



Title: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Mario Dantas on April 16, 2008, 12:15:44 pm
I found this, while searching for the Bock Saga:

http://forums.atlantisrising.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/001044.html

Nice reading! thanks Boreas for this important "Dialog", thanks Rockessence, hope you don't mind.

M



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: BlueHue on November 15, 2008, 10:50:17 am
Dear . . . . .  MARIO,

From what I just read about the dubious unorthodox-lifestyle of the BOCK- Saga-Author ,
around 2.000 ad.I have little Faith in the  BOREAS hypothesis because the HYPER-
BOREANS lived in MACROBIA their capital is  today named ' Mecca'.( since 800 ad.)

BESIDES
that Bergstrom-Boreas FAMILY" OR SOMETHING,  didn't we already have
a FALSE Boek called the OURA - LINDA Book also about ATLANTIS ?in HOLLAND/ Friesland
it was largelyweritten inbetween 1865-75 by a Dutch schoolmaster from the
provincial Capital of Leeuwarden,

who wanted to proove that the Dutch Tribe of FRISIANS were as old as :"Atlantis"
DIE HARDS still think that iot is genuine and shut their ears for the Contrary
What is YOUR opinion about that" OURA - LINANDA  BOOK ? ? ?  ???

Sincerely " BlueHue  ".


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:46:11 am
This is an excellent dissertation of sorts on the Bock Saga, Mario, Rockessence.  I'll bring it over so everyone can have a look.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:46:28 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:23             
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Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files:
********************************************
Boreas
Member posted 01-20-2004 16:30
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Good Old News
Over the past years there has gradually occured a completly new, and hereto unknown source of genuine information about the mythical Atlantis.
The basic source is a part of the Nordic Folklore tradition, originating from the time when the Norse - as well as other Indo-Europeans - kept their historical and cultural identity alive and evolving, - by an ongoing oral tradition.

Before a surpressing latino writng-culture expanded all over the Eurasian continent; all pagan people did keep a culture of ORAL TRADITION. Today NONE of this culture remains, except from a handfew exceptions that have survived in the remote provinces og the highest north. During the 20th century we found and catalogued such remains in the mountains of the Himalayas and the Urals, as well as the deep arctical forests of Carelia, Finland and Scandinavia.

Thus we know that the ancient societies all over Europe and Asia kept their own history, containing stories about their origin, history and identity, - and delivered to elected or choosen youngsters, with a special ability to memorize. After years of learning, practice and examination they got to be story-tellers and "wise men" for the next generation.

As any larger body of information about this world also the Nordic Myths are dwelling upon a long, ancient tradition of keeping this knowledge intact and correct.

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:46:51 am
Just Legends?!

With the introduction of the latin "writing-culture" we may observe that the old ("pagan") sagas got undermined, distorted and even prohibited. Though we may still find fragments of the genuine stuff, - inbetween the distortions and misconceptions found in most of the sagas written down during the 12th-14th centuries.

Thus it may seem as a sheer miracle that researchers within the Science of Folklore and Traditions (antropologists) still find genuine and original information - resited by memory from old people still living in remote districts of Norway, Finland and Russia...

The most fantastic story was discovered in Finland as late as 1984-85, when a complete Family Saga was revealed. Showing to be an incredibly detailed story of our ancient antiquity theese tellings was catalogued as "The Family Saga of Strömsö Manor" by the "Archive of Folk Culture" in Helsinki.

This Saga is built around a chronological history where many incidents are already known, but most are very litle or not at all known from our public history.

Moreover the Saga explains the mere roots of the caucasian people and their culture, as originating in Fenno-Scandia during ice-time (!) And even worse; it does give a very precise, logic and detailed explanation about an ancient world-wide culture, as the common source of the European, Finnish, Asian and Indian Mythologies!

Since this have been genreally unknown to humanity and our academies, the present Nordic and Finnish Institutes of History has - not surprisingly - rejected the whole concept of such a saga; as "nonsens" and non-significant"...!
Even though it is completly documented. In interviews and dicussions even Finnish authorities have dismissed this historical legacy as "fantasies and speculations".

Lost, - But Found!

None the less have more archaeological discoveries from 1993-2002 given proof to the statements given by the saga already in 1985! One clear-cut example is the statement from the saga that; "The origin of our arctic culture evolved in the Baltic Area DURING ice-time, in a time we called "Alt-land-is", meaning "All-land-ice", because the whole Eurasian continent where covered in an enormous ice-sheet, exept from a small area around the Finnish Gulf that was kept open and warm enough for our ancestors to survive, - thanks to the Gulf-stream that used to end here at that time..." (!!!)

In 1995-96 a team of Russian and Norwegian scientists discovered a highly remarkable settlement - "from modern human beeings" - within the White Sea, where more than 40.000 years old...
Even worse did it become when a Finnish truck-driver got the rigth to dig out a cavern outside Kristinestad, on Finlands western coast. In 1995 he proved that there had been people using the cave more than 70.000 years ago!
Since than Finlands State-archeologists have been exploring about 1/8 of the cave, and by 1998-2002 it was proven that humans have lived in the "wolf-cave" for more than 280.000 years - i.e. during the coldest ice-time!!!

Yet, - the "Family-saga of Strömsö Manor" is
still not given any credit, although it is given specific information about several (unknown) artefacts to be hidden underground in Finland. One of theese is the crown and the crest of arms of the authentic Finnish Kingdom, that subdued to the religious regime of Europe (becomming part of the catholic Sweden) first in 1248.

According to the Saga this kingline, as well as their insignias and symbols originated from "As-Hel"; the arctic Kingdom of Altlandis. And as we may see on maps before 1854; the old zero-meridian (today GMT) used to run from As-Hel (todays Hel-sing-ki) to Hel-As, dividing Crete into a Eastern vs. a Western hemispheres - creating the basic culture that developed into the eastern Greek and the western Roman kingdoms as of 9000 years ago.
Thus we may understand that Alt-land-is and Atlantis is refering to the same myth, based on the same historical fact!

By today an exstensive lineout of the Bock Family Saga, - with a comprehensive description of the historical Altlandis - can be found at www.bocksaga.de.

Happy New Year!


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-21-2004).]

IP: 195.159.177.126


[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 11-08-2004).]



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:47:20 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:31             
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Brig
Moderator posted 01-20-2004 18:22
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Geeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee A whole new place for Atlantis. As I've said before,"Thats Atlantis all over". Just exactly where was this At land is supposed to be located exactly....Finland? or somewhere nearby?
IP: 152.163.252.33
Boreas
Member posted 01-21-2004 16:11
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Cheeeese Mr. Doodles?!
If You would care to read the article through - not to mention the "whole story" on www.bocksaga.de - it should become pretty clear exactly WHERE the old (primeval) arctical culture survived, evolving through an eon of time today called "ice-time".

The knowledge about this origin of the caicasian man, his languages and his culture obviously got lost - and modern etnology still can`t figure out from where the caucasian archetype orginiated.

But the recent findings in the Baltic area, explained by the ancient history of the newly documented Saga-material is actually giving a complete explanation, based on a completly scientifical step-stone logic.

Thanks to recent discoveries we do KNOW that modern man existed inside a pocket (rift) in the global ice-sheet, - between 3.000 - 5000 metres high - covering most all of North America, Northern Europe and Russia. Due to the ice sheet between Norway and Scotland the Gulf-stream was then forced eastwards, entering the Baltic Ocean, where it kept all of Gotland and the coastline of Finland ICE-FREE, while mainland Denmark, Germany, Poland and Russia was still covered by the glacier.

Only during the last 8-10 years (!) have we learned to KNOW that there actually existed human beeings inside this pocket in the ice. So far archeologists and geologists have detected 280.000 years old traces from this human culture, from the southern coast of Finland, - exactly where the Gulf stream once used to bounce it warm water...

Based on the old folklore tradition,the mentioned family-saga is a
source based on entirely different qualities than rumours, "qualified guesswork" or optimistic "creativity".

This information is a part of an age old, - and still new source on the Nordic history, going much more than 10.000 years back in time.

Consequently it reflects back through Ice-time (called Alt-land-is-period) and the following period, generally known as the "stone-age", beginning quite exactly 10.000 yrs ago, as the arctic population started spreding from the Baltics (with their "AsHel-culture") to the Black Sea/Mediterranean where the "HelAs-culture" was established about 9.200 yrs ago.

The Saga-material covers a lot more than this - like the basis of our present languages, our mythologies, etc. - all based on a still existing ancient and AUTHENTIC tradition of folklore and oral history-telling. Still today we find this original way of communicating essential and historical knowledge a few rural parts of the world - whereof some are now reknown as a part of the "World Heritage".

As with amazon indians, hopis, inuits, lapps, samojeds, ainus and aboriginees we also find remains of this tradition in the Northern countries, even in different languages(German/Scandinavian/Fenno-Ugrian).

And remember; the Nordic sagas - covering the same ancient stories - have been found within different etnic and linguistical groups, proving beyond doubt that they reflect a common, ancient reality of human history and culture.

Today this norse sagas can offer an OLD explanation of the context between the Meso-American, The Mediterranean and the Asian mythologies. It should give evident and obvious resons to consider (and perhaps reconsider) the value of the millenium old Sagas of the North.

Ironic ignorance is cheap - dumb arrogance even cheaper. The ones who care checking the whole story on the mentioned site (bocksaga.de) may return with some more valid reflections or qustions.


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-21-2004).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:47:23 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:31             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brig
Moderator posted 01-20-2004 18:22
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Geeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee A whole new place for Atlantis. As I've said before,"Thats Atlantis all over". Just exactly where was this At land is supposed to be located exactly....Finland? or somewhere nearby?
IP: 152.163.252.33
Boreas
Member posted 01-21-2004 16:11
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Cheeeese Mr. Doodles?!
If You would care to read the article through - not to mention the "whole story" on www.bocksaga.de - it should become pretty clear exactly WHERE the old (primeval) arctical culture survived, evolving through an eon of time today called "ice-time".

The knowledge about this origin of the caicasian man, his languages and his culture obviously got lost - and modern etnology still can`t figure out from where the caucasian archetype orginiated.

But the recent findings in the Baltic area, explained by the ancient history of the newly documented Saga-material is actually giving a complete explanation, based on a completly scientifical step-stone logic.

Thanks to recent discoveries we do KNOW that modern man existed inside a pocket (rift) in the global ice-sheet, - between 3.000 - 5000 metres high - covering most all of North America, Northern Europe and Russia. Due to the ice sheet between Norway and Scotland the Gulf-stream was then forced eastwards, entering the Baltic Ocean, where it kept all of Gotland and the coastline of Finland ICE-FREE, while mainland Denmark, Germany, Poland and Russia was still covered by the glacier.

Only during the last 8-10 years (!) have we learned to KNOW that there actually existed human beeings inside this pocket in the ice. So far archeologists and geologists have detected 280.000 years old traces from this human culture, from the southern coast of Finland, - exactly where the Gulf stream once used to bounce it warm water...

Based on the old folklore tradition,the mentioned family-saga is a
source based on entirely different qualities than rumours, "qualified guesswork" or optimistic "creativity".

This information is a part of an age old, - and still new source on the Nordic history, going much more than 10.000 years back in time.

Consequently it reflects back through Ice-time (called Alt-land-is-period) and the following period, generally known as the "stone-age", beginning quite exactly 10.000 yrs ago, as the arctic population started spreding from the Baltics (with their "AsHel-culture") to the Black Sea/Mediterranean where the "HelAs-culture" was established about 9.200 yrs ago.

The Saga-material covers a lot more than this - like the basis of our present languages, our mythologies, etc. - all based on a still existing ancient and AUTHENTIC tradition of folklore and oral history-telling. Still today we find this original way of communicating essential and historical knowledge a few rural parts of the world - whereof some are now reknown as a part of the "World Heritage".

As with amazon indians, hopis, inuits, lapps, samojeds, ainus and aboriginees we also find remains of this tradition in the Northern countries, even in different languages(German/Scandinavian/Fenno-Ugrian).

And remember; the Nordic sagas - covering the same ancient stories - have been found within different etnic and linguistical groups, proving beyond doubt that they reflect a common, ancient reality of human history and culture.

Today this norse sagas can offer an OLD explanation of the context between the Meso-American, The Mediterranean and the Asian mythologies. It should give evident and obvious resons to consider (and perhaps reconsider) the value of the millenium old Sagas of the North.

Ironic ignorance is cheap - dumb arrogance even cheaper. The ones who care checking the whole story on the mentioned site (bocksaga.de) may return with some more valid reflections or qustions.


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-21-2004).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:48:07 am
Brig
Moderator posted 01-21-2004 17:41
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Ok, The material you referenced is interesting. I have read of some of these northernly finds. But what I read referred to them as "stone age". Caucasians did not suddenly spring up from the ground. They had to have originated someplace. This whole matter can get very complex. Are these early Finns offshots of Cro-magnon man, neanderthal, or something else. This evidence dating back 300,000 years, Unless I missed something, what was it based on? Human remains 300,000 years old, yet modern in type? Now that would be a find to set palentologists on their collective ears. I fully realize oral traditions can have validy. The ancient hebrews used oral tradition for a very long time, also, before they aquired the skill of writing.
IP: 205.188.208.39

Brig
Moderator posted 01-21-2004 17:55
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Boreas; I was not putting you or the Finn theory down. But if you had been on this site as long as I have you would understand the general skepticism. Almost every month someone comes up with a totally new location of Atlantis. Some of these people, not using anything much to back up their theories, could get wild and passionate about where they thought Atlantis was. Even on Mars....I kid you not. So, on this site, it is important to have facts to back your theories. You have a good start. Now if a gentleman named Catastrophe begins taking your theory apart, don't be insulted, be ready with facts. This is kinda the way this site is. Georgio (Atlantis in straits of Gibraltor) Sarmast (Atlantis south of Cyprus) George Erikson (Atlantis in South America) have taken and fielded some pretty tough questions and facts. This is a good place to put your theories to the test.
IP: 205.188.208.39

Catastrophe
Member posted 01-22-2004 01:08
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Boreas
I have only begun to read your reference site but I need to have more encouragement to continue.

"The official experts at the Finnish Department of Museums and Sites still do not want to even touch this highly "controversial" story or the the extraordinary cave-system information. Instead they somewhat "fanatically" keep their official line of arguments founded in1984/85 that "Mr. Bock's Saga with the mention of a large cave-system is based merely on Mr. Bock's "fantastic fantasies". Thus, thanks to bureaucratic arrogance and scientific ignorance, it still lays uncovered: the oldest treasury chambers of the ancient, arctic kingdoms known to man, which have been alluded to as "The Kingdom of Oden" from the old Norse sagas."

Is there going to be more than spending $500,000 and giving up having found ... what exactly? Possibly an entrance to something?



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:48:22 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:34             
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Catastrophe
Member posted 01-22-2004 01:23
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The wolf cave http://www.wolfcave.com/Wolf/nayttelyt.htm
IP: 213.122.213.254

Catastrophe
Member posted 01-22-2004 01:44
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"In this time that was called PARADISE people lived in harmony with naturelaws and -powers. At that time the earth's axis stood perpendicular to the sun. For this reason existed a land at the North pole with a diameter of 250km where the sun never went down but instead described a golden ring at the horizon."
Is this supposed to be legend or fact?


IP: 213.122.129.96


Catastrophe
Member posted 01-22-2004 02:27
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Google "gulf stream" origin.
"The Norwegian Sea and the Gulf Stream are formed

The Earth’s appearance has varied throughout its history. The size and shape, both on land at sea, have changed because of the continental drift. 165 million years ago, the regions that today include America, Africa, Greenland and parts of Western Europe we joined in one huge continent. The Atlantic Ocean was formed trough a gradual breaking up of this continent. The northernmost parts of the Atlantic Ocean, the Norwegian Sea and the Greenland Sea have developed throughout the last 50 million years. The climate was considerably warmer than it is today, and the forerunners of the Gulf Stream in this "young" ocean were subtropical ocean currents. It is believed that an ocean circulation such as the one we have today was first established between 10 and 20 million years ago, when a subsidence in the region between Iceland and the Faeroe Islands caused the ocean to became deeper there. This provided an opportunity for balancing the warm water carried into the Norwegian Sea with outflowing deep water and the surface water of the East Greenland Current (Figure 1)."

That will do for a start.


------------------
We think ourselves unhappy when a comet appears, but the misfortune is the comet's
Bernard de Fontenelle
The Plurality of Worlds (Paris 1686)



 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:48:56 am
Spiritwalker
Member posted 01-22-2004 09:43
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Cool
IP: 67.39.254.226

Boreas
Member posted 01-24-2004 13:00
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WHO INVENTED GOD?
How long was "ice-time? When did it actually start? How wide did the ice-cap reach - how much land and ocean did it cover?
And how old is the "The naked monkey"? How old is "modern" man? How far out is Desmond Morris? Not to mention Michael Cremo?

To be minuitly exact - there is still NO answers to any of the above questions. But in our day and age it just happens that we are about aproaching all of the significances nessecary to frame the answers to theese questions.

If we want to lead a sensible and productive dialog of qustions/answers its vital that we may keep ONE topic in focus - at the time. A higly skilled American teacher I studied by genuinly reminded his students about this by the parafrase: "Be wise - or be otherwise".

THE TOPIC
Since I have focused the question of A Atlantis, or a "primary culture", existing before historical time - I permitted myself to refer to the site www.bocksaga.de where there is a column called "Altlandis". The rest of the content of this and its related web-sites may be highly interesting - but it is beside the framework of the article on top of this page.

The case is simply this; The descriptions of a "Atlantic Society & Culture" is clearly found within the Norse mythologies, specifically those of the famous poem "Voluspaa" (a oral tradition written down first time in the 11th century, and thus not lost). Further descriptions of an "Atlantean Civilisation" in the north is found in the more famous "Oera Linda Boek", a written history from the 7th century found in Groeningen, Holland - being the basis for Robert Scruttons well-known book "The Other Atlantis", published in the 1970-ties.



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:49:16 am
OLD AS NEW SCIENCE
To the learned Scandinavian it is also a well-known fact that the leading authority withing Swedens Academia during the 17th century; Prof. Olof Rudbeck sharply and exstensivly claimed that the "Atlantean Culture" of the earliest, historical Scandinavians where the basis of the Mediterranean legend of Atlantis. Conslusivly Rubeck found that "Atlantis" where in fact the primeval basis of the Scandinavian culture...!

But not before 1984/85 did we get a further explanation of this issue - when a FINNISH source of information (from the Fenno-Ugric language and culture) could refer to an age-old family-saga, actually explaining the congurence of "ice-time" and "Alt-land-is-time".

However much one turn this historical/mythological information up or down or around - it is NOT possible to dismay it. At least not before one understands the nature of this information and the realms of its sources.

THE SOURCE
Today we may dismay an old tradition because we find it "old-fashioned", "outdated" or not suitable in our techologic ("modern")reality. But within the historical research we have to acknowledge the historical and cultural information given to us by the magnitude of similar traditions from the old cultures of the world, such as the old Nordic or Norse/Indo-European culture.

Some day - as our arctical herritage gets better known - do we possibly understand that even Santa Claus, as well as Christmas itself, actually is based on traditions reflecting customs and realities of our very own anchestors life, culture and history.

So we`re back to the web-site www.bocksaga.de or www.bocksaga.com for a closer and more objective look. This time it is important to "read to reflect", rather than "read to react".

NO EASY-QUICK
I wrote the above because I tend to believe that anyone who cares to really reflect rather than react on theese matters would be in majority in this forum. Since I am getting to old to respond upon quick crack-down "analyzis", cheap contrafeit quotes, skillfull irony or intentional misunderstandings I hope the reflections on this peculiar issue may lead to a reflected discussion - rather than a stigmata between different "opinions", as if we where priests or ditto wannabes from different religions...

I try to behave rationally and I trust others to do the same. If in doubt; I ASK rather than state. If I DO understand or get somewhat enligthed I may have something to add or subtract. But I am not here with the aim to prove that anyone is wrong. Thus I dismiss the intent on putting down myself and others with nitty-gritty harrasments or airy-fairy comparisons. I am here to simply tell about the mentioned sources - and their possible implications.

Now if a majority of oceanic geologists have found it likely ("most likely") that the Gulf Stream appeared about 50 million years ago it coincide impressingly well with the statement of the Saga-material, telling that the Alt-land-is-period ("ice-time") started just about 50 million years ago. Now; which of theese sources should we trust - and which one to distrust?!

Moreover the Sagas tells that the ice-time started with a cataclysm, where a large part of the earths water evporated, to collect as damp around the poles - before it condensed and became two enormous ice-caps covering the northern resp. the southern pole-areas.

Meanwhile the Gulf-stream went over the Atlantic, hitting Biscaya - rocketting through the English Channel into the Oslo Fjord Area - where "the warm waves" could pass through "Ginnugagap" (a rift in the enormous icecap) entering the Baltic Ocean where the hot water hit the bottom of the Finish Bay - to circulate in front of the Finish archipelago.

SCIENCTIFIC PROOF?
Now; there is nothing in our knowledge about the extent of the northern ice-cap that contradicts the explanations of the saga-material - but quite the oposite! During the last 15 years it has become known that the massive ice-cap (3-5000 metres thick!) covered all the northern hemisphere. In North America down to Virginia from where it extended straigth east through the Atlantic Ocean as far as the longitude of Greenland before it started to turn north reaching Ireland and the British Isles. Because the Gulfstream was pressing north - finally via Biscaya through the English Channel and into the Oslofjord; the ice over Scandinavia could not close completly - and thus a rift was kept open. (The sagas calls it "Ginnungagap"; "The Giving-Youth-Gap"..!) Along this rift the stream kept bringing warm water from the Gulf of Mexico to the Gulf of Finland.

Still the rest of the isles, as well as the North Sea and whole Eurasian continent (down to the Alps and the Caucasian and Himalayan mountains) where covered by the northern ice-cap. And still today we may see the geologial, climatical and biological border between the arctical and the tropical hemispheres.

As far as I know there is still nothing found withing our natural sciences that really contradict this saga-material. As for the geology of the North Atlantic and the Fenno-Scandia it tends to support the folkore material.

VIEWS OR FACTS
Different scientists tend to have different opinions, especially on major questions within the different professions. Thus we all need critical views to fuel the prosess that ultimately gives us the "plain truth".
And as we want to be critical to any new source of information about major questions about our own history - we need to be likewise critical to the review of the geologists stating the "age and the development" of the Gulf-stream. Keep in mind that far from all geologists share the same view on that topic - and be utterly aware about the simple fact that "scientific truths" seem to be more and more shortlived.



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:50:05 am
HOW OLD IS OLD?
What is the reality behind the bocksaga statement of 50 million 10.020 years ago since the beginning of the "Alt-land-is-period"?! Is it possible that a highly spiritual or intellectual culture could evolve in this isolated existence - as they just about could survive ice-time? May Fenno-Scandia be the area where an isolated group of people had to endure that enormous time-span - evolving mentally and intectually - as well as physically; from tropicals man to articals? Since the artical ("Caucasian") man obviously exists; What peculiar circumstances was present - and how many generations did it take before an isolated branch of mankind could evolve; from a group of full-blooded tropicals to a bunch of pigmentless palefaces?!

They must have been isolated. For a very long time. According to the Bocksaga that happened as the ice-time covered the whole northern hemisphere - accept from the Baltic Ocean, with the south-coast of Finland and the Island of Gotland free of ice.

LONG TIME
We have another problem along the same line; How can we not compare the Mayan, the Norse and the Vedic time-frames - all originating from an ancient tradition of "royal story-tellers". And how should we relate theese information with geological estimates of modern time? May we trust a certain information as a fact if ALL theese sources align in the same conclusion?

Today isotope-technology is able to define time technically correct. But this technology is brand new to the historic discussion - and it has no less than revolutionized the scientific value of modern archeology. Now - the paradox is that the better scientific tools we have - the more indications and (even) proofs have occured to support the main-lines in the old folklore traditions. Even "legends" - such as the story about Atlantis" - is now about to be scientifically proved...

OLD SOURCE - NEW SURPRISE
It should be quite obvious that the sources and the stories I am refering to are NEW to most people debating Atlantis. I do understand that such scientific surprises very rarely occur - that being in science or culture. And this normality, or conservatism, is exactly the reason why the overall majority of established science refutes the whole "Atlantis-legend" as mere dream-work. But now the surprise is here - for all of us - just to be understood and enjoyed!

Furthermore; If this information is anywhere CLOSE to a historical (scientifical) truth we better hold this saga close to our eyes - and up against the sun - for further investigation, research and debate. The Finnish saga explains that - by the support of simple archeological excavations - may this ancient, oral tradition give the first conslusive proofs of the legendary culture of "Atlantis". May it than matter exactly WHERE this proofs are actually found?!

[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-24-2004).]

IP: 82.164.19.161




[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 03-04-2005).]



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:50:15 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:36             
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docyabut
Member posted 01-26-2004 06:52
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Didn`t evolution explain the white race? Man living in the colder climates for 20,000 years, made the mellon in the skin turn white and made the noses close up Rajash answer my question, as to why the Asian eyeslids are swollen and narrow. From migating and battling the colder climates.Makes sense to me.
IP: 64.12.96.12
Pytheas
Member posted 01-26-2004 07:40
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I have a question to you Boreas:
You suggest, or claim, that the english channel existed 50 million years ago.
I respectfully disagree. The channel is a big fault created in the same moment in time as the mid- atlantic transform-fault was created - about 13000 years ago.
So the gulf stream could not have reached through this channel into "Ginnugagap" before this date - Or?

IP: 82.199.189.109

Brig
Moderator posted 01-26-2004 16:38
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Doc: Scientists are still debating what made whites white. There are peoples who live in the far north, have for thousands of years, but they are hardly whiter than their southern counterparts. On the other hand there are dark skinned (not black) peoples who live pretty far south or actually on the equator up to, and to, the cusp of it who have green or even blue eyes and thin noses and lips. Some are oriental in appearance. Also the Anu of Japan are quite hairy an white. They were on the mainland of Japan before the Japanese. No Doc, the extreme whitness, blond, blue eyes, of Denmark, Germany, Sweden, Switzerland, etc. have never been satisfactorily explained; though many have tried.
IP: 64.12.96.12


[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 03-04-2005).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:50:32 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:38             
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Boreas
Member posted 01-27-2004 07:50
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Hi all -
and thank You for considerate responses!
I do indeed appreciate Your clear and questions and Your highly relevant comments.
LEGEND AND REALITY
It should be evident that the "Legend of Atlantis" really needs a very sincere and (perhaps extraorinary) objectivity and clear-mindedness. Especially if we - with this "special interest" - want to move our scientific communities to attend the topic with a more sincere objectivity.
Though I am pretty sure that we have to bring some new and undeniable points to the discussion - hopefully backed up by concrete EVIDENCE, - as well as strong indications and clear questions.

The majority of established historians seems to be benefitting by hiding (out!?!) - in beuraucratic institutions with a prestige- or profitt-minded management, always keeping a defensive ("sceptic") attitude towards inovative issues like ours. Thus I believe that forums like this website is really needed to attend, describe and even prove the significance of the Atlantis-question. Given the meek (but not humble) treatment theese questions have begot from the "scientific historians" it seems unavoidable that "alternative sciencists" and autodidacts must do the hardwork needed to shed apropriate ligth on theese puzzles, riddles and questions. Seen in an existential perspective it may seem that theese are key-questions to our origin and our evolution. As our atomic age revolves it`s obvious that we are quickly aproaching a period of cultural flux - as a historical intermediate when we really will NEED to asses, solve and answer this basic questions - in order to keep our perspective as human beeings...

That is why I (personally) feel so encouraged when people with a real and good intellect engage and become eager adressing theese questions.

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:50:49 am
OUT OF AFRICA?
Now; what do we really know about the population that once resided in the BALTIC AREA during (minimum) 280.000 years, until the icetime ended?
Not much, - from the Finish National Board of Antiqueties - we just learned that this population DID exist, until it disapeared just before the end of ice-time, approx. 10.000 years ago. (See:www.nba.fi/wolfcave)

A recent survey within the White Sea-area have shown that an artic population ("most likely modern human beings") used to visit the White Sea - for seasonal hunting and fishing, and "possibly more permanent living" - FROM around 40.000 years ago. (See: The Norwegian/Russian "Pechora- project", presented in "Nature", Sept, 2001. (www.nature/pechora)

The most astonishing facts arrivng from the Pechora-project is that:
A. The Baltic Ocean and the White Sea was ice-free (and connected) much more than 40.000 yrs ago.
B. That modern man have lived in the high north already at that time. According to "established science" this was just about corresponding to the age of modern man in Europe, just arriving from Africa via Trans-Caucasia...!

Now we may just ask:
1. How can we explain the development of the highly specialized arctical humans - able to exist and even expand in the extreme arctical climate - just a few years after leaving the African coco-nuts and the bambo-huts? (How would todays Bantus, Tuareks or Amazone-indians survive on the, say, NORTHERN tip of todays Greenland?!)
Any suggestions???

2. As the Baltic Ocean and the White Sea was connected - where today are the Seas of Ladoga & Onega - the whole Fenno-Scandian Penninsula would actually be an ISLAND. More than 90% of the area would be covered in ice, - but along the coast-lines we find traces of an pre-historic, arctical human beeing.

ESCAPING A MOVING GLACIER
Another point to this is the nature of the events that made an end to ice-time. From Scandinavian geology we know that the largest part of the ice-cap did not melt down - but actually slided down to the North Sea and the Atlantic Ocean in the south and west, - and the Baltic Ocean to the south/east. Today we know that the enourmous glaciers moved from the high mountains to the oceans at the SPEED of 16-20 km a year.

3. A small group of articals - living in the Baltic area - evidently escaped destinction as the enourmous icemasses evidently pushed over and crushed the livelyhood along the coastlines of Fenno-Scandia.

Thus the preboreal populations of Fenno-Scandia was obviously experiencing a "cataclysm"; as the enormous sheets of frozen water started moving; destroying evrything on its way and even polishing the whole landscape of Finland and Scandinavia.

"ELLIVAAGOR" - THE LIFE SAVER
According to C-14 tests this cataclysm happened between 10.000 to 10.700 years ago. In this period there would be impossible to live anywhere in the Northern Hemisphere, accept from Southern England that have remained ice-free throughout the entire ice-time. There is a gulf-stream needed to have done that...

Though, the geological surveys of the western coast of Friesland, Holstein and Jutland (mainland Denmark) shows that "sub-tropical corall" grew along the English Channel up to the northern coasts of Denmark, until about 50 mill. years ago. Thereafter another corall, able to grow in "sub-arctical" water took over, until it ceased some 11.-12.000 years ago.

Even as far north as the inner Oslo Bay area do we find small areas that have - beyond doubst - been ice-free, throughout the entire ice-time. Moreover we find the same phenomenon in the Baltic Ocean itself, - where the large island of GOTLAND, consisting of old corall-chalck, obviously had been KEPT free of ice (by a Gulf Stream) during the ENTIRE ice-time.

NOT MICE
But on the mainlands all around the North Sea and the Baltic Ocean the up to 3000 metres thick ice-cap dwelled - keeping the winters dark, cold and long and the days of summer short and few. The norse epic "Voluspaa" refers to this as the "Finbull-winter", where "Ellivaagor" ("fired waves") came through "Ginnungagap" and - along with; "Sun shine from South; made the Stone warm, made the Green grow".

By the way; The "Voluspaa" entitle he original norsemen "Aser". One verse even explain how they once had to escape their homeyard ("Asgard") to survive at "NOA-tun"; meaning the "The Yard of Noa" - before returning home to Hel, "The Whole" (i.e. "The Hol-y"/"The Hol-i-stic").

NOT "GODS" - JUST PEOPLE.
Today we may understand "Voluspaa" and other sagas and legends as short versions of a long and ancient saga about the arctical people. Which is quite the contrary to the deceit, distortons and abstactions that still color our basic comprehension of our historical past. Sins like this was committed by an emperial religion of the 13th and 14th century - who completly changed, re-defined and rewrote most of the norse texts. Since then the comprehension of the etnic origin and cultural background of the Norsemen have become "Brute People with the Aser as a primitive Superstition of the Headon Gods".

Thus the true history of the Nordic and the Eurasian cultures was conquered, outrooted and submerged, to fit with the Latin academia of the religious Rome.



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:51:08 am
FAST AND SWIFT...
From the survival of a relativly small group - we can see that artical man is appearing in Sweden and Norway already 9.900 year ago. Just a few generations and some 500 years later we find permanent populations ALL OVER the Fenno-Scandian area.

At this time the land was completly bare - only mountains, rocks, sand and clay to be seen. And beaches, fjords and bays - with rivers, lakes and sweetwater; "as long as the eye could see..."

This primary arctical population evidently lived by fishing, - and they where already building sophisticated dog-sledges, river-boats, ocean-boats, fishing-nets and other nesseceties - traveling the coastlines and oceans.

Today Scandinavian archaeology bear witness to artical man appearing 9.900 years ago, whereafter he spread with an incredible speed - all over the northern hemisphere. This first generation of norsemen must already have been "extremly well fit, highly organised and incredibly well prepared to live, flourish and swiftly expanding on a naked landscape, under a rather extreme arctic winter. Further they must have been higly skilled and very well organised to perform this imediate and swift expension.


...FAR AND WIDE
Soon they stretched all the way to Ireland, Orkney and Feroe Island (at latest 6.000 years BP). They probably also reached Greenland and America already that time.
A similar development can be seen towards the east, especially in the period called the "Climatical Optimum" 8000-3000 years ago, when the middle temperature where 2,5-2.8 Celsius-degrees warmer than today.

Thus, the recently discovered Kennewick Man, probably a Caucasian about 9.200 years old, could have reached the Colorado-river both from the North-Atlantic and the northern rivers of Cananda - as from Asia and the Bering-streigth.

EUROPE`s OLDEST PEOPLE...
Two ars ago the Univ. of Huddersfield, doing exstensive research on the European Genome, could publish the conslusion that the present European populations are - all - a mix of two separate imigrations; one very old, one quite new. Except from the Scandinavians, whose genome still is the same as it was 10.000 years ago, - and before. Consequently there was no agraric population over-running the former hunterer-gatherers, as the main theory have said for centuries. "It sems that the Scandinavians have adopted the agriculture, at an early stage, not permitting any farming imigrants", says genetican John Richards.

That being said - doesn`t Richards discovery imply that we may have to look again on our preconceptions of the origin of agriculture?

...AND THIR CULTURE
During the last 30 years we have found that the Norwegian West Coast have hosted a Boat-building fishing-population that is just about 10.000 years old.

Over the past 25 years the span and magnitude of this culture have become very well documented. There are already a number of small exhibitions and "experiential activities" for tourists - along the coast of western/northern Norway.

This summer the present norsemen complete a "national centre" - "NORVEG" - making the first large-scale presentation of Norways 10.000 year old coast-culture. The center is in Rorvik, 200 km north-west of Trondheim. Along with local historians like myself - this is becomming a centre of research and resume for our professional historians, as well as a highly regarded tourist-attraction.



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:51:21 am
TOURIST ATTRACTION
The 6000 islands outside Rorvik is stretching far out in the N-Atlantic, bearing witness about ancient boat-trafic and navigational landmarks, - clearly indicating - though not conclusivly prooving - that this extraordinary archipelago was a key-area for the first Scandinavians, not only converning fishing, but also for oceanic travels towards the west.

According to the oldest part of the Norse Sagas we have reason to believe that this boat-culture have populated both sides of the North-Atlantic. Thus a North Atlatic "Treaty" Organisation may have existed once before - in our "ancient past" . As a royal branch of the Scandinavian Sea-Kings - and their successors of sailors and fishermen...! Anyone especially interested may drop me a line on mail.

A FRESH VIEW ON THE OLD HORIZON
Now; all theese brand new, scientifical facts actually agreees with the statements given in the mentioned Family Saga already 20 years ago. Moreover theese facts may also explain parts of the Greek legends. As when Solon/Plato tells that the Atlanteans lived on "A very large Island", that got "overrun by water".

The release of the enormous masses of ice from Finland and Scandinavia was hitting the ocean simultaniously. This evidently created centuries of flooding, substatially hightening the ocean level. A similar cause/consequence is now established to have flooded the Caspian Sea, The Black Sea and the Mediterranean, some 8.700+ years ago.


May we start with concluding that A Atlantis/Altlandis DID indeed exist?!
May I be allowed to focus on Fenno-Scandinavia - during ice-time divided from Russia by the ocean - to candidate for the "enormous island" , "far out in the ocean, outside the Pillars of Hercules"?
And; may the 10.000 years old boats - found within the arctical populations - bear witness to the "Boat People" - reaching Gibraltar and Crete already some 9.500-10.000 years ago?

[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-27-2004).]



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:51:32 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:39             
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Brig
Moderator posted 01-29-2004 21:29
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So all ya gotta do is find the northern hall of records and translate. Whites could be a mutation. Not all albinos have pink eyes; some have blue (yeah I know they aren't true albinos).Brown bears turned white to form the polar bear. Other northern creatures sport white coats. Yeah, I know, that probably doesn't answer the question either. I'll accept the possibility of most Atlantean theories, but I'll still have my favorites until proof arises that dictates which one is right.
IP: 205.188.208.39
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:51:48 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:43             
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Boreas
Member posted 01-27-2004 20:18
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That`s just a question of precision, accuracy or completness.
Is the legend of "Atlantis", - as we know it from Plato - more accurate in describing the true Atlantis, - than is the old Norse Myths?
Could it be that the story-keepers in the Mediterranean area mixed or blended the rather vague memory of Atlantis, with the similarly vague (and "legendary") stories about Paradise?

According to the Bocksaga the origin of Mankind was evolving from the first family of Man, - from where all human beings descend. This happened during a period refered to as Paradise-time, when the Planet was perpendicular to the sun and the whole ball was tropical/subtropical.

As the population grew, the first family made a organisation to govern the growing family; where the first son became the (nature-chosen) King, his 10 brothers became the Kings Council, - and the 12th brother became the new breeder of the family.

Thus we got the first King of the planet. Now his 12th brother started to breed more than 12 sons/daughters; establishing offspring (called rabis) who went out to start new families and populations around the the first Ringland, called Oden - or "Eden"/"Edon".

As the Rabis established new ringlands, these where populated and governed by their very sons and daughters, who in turn also got children, who also had the right to make children. Thus the King on top of the globe enlarged the Kingdom of Man, through the "Houses" of his Sons, who in turn created Earls with their Manors - where he created the Sirs (Serfs) who went to build and populate each Yard. The serfs sons though were not to perpetuate the "Seed of Life", creating a uncontrolable number of new people.

Consequently we had a five-step pyramidal structure - in which the King is related to each and everyone in the Kingdom - through his sons, grandsons, and grand-grandsons. Thus, - from a certain point of view he became a forefather to all inhabitants. And as he descended in a straight line from the very first man and woman this "Pater Familias" was commonly known as "Allfader" - "Father-of-All".

(Today that still remains in the antique stories of "The Good/God Al-migthy", while "The Lord" actually used to refer to the Landlords, i.e. the Earls and the Rabis. "All-a" though, is seemingly clear.)

During Paradise we had a population slowly expanding - balancing against the surrounding nature, finding harmony with the universal forces. But - after a very long time some men and women got sloppy and ultimately altered the focus; away from "the good" to the indifferent, disobedient or the outright promiscuous.

As "Man turned his face away from the Good Father" Paradise-time started to cease. It all ended with a cataclysmic finale, as the whole earth got shaken and stirred and by shockwaves, - as from an Asteroid. From the oceans we got tremendous amount of water evaporating - to assemble around the poles, where it condensed during a period of only three months; to become two enormous ice-caps, one on each pole.

As said before, - within the ice-cap in the north there was a constant rift, that didn`t freeze up, - because of a stream of hot ocean-water, arriving from the cooking-pot of the Mexican Gulf (where the earth's skin is at its thinnest) towards the east along the rotation of the globe itself, - to be pressed northwards by the deep-ocean polar-currents, - arriving with water still hot - at the Finnish Bay (where the earths "skin" is at its thickest, i.e. oldest).

Inside this rift and "pocket" of the global ice-cap there was a few of the old royals surviving - even being able to recreate and regenerate themselves - becoming more and more fit to live in an arctic surrounding.

When this eonic period ended - the palewhite arcticals began to re-create contact with their southern fellow beings - who had kept their basic structure as 10 Kingdoms around in the tropical world. As the arcticals arrived they managed to reconnect to all kingdoms, reflecting on the different languages - recreating basic words from sounds familiar to all men.

With the arrival of the arcticals in the tropics, the history of the Alt-land-is was fresh on the streets, aprox. 9.500 years ago. But today we can only see the fragments of this news, - as the true stories about us have been violated, altered, twisted, surpressed, falsified and basically forgotten. But still, - around the globe we may find parts or fragments reflecting these most dramatic periods in the history of Mankind.

Not before our day and age are we able to conduct a free and thorough research into these matters, with the nuclear techniques and tests just made avaliable through modern science.

In this retrospect we should not look too fast or hard at the discrepancies that may exist between the only sources existing that may trace us back to find, understand and even recover the lost stories about our ancient ancestors.


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-27-2004).]

IP: 195.159.180.70


[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 03-04-2005).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:52:10 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:45             
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atalante
Member posted 01-28-2004 09:21
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Here is a link which claims that most of the Indo-European peoples (including the Vedic people of India) originated near Finland, during 5000-2000 BC when Finland's climate was warmer than the present by 4 degrees Centigrade. http://www.dipmat.unipg.it/~bartocci/ep6/ep6-vinci2.htm
IP: 198.81.26.9
tarkin22180
Member posted 01-29-2004 12:34
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Put simply, blue eyes are the result of recessive genes. I.E. it takes 2 of these genes to express blue eyes.
This is born out time and time again in today's world. Brown eyed brown haired couples can produce blue eyed blond haired ofspring. The science of genetics has already proven this.

Before the pole shift, the ice cap was centered in the Hudson Bay. Conversely, the southern ice cap was centered in the Indian Ocean just off Antarctica.

Thus, the transantarctic mountains would give protection from the cold north winds, as Plato described, to Atlantis in Antarctica! Atlantis being near what we call Marie Byrd Land near had a mild climate.

Finland, would be mild, though not via the gulf stream, but by its relatively distant location from the ice cap of long ago.

The fact that more and more "underwater" cities are being discovered lends strength to the arguement that the ocean levels were 200 to 300 feet below current levels, as predicted by an ice cap in the Hudson Bay.

John


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:52:36 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:46             
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Boreas
Member posted 01-29-2004 21:01
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1.0 It is rather common knowledge that blue/green eyes (and pale complexion) is ressesive to the brown-eyes (and dark complexion). If one of each cuouple to make children, - 3 out of 4 will be brown-eyed, rigth?
1.01 During the last 150 years travel, globetrotting and migrations have exploded. Today we have a multi-cultural world where individuals from all corners of the world meet and couple. With the present speed of cross-etnic breeding the blue-eyed, blond arctical specifics are dropping drastically.
Last year Scandinavian newspapers brougth headlines over repports from British Geneticans who predict that The Last Blonde female is going to be born about 35 years from now...
1.1 That clearly implies that the original mankind was born tropical, with brown eyes and dark complexion. In the tropical hemisphere we may find indigneous populations that still are ALL brown-eyed. Not only are the Meso-American Indians, but also the Africans, Asian indians, the Chinese, the Maori and the Aborigines.
1.12 Now if we where all brown-eyed; How could the blue-eyed mutation occur? How many generations would it take? And what pre-condition are demanded?!

1.2 Since brown-eyes always have been dominant - doesn`t it clearly suggest that the blue-eyed mutation must have developed IN ISOLATION - over a number of generations?
HOW many generations it will take is hopefully a question that the geneticians of today may be able to elaborate. Anyone knowing of some scientifical research on this matter?

1.3 ICE-TIME: The maximum spread of the ice-caps - and the sequences of the melting-preocesses are still not close to "conslusive knowledge". But we are getting closer all the time! The recent issue of the scientific journal "Nature" is bringing the last update. Just click to: www.naturemagazine.uk

2.0 Great web-site You refer to Atalante! The Italian professor Felice Vinci - a leading authority on Homeric Litterature - is incredibly spot on to something "really big" here. Funny that it conicides so incredibly well with the Finish Sagas...

2.1 In the oldest greek litterature we can also read about "Hyperborea" is the land at the northern rim of the world - inhabitated by the "peacefull, blissfull and longlived".

2.2 Moreover, a decade ago I heard present Greek historians (mythologists) explaining that Apollon where arriving to Olympos from the high North. A similar "legend" is said to be refered in India, where Hanuman where descending from the high north.

3.0 According to different myths - from around the globe - we hear of a "Golden Age" of Humankind, also refered to as the "Paradise-time".

3.1 After Paradise we got "the expeltion" as the paradisial culture broke up - to finally cease and terminate. This is explained in different ways by differnt traditions; but they all agree to the core of the matter - that "Man behaving studiply" was the initial cause of the downfall. The occurence of the enormous ice-caps was a cataclysmic consequence.

3.2 With glimmering glaciers and sparkling snowflakes the southern populations could talk of a "Silver Age", when a isolated group in the north experienced a horrible climate ("Fimbulwinter") - initiated a period of complete isolation, because all the land around them where entirely covered with ice. In Scandinavian tongue that is (still!) called "Alt-Land-is", which may answer the question about what language the Atlantens spoke...

3.3 After the fall of Paradise - and "The Kingdom of the Heavens" - we got a period of several kingdoms, also litterated as "The Kingdoms of The Earth". Now mankind developed into different brancehes within the different geographical parts. Still we find theese different races, cultures and languages. In the very east the Chineese still are Chineese, the Indians still Indians, - and so on until we find the Inkas at the western rim of the world.

3.4 All theese people are obviously more than 10.000 years old. And it is still a puzzle to me how "modern man" could have been developing into 10-12 completly different races/cultures and languages in just about 40.000 years - when ALL "modern man" are said to have been jumping out of Africa.

3.5 By the way: During the press-conference before the Sydney Olympic 2000 it was "released" that Australian scientists just have been finding remains of Aboriginals that more than 110.000 years old. Does that mean that the "Out of Africa-THEORY" (70-40.000 BP) is outdated - OR does it mean that the Aboriginal populations does not belong to "Homo Sapiens sapiens" ?!?

3.6 There are obviously great revisions to be made in our modern science. But - as I have been pointing to in this forum; there is now existing - in public - a source of information from the old traditions of Saga- and Story-telling that actually gives an outrigth, detailed and chronological explanation to the different periods of development that Mankind have gone through.
Now - WE may choose to ignore or even dismay this source - but that would be ignoring and dismaying our very own history...

4.0 The Bockström Family Saga gives a broad resume of our legendary, mythological and cultural history. As the isolated arctic population where able to keep the MEMORY of our common Paradise-time; as they survived the eonic ice-time in a local isolation.

4.1 As they finally survived "Alt-land-is-time" this Arctical "Boat-people" where able to reconnect with the different tropical kingdoms, as in the Mediterrenean about 9.500 years ago.
Here they got known as the "Atlanteans" explaining to come from the "Atlantis" - as they told their story about their hard time of isolation during the "Alt-land-is-period" (All-land-ice-period).

4.2 Included in their Sagas where the Atlanteans memory of Mans common origin and his ancient "high-culture", during Paradise-time.
Besides an extraordinary knowledge of the past the Atlanteans (Good men - Goods) should have brougth different "goods" to their tropical brethren, such as domestic plants and animals,as well as the technological prosessing of different metals for decoration and tool-making.

4.3 About 4.000-3.500 years ago we know that violence and war started to spread in Major Asia, soon reaching Persia, Greece and Egypt. Finanly also the Roman population got infected by "the culture of war".

4.31 From then on the historical treasures, the finer arts and the old tradions of knowledge and culture got distorted and destructed. Finally the entire classical culture, such as the Egyptian, Greek and Roman got destroyed, - as did their liberaries, their olympics and their academies.

4.32 At the end of "The Bronze Age" we may see how Solon and Plato where of the only few who was still able to keep A MEMORY of the very roots of the classical Greek-Roman culture.

4.4 As the famous Caesar organised criminals and bred murderers ("solidiers") into a horrendous army, tyrrany and the culture of war also broke into Europe. Thus the classical Celtic culture was splintered, but it still took a millenium before the most "peaceful corner of the world"; Scandinavia, was conquerred.

4.5 By the 16th century the culture of death and destruction had accelrated to enormous dimensions as even "The New World" - "Terra Fortunate" - was to be raped, masacred and plundered. And, - as we all know - this most unfortunate of all cultures are still ruling major parts of our world.

5.0 Only in the most remote parts of the Northern Hemisphere where the substantial knowledge from Antiquety able to survive the last two milleniums massive destruction of civilisations and culture. But the complete and historical Saga of Humanitys ancient Antiquety was only kept in the Boxström Family - the last remaining descendents from the ancient "Kingdom of Vinland" (Finland). According to the legends refered to in a present article in Atlantis Rising - about the Spanish conquistador De Soto - this Old Vinland was the "sacred place" where "The Hall of Records" are to be found. See also: www.bocksaga.de and look at the menu under: Leminkainen.


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:53:11 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:49             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Brig
Moderator posted 01-29-2004 21:29
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So all ya gotta do is find the northern hall of records and translate. Whites could be a mutation. Not all albinos have pink eyes; some have blue (yeah I know they aren't true albinos).Brown bears turned white to form the polar bear. Other northern creatures sport white coats. Yeah, I know, that probably doesn't answer the question either. I'll accept the possibility of most Atlantean theories, but I'll still have my favorites until proof arises that dictates which one is right.
IP: 205.188.208.39
Boreas
Member posted 01-29-2004 21:53
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Look at the Sagas web-site Brigg - there is a story about a hallway in different northern myths and legends.
In the Saga from 1984 it was pointed to a mountain top in the Finish countryside of "Sibbo" (compare de Soto`s "Cibola")where the entrance was said to be. Furthermore the nature of the entrance was explained in detail.
As You may read there was a large excavation done in the years 1987-1992 that really proved that the entrance of the hallway DOES exist. Before the funding ran out the crew had dug out a 4x5 metres wide hallway going about 70 metres straigth into the mountain...


IP: 195.159.182.67

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:53:43 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 02-02-2004 13:17
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Boreas,
No big arguement from me.

The science of genetics is more complicated. For example 3 out of 4 is a good estimate. But put more concisely, each child has a 25% chance of expressing the blue eyed blond haired trait (assuming both partners carry the recessive gene). As you know, flipping a coin randomly is a 50 - 50 proposition, yet just because you got a heads the first time does not mean that you will get a tails on the next flip. I've seen 8 heads in a row. But over the long haul, the percentage is 50 - 50.

There is the complication that the couple only had three children! The bottom line is that the brown eyed brown haired people can carry the recessive gene. Another example, say one partner carries the brown and the blue eyed gene, but the other partner doesn't (brown,blue + brown,brown). The percentage changes.

What we do know is that (blue,blue + blue, blue) always produces a blue eyed offspring. If a population of recessive traits was isolated, it is a fact that the children would all be blue eyed.

There are many combinations of genes available to humans in general. The mixing of these genes produce great variety.


As far as the first humans, debate continues. Were we the result of millions of years of genetic recombinations and mutations? Or were we "created"? I've heard many stories and myths explaining the Red, Black, Yellow, and White races. The human blood types (O, A, B, AB and their positive and negative sub types) is also a puzzle. Why do two of our chromosomes look "fused" together? Were humans indeed created in the "gods" own image? The Sumerians say their gods, the Anunnaki, created humans. Of note, the Sumerians have accurate written description of the planets (long before modern man sent a space probe).

The Boxström Family site mentioned here is interesting. Verbal details in the stories have been verified. Ring Land is a nice concept. Perhaps there was a time that the earth axis was truly perpendiclar to the sun. We know that it was not always 23 degrees. I'm sure more and more archeaological finds will happen that will further our knowledge of ancient times.

Can you imagine the Roman general's expression when he saw for the first time that the Celts had chariots!

Plato's casual reference to the "counter continent" in the Atlantis story blows me away!

The Incas and Spanish have myths about a white people that came from the south.

I believe that Flem-Ath proposed that the remnants of the Atlantians (in Antarctica) migrated north after the "sinking". Plato says that Atlantis was a vast maritime power before the disaster. A vast maritime power would have "colonies" through out the world. This is a plausible explaination of ancient cultures we are discovering or have already discovered.

Lots of pieces of the puzzle to put together. The big picture is harder still in that a lot of the pieces have yet to be discovered!

John

IP: 128.231.88.4



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:54:28 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:50             
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Boreas
Member posted 02-03-2004 12:50
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As one may see the newly discovered Saga explains that the first human beeings where born from a coupulation between to of the highest mammals known; a monkey and a nanny-goat (!)
The incident is said to have taken place on the most energetic playground of the old, pre-icetime earth, i.e. the old north-pole.
This twin couple was of oposite sex, to be known as "Fröy" and "Fröya". "Frö" still means seed, while "y" refers to the key of the male (fallos) and "a" to the (a-daptive) "doorway" of the female.
The place where this was happening was to be called O-den, as in "The O", meaning "The Circle". According to the myth the land of "Oden" was placed at the "top of the pole" with "Hel" ("Whole") as its centre.
From here the first human beeings (the twins) where able to succesfully mate, - to breed the first family of human beings, calling themselves "Aser".

According to the Bocksaga already the first two people (Fröy and Fröya) had a complete vocalubary of human sounds. Thus they created the first language - later called "Rot" ("root"). This is said to still be exisiting in the northern hemisphere.

From the pole within the first circle (pi); "pee-pole" or "people" became fruitful and spread throughout the planet, according to a plan to maintain a natural natural and good life. This period was then called "Paradise-time".

At one point men deviated from the natural and good life, creating the preconditions for a great cataclysm hitting the eart about 50 million years ago. The Saga describe this dramatic shift as a relocation of the earths axis - starting a climatical disaster, as the northern and southern hemisphere got iced down by two enourmous ice-caps. As said before that was to be the start of "Alt-land-is-time", - today known as "ice-time".

As one may know "ice-time" is a pretty new concept, as is modern Geology. Thus the information from the Saga is even more puzzeling, as it describes a lot of specifics about the ice-caps that just have been discovered by current science.

The Saga tells that the old north pole was situated where we today find the far thickest part of the earth surface, today known as the Fenno-Scandic shield. Further it states that the old ringland of Oden - the centre during Paradise-time - now is to be found in Finland, where we (still) find the county of Oden-ma, with its centre Hel-sinki. How could the old oral tradition so explicitly tell where modern Geophysics would discover the thickest part of the earths entire surface?

During ice-time we had enourmous ice-caps executing substatial tectonic pressure resulting in an ongoing continental drift, isolating continents - with all their plants, animals and people. The people inside the Baltics where caugth in isolation, becomming white. Around the equatorial waters people grew into different races in different shades of coulours (as in "rays" from the sun...)

After 50 million years this isolation was broken - starting a process of reunion between the white seafarers from Altlantis and their different tropical brethren. Thus the Meso-Americans tell about their "True White Brother" arriving "from the east" and the Mediterranean myths tell about the Atlanteans. Since arcticals staying in the warm sunshine gets a rather glossy complexion of yellowish (golden) brown they where also called "the shining" - as in Meso-tomanian legends.

May this old Nordic saga actually offer an explanation to our origin? May a 50 million years long ice-time - where geographical areas and large societies got isolated - be the cause of the different "rays" (kinds) of people existing today?
Are not all speaking creatures neccesarily stemming from the same origin?
May a nanny-goat be the missing link in the evolutionary concept?! And, finally; doesnt the incredibly logic and stringent complexity of this Saga - stating a complex variety of unknown information along with well-known history and brand new scientific discoveries - in itself prove that this source of information is something far more than, say; the result of an impressive scientific theory or an ingenious, spot on intuition?!


IP: 195.159.177.254


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:54:40 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 11-08-2004 10:53             
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Brig
Moderator posted 02-03-2004 17:12
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When you brought up the part about a nanny-goat and a monkey, I think you lost all of your support on this theory. Or were you just joking?
IP: 152.163.252.33

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:54:54 am
via mars
Member posted 02-03-2004 18:21
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i would have to say - one of the more astounding concepts/theories thus far put forth in the threads here. now for the encore ...
IP: 68.163.66.202


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:55:03 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 02-04-2004 10:51
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And Adam was made from clay! And Eve from Adam's rib. The Aztecs were made from corn. Hey, it is a myth with some "hidden truth" behind it.
The "twin" theme is common in mythology. Rome was founded by twins. The Atlantis story mentions severl sets of twins. Twins are mentioned in some American Indian myths. No doubt there is an esoteric meaning behind all of this.
Food for thought, the Sumerians claim that they were not only created by their gods, the Anunnaki, but that they were ruled by their gods for many hundreds of thousands of years.

The Hindu myths say man was around for several million years. They have stories about their gods fighting each other. As do the Greeks, Egyptians, Sumerians, etc. The Hindu myths describe "flying machines" used by the gods. And archeologists have found evidence that nukes were used long long ago in India.

And "ringland"? The capital city of Atlantis was composed of concentric rings! A distant mythological memory perhaps?

John

IP: 128.231.88.4




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:55:27 am
atalante
Member posted 02-04-2004 13:01
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Research about the mitochondrial DNA of nanny-goats shows that the "original" mother goat lived around 10,000 BC. http://www.cnrs.fr/cw/en/pres/compress/ChevreDome.htm
IP: 198.81.26.9



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:55:48 am
Brig
Moderator posted 02-04-2004 14:22
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Tarkin: The "evidence" of nuclear events in the past are as yet circumstantial. But you will also find these circumstantial evidences also in the Sahara and Scotland. But none are proven to be manmade; as yet.
IP: 64.12.96.12



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:56:01 am
indy
New Member posted 02-05-2004 13:27
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The myths concerning our creation and the science of our origin are all adressing the same issue. The challenge for our generation is to find the best possible information of both kinds of sources.
Whether we arose from the dust of the earth or we were created by a mutation of a schimpanse is still a to be solved question. Who can tell before modern science have adressed this question specifically if the nanny goat was helping the monkey to turn into a human being.
The features of the modern man are obviously baring structures that are not present in the monkey such as a big forehead, a straight spine and the female feeding organs.
Three things that the monkey does not have but can be seen in a normal nanny goat: a big forehead, a straight spine and the female feeding organs.

This really interesting but no problem.
How about the biology, Boreas?


[This message has been edited by indy (edited 02-05-2004).]

IP: 213.73.115.110




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:56:14 am
Brig
Moderator posted 02-05-2004 15:26
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Ok Guys get real.
IP: 205.188.208.39


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:56:24 am
Boreas
Member posted 02-06-2004 13:33
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Ok Brigg; Isn`t authentic photos REAL enough? Isn`t the photos of www.bocksaga.de REAL evidence that this saga-material REALLY exist? Or do You REALLY think I have abilities beyond comprehension - that is needed to just make this thing up?!
If You just happend to come across a story far bigger, much more complex and chrono-logically build than Tolkiens collected works - wouldn`t You say the magnitude of the material itself clearly indicates it must be dwelling on some REALITY?!
[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-06-2004).]
IP: 193.217.37.182




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:56:40 am
Brig
Moderator posted 02-06-2004 21:43
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Why,do you think Tolkein was writing about a real place? I assure you he wasn't. Like I said, until you started crossing nanny goats with monkeys, you were making some sense. Then blamo, you come up with that assinine notion. Or perhaps I was misreading you? Perhaps the nannygoat and monkey were symbolic of something else?
IP: 205.188.208.39



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:57:19 am
Brig
Moderator posted 02-06-2004 21:51
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The photos are not without interest. But so far it simnply shows that a people constructed an underground area for habitation. You can find like structures around the world. You need stronger artifactual evidence. Were tools, ornaments, writings found in any of these areas?
IP: 205.188.208.39



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:57:30 am
Boreas
Member posted 02-07-2004 12:10
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Dear Brig,
1. In what scientific context does the word "assinine" belong?
2. The point with the hallway - already excavated - in Finland is simply this:

2.1 After centuries in private secrecy the family-saga revealed the exact location of this hallway in 1987. As You know by know this saga contains loads of historical and mythological information, also a exstensive story of "Atlantis" - explaining - in scientific TERMS - its origin and history.

2.2 To prove the validity of the whole saga-material the orator was pointing out a specific place in the Finish woodlands - in 1987 - where the entrance to this hallway should exist.

2.3 When his english/american friends wanted to see it they started excavating. And as You also know - during a major excavation a large hallway was indeed found. After five summers of work a 70 metres long - 4x5 metres wide hallway have indeed been excavated!

3. There is obviously "something" there. And thats the whole point - so far.
The statement of an entrance was proven rigth. The statement of a hallway was proven rigth. So what does this reality imply concerning the statements made about the inner end of this hallway - being an ancient temple, etc.? Worth consideration? Worth further investigation (excavation)?

The mere existence of this hallway have proven - beyond any doubt - that the orator have proven to be rigth - as far as he has been able to - or ALLOWED to - present his proofs.

4. Not only have this hallway emerged from the woodland, but also other and more recent discoveries have been proven that this family-saga must be substantial. One example beeing the statement (of 1984/85) that Finland had been populating DURING ice-time.

4.1 Througout the 1980-ties that was a completly "ridicolous" statement in the ears of contemporary science. And as late as 1995 Finish arhaeologist where completly refusing such a thougth, stating that "there where absolutely no reason to suggest that there have been people surviving in Finland before the end of ice-time, 10.000 years ago".

4.2 Now that very same year the (by now) famous Wolfcave was found. Three years later it was conclusivly proven (by Finish AND German lab-tests) that the Wolfcave contained cultural remains that ranged between 9.000 and 280.000 years. The tools, etc. here found can be viewed at www.nba.fi/wolfcave.

4.3 Now how could this presise, most incredible "foretelling" be explained?!?
How could a highly local family-saga, based on the OLD oral method of the Norse Saga-tradition, contain this astounding information?! And what does that IMPLY about the validity of this peculiar source?
Any answers, Brig?

4.4 On a neighbouring thread in this Forum somebody just used the well-known qote: "Those who have ears may hear, those who have eyes may see." Rigthly so. Not to say that all who have their good brain left may understand...

5. The mythologies, the sagas and the ancient remains of the world is there. And a lot more is to be discovered and investigated scientifically for the first time - thanks to the technical instruments that just have been developed - in our day and age.

5.1 During the last years development in this area a unknown Finish Saga have risen to prove its genuine authencity, probably of "immense" significance as its align incredibly well with the recent, but more famous descriptions made by Thomson and Cremo in their works about "Forbidden Archaeology".

6.0 When I refer to JRR Tolkien it is merely to point to the fact that he based all of his litterate works on the remains he could find from the N-European sphere.

As You may know the so-called "folklore-material" are ALL based on oral traditions - at some point collected in books. The remains from continental Europe and England are rather poor, since the monopolistic culture of the Catholic church seiously prohibited ANY information accept its own - that were only kept in latin.

6.2 At the end of the clerical regime over European culture, as the classical academias where allowed some freedom; there were only small fragments ("legends") of the old wisdom kept in Europe. Only in the Nordic countries could the 19th century scholar find pockets of information from a "non-christian" culture, - and they where all hidden in legends found only in the remote islands of the Atlantic, the remote mountains of Norway/Sweden or the deep woodlands of Finland, Carelia and Russia.

6.3 The only exception from mainland Europe and England was the legends kept by some of the old families descending from the pre-christian elite, namely some royal and some noble families. But, since start of the inqvisition (aqvisating goods for their mercy) and the massacre of the nobility known as Templars the surviving noblility of Europe had to keep any knowledge of this kind highly secret. Only in the more remote parts could the peasant familes keep some of this traditions - and than only as fairy-tales. As You may know even the Norse sagas was saved only by a handfew books - that got saved by secrecy.

6.4 Within the old Finish nobility there was TWO families that was able to understand the importance of keeping the old histories intact. So by 1248 they very counsciously kept the old tradition within their families - in complete discretion from ANY others. Not even the neighbours would get to know. If only the suspicion would arise within their own (swedish-catholic) churh - the whole family could risk persecution. Consequently this great secret had to be kept until Finland once again was to become a free and independent kingdom - which did not occur before 1917...

6.5 The legends and myths of the Finish and the Carelian countryside lived on in local gatherings though, along with some old (headon) traditions, such as Father Christmas, The Easter Egg, The May Pole, etc.

6.6. So when Tolkien - as well as other 20th century historians - wanted to recreate a European mythos, they had to turn to the Norse Sagas and the Finish legends to have anything at all..! Luckily, here they could get A understanding of what had been the basis of also the English and the European mythologies.

6.7 Tolkien became incredibly found of the Finish Myths as they had "flavoures and tastes" that did not exist (anymore) in the western part of Northern Europe. To get the best possible "taste" he even took the trouble to learn the Fenno-Ugrian language - to be able to read the original texts - which he compared to "finding a completly new wine, or even 3-4 different, completly unknown wines".

6.8 Consequently we may conclude what most litterate-students know; The basis of Tolkiens mythological world was found in the Norse and Finish myths. And they - in turn - are based on historical realities - as are any authentic mythology, rigth?!

7.0 Today a growing body of collected material from different old cultures are made available - even in english. Simultaniously the natural sciences are giving us much more and better information from archaeological sites around the globe. Meanwhile molecular biology are giving us another reference to add to the picture. And sites like this are now collecting information from different professions adressing one and the same issue.

The question rigth now is if we - the citizens of this day and age - do have the abilities needed to comprehend, understand and apreciate theese newly discovered realms of history. My belief is that readers of Atlantis Rising and participants of this Forum will be among the first to REALY get the zest of it. Wheter You like the smell of goats or not...!


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-07-2004).]

IP: 195.159.178.147




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:57:42 am
Brig
Moderator posted 02-07-2004 14:22
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My main bone of contention, which you did not explain, was this inbreeding of a nanny goat and monkey. If you reread my posts, I said you were making pretty good sense up to that point. It was kinda like Plato ending his Atlantis story with "Zeus gathered together all the gods and had them assign Donald Duck to a rein terror on the peoples of Atlantis". Explain the goat-monkey bit.
IP: 64.12.96.12


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:57:59 am
Boreas
Member posted 02-07-2004 16:27
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The different mythologies that we hold to authentic have all a story about our origin. They need to have - since the "Story about The People" (etc.) have to start with an explanation of "The Beginning".
In the Norse prose - from Iceland - the first people is comming from a cow, licking on two stones of salt. There are different ways of looking at this myth - but there may be a link from the myth to the reality of the first agricultural people that spread throughout the northern hemisphere.
In the much deeper, more complex and broad Saga from Finland there is an explanation
of how "Life" occured on this planet. The information about this - and the further evolution - is quite incredible in its detail. Thus it should be refuted as "speculations" - if it wasn`t for the fact that it all co-relates step by step with modern science`s outline of the evolution in nature. The details of information can is meticiously built in one structure that can even be referenced by the linguistical impact of the names given to the different plants and animals.

As the algea turned into plants and animals we get sexual breeding. The animals takes two directions as they carry their soft-tissue either inside a capsule or outside a (bone-)structure. Thus we get reptiles AND mammals, not neccesarily one only.

Modern biology have got quite far into understanding the general principles of evolution, - but there is still much unknown about the history of its different stages back in time. We have to keep in mind that such research was not possible until the late 19th century - and even Darwin and Wallace did not dare to publish their work before the very end of their lives, due to the obvious stigmatizatiopn they would suffer from the "moral majority" of their time.

The natural sciencce of biology is - in princip - still a young profession. But the questions at hand are as old as the human beeing. And before most philosophy got abstraction and politics - during mid-eval time - there was obviously existing both real knowledge and logical explanations to the magnitude of life present on our planet.

According to this old wisdom - as it is refered in the Bocksaga - there was a evolutionary leap fron the alge to the eel to the frog. Now the frog turned into a full mammal that by time and evolution created higher species, resulting in the monkey. Another line created the hoof-animals where the goat turned out the most adaptive - or the most fitting - fourlegged animal.

The degree of adaption seem to be connected to the degree of brain capacity, what we generally call inteligence. The Bocksaga explicitly recall the most important stages of this evolution - in what we may call "scientific" terms (stringent, logical reason). And it does explicitly say that it one time happened that a monkey (succesfully)copulated with a nanny-goat, breeding a twin-couple that not only lived, but where able to copulate and - most importantly - recreate. Thus nature had - once again - created a new specie...

Since nobody have had any possibility to create such a theory out of present scientific data, it must be more than interesting to investigate this matter through molecular biology. As far as I know that still remains to be done. Until our present geneticians care to do some adequate research of this matter there is litle or nothing to add to the matter.

Except - of course, that geneticans resently concluded that there is a clear link between goats and dolphins. Genetically it seems that dolphins have arrived from goats, which implies that a branch from a higher land-mammal have returned to the shores of the ocean and further into the deep blue...

As others have commented here - there are a number of references in other myths that does point in the same direction. And we should not be surprised to learn that there actually was an earthly creature performing the function needed to jump from monkey to man.

Wouldn`t it be nice if a mythology - i.e. information from our ancient schools of knowledge - actually could answer the question about the "missing link"? I still do not see what might be so ridiculous about the nanny-goat...


IP: 195.159.188.207




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:58:16 am
Brig
Moderator posted 02-07-2004 16:58
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What is so ridiculus is the fact, a very firm fact, that it would be a physical impossiblity for a goat to breed with a monkey. Or that such a breeding would produce anything alive or anything...period. If you wish to push this theory of northen evolution in human terms, you had best forget the goat and monkey.
IP: 64.12.96.12





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:58:30 am
rajesh
Member posted 02-08-2004 06:49
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Respected DB:
QUOTE>> Didn`t evolution explain the white race? Man living in the colder climates for 20,000 years, made the mellon in the skin turn white and made the noses close up Rajash answer my question, as to why the Asian eyeslids are swollen and narrow. From migating and battling the colder climates. Makes sense to me. <<UNQUOTE
Here I expect that by Asians, you specifically mean the Mongols. Their narrow eyelid slits can be an outcome of their exposure for some/many thousands of years to the DRY and perennially surrounding icy locations. This change could have been evolved to safeguard the internals of their eyes from the glare of ice or “white blindness”. This effect could have been more prominent during the Ice-Ages. Also it could have been more prominent on the Siberian side of the North Pole due to presence of relatively larger land masses (including now sunken Atlantis!) on the eastern side of the Globe.

The distinct yellowness underneath their white skin also points to some additional and unusual vitamin A storage capacity, that is not available to other races. This may indicate that they were getting their Vitamin A from the liver and meat and not from the milk etc. Also the antelope livers were intermittent and short in supply on those icy surroundings and so the body had to develop the mechanism for their storage of Vit-A. Their relatively developed calf muscles can also indicate their living originally at the northern side of Himalayan peaks during the same ice ages. I mean they faced the combination of mountainous peaks, constant icy glare and the dry ice.

Whiteness can be a common feature of cold, reduced intensity of sun rays and thermal radiation and Vitamin-D deficiency in the surroundings. So that the body coverts more and more of sun rays into Vitamin D. This can be more justified for the vegetarians than the non-vegetarians.

Whiteness of Europeans can be a somewhat different story. They were to be exposed to cold but with WET Ice and wet surroundings. They could have originated at the slopes and surroundings of Himalayas during the Ice Ages. Then they could have stayed for long near the wet regions of Caspian Sea. Then they could have migrated to North West Europe and Western side of North Pole. Here due to open proximity of Atlantic Ocean, abundance of wetness can be expected. Also the milk and liver can be available in relatively larger quantities. So no yellowness in skin due to Vit-A availability and no narrow eye slits due to reduced icy glare. Here further increase in skin whiteness due to reduced Vit-D from sun rays can be expected.

The blue colored eyes and golden hairs can be the mutation as a resultant of reduced UV radiation during the Ice Ages. Theoretically this could have affected equally to both the European and Mongol variants. However narrower Mongol eyelid slits could have been less exposed and so less prone to mutations arising out of variations in the UV radiation levels. Also the black Mongol hairs would not have altered much to golden hairs as the dryness in air does not support weak hairs.

So most of the things may be dependent on “Dry White Blindness Vs Wet Ice”, Exposure to UV radiation, Vit A & D deficiencies etc.

With Regards...

IP: 210.214.154.215




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:58:54 am
indy
New Member posted 02-08-2004 13:13
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We have numerous stories and even pictures of normal men copulating with various cattle such as cows, sheep and nannygoats.
Why should it be impossible for a monkey to do the same?
The question is whether a fulfilled copulation between a monkey and a nannygoat could produce an alive fetus, a living being?
This is a different statement than saying that it may "rain cats and dogs".
We should not be deceived by the fact that this question - contrary to cats and dogs- is brandnew for all of us.
It is wellknown that a horse and a donkey can produce a mule. It is likewise known that mules never reproduce.
Recently it was reported that mules have occured that can reproduce themselves.
If a number of monkeys is copulating with a number of goats one combination may occur that really is able to breed living kids.-
It might be more phantastic if such kids would be able to reproduce themselves.
But such wonders are the trenchmarks of all evolutionary leaps.
kind regards...


IP: 213.73.114.242




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:59:01 am
rockessence
Member posted 02-08-2004 19:39
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One must ponder just how long have we been calling our children "kids"?? The saga seems to reveal a myriad of words on many subjects that connect to commonly used language. I am thrilled to read "Homer in the Baltic" on www.bocksaga.de by Vinci.
IP: 67.251.80.52



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:59:14 am
rockessence
Member posted 02-09-2004 19:42
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Another thought....in how many places across the world is the grandmother called "Nana" "Nanna" "Nani" and the one who cares for the "kids" is called the "nanny"???
IP: 67.250.189.96



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:59:32 am
Boreas
Member posted 02-13-2004 10:50
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There are indeed a lot of controversial stuff in the mentioned Bocksaga. Even to non-conventional scientists and people.
At the same time the open-minded layman can find a lot of obvious and highly interesting material for NEW thougth and reflection. Although "new" to us - it is evident that the source for this material is quite old - as it is keeping track of key-elements in our older languages.
According to the genetican John Richards at the Univ. of Huddersfield (GBR) the oldest populations in todays Europe is to be found in Scandinavia, where they came "more that 10.000 years ago".

Brand new archeological evidences from both Norway, Finland and Russia actually states (with 100 % scientific proofs) that modern man inhabitated the northernmost area of the Fenno-Scandic shield DURING ice-time, i.e. 10-40.000 years ago.

The discovery of a peculiar setlement in Finland are now under hot discussion, since it contradicts the common opinion (read: theory) that modern man emigrated out of Africa about 70.000 years ago - to reach Europe about 40.000 years ago. The finding of Susiluola ("The Wolf Cave"), 30 km outside the Finish city of Kristinestad contains human remains more that 280.000 years old. See; www.nba.fi/wolfcave.

Since the general opinion of biology "states" that mankind at this point where not evolved to homo sapiens sapiens yet, the conclusion of the Finish archaeologists and historians are keeping "due course" announcing that the Susisluola was inhabitted by Neanderthals.
Though there are NO technical evidence found to substantiate that statement. On the contrary; experts on the Neanderthals from sourthern Germany and Cro-Magnon of southern France and Spain both have determined that Neanderthals and Cro-Magnons where NOT able to conduct an arctical life. This have even been used as an explanation to why the Neanderthals and the Cro- Magnons "disappeared" - to the benefit of "modern man".

Consequently the recent discoveries from Fenno-Scandia, - of both biological and archaological as cultural nature - are obviously more in tune with the controversial material recently presented by Michael Cremo and Ron L. Thompson. Thus we may have to admit that conemporary science still is in the mist about the REALITY of out origin and history on this planet.

When the Finish Saga refers the legend of Atlantis in a most delibrate way it may be our duty to give it a "fair call" and an objective investigation.
One point I already have made is the fact that Fenno-Scandia during ice-time was an ISLAND (rather than a penninsula) - as the ocean passed from the Finish Bay over Ladoga and Onega to the White Sea. Thus the survivors of the cataclysmic end of the ice-time would say they "came from an island, larger than Libya and Asia together..." as the Greek/Egyptian sources are telling.

The later stories from the Homeric litterature are now pointing in the same direction - documented with a solid and convincing material by the italian Dr. Felipe Vinci. That Dr. Vincis conclusions are highly controversial doesn`t change the matter that he has been revealing hard, new facts on theese old matters.

We can`t change the history of the earth, of life and of humankind. But we may be able to change our understanding of it.
During the last century alone the general understanding of the age of man have changed a number of times - starting with some 6-7000 years (since "Adam and Eve") and ending with todays ASSESMENT of 5-6 million years, since "Homo habilis". And - by the way - the explanations of the origin, cause, course and effects of the Gulf-stream have also changed dramatically over the last decades. Not to mention the history of the ice-time. And both theese topics are still not being finally and completly understood. Just ask any serious and professional geologist.

During the last century modern science have gone through numerous aletrations and changes in their opinions about the origin of man. Thus it should not be too difficult to understand that OUR presumptions - that we often hold as facts - again will change. The mentioned discoveries are indeed pointing to that we - again - will have to re-examine the basic understanding of our own history, in - yet another - new ligth.

Have a good and reflective week-end!


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-14-2004).]

IP: 193.216.90.16




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 02:59:50 am
Boreas
Member posted 02-13-2004 11:03
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dear Rajesh,
Could the loss of pigmentation - creating blue-green eyes and pale-white skin - have happened to the population that we KNOW lived in the Baltic - isolated during ice-time?
What about the extra-ordinary adjustment to milk-fat and -proteins? Would not that pre-clude an "evolutionary" process of consuming milk-products?

[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-13-2004).]

IP: 193.216.90.16




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:00:04 am
rajesh
Member posted 02-13-2004 17:55
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Respected Boreas:
Anywhere in North from Scotland to Finland could have been the apex and mass production center for the loss of pigmentation accompanied with the blue green eyes. This phenomenon had to be Non-Mongolian and so Baltic could be the region due to presence of relatively higher wetness. If some group lived there, long enough in isolation, then these genetic trends and mutation could have got higher amount of stability. However that may still leave the question open regarding the original place of these mutations.
All other Mongolian phenomenon could have reached to their zenith on the Siberian side.

Regarding the milk tolerance factor, I think that the peoples who had ancient connections genetically or culturally with the shepherds, cattle owners, Gaderias, Yadvas, Ahirs etc. can be expected to be the milk tolerant. This I feel to be some ancient Atlantean legacy. On the other end of this scale, the people who appear to be milk-intolerant may be basically sea-food dependent or dependent on meat and soft bones of the wild animals. Regarding Vitamin-D, I think that the sun rays are essential for its effective assimilation in the body and the pale white skin may permit it more and more.

So I consider that the evolutionary process of milk consumption and pulse eating has passed through the ventury of Atlantis.

With Regards...

IP: 210.214.154.196




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:00:26 am
Boreas
Member posted 02-14-2004 06:15
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Thanks for relevant and reliable information Rajesh. There are surely some highly interesting factors of pale-skin people related to the evolutionary adjustment of a seafood diet (fish AND algae). And; there is a combination of Caucasians and a diet of diaries.
This may - again - point to the information given in tha Saga-material, claiming that the Baltic population had to turn to animals, both fish, diary and meat/fat to survive the long, very cold and completly dark winters characteristic to ice-time.
To have a stable source of both vegetary and animal food it is told that the arctic survivors had to keep domestic animals, - and to specialize plants for extraordinary, seasonal growth. Out of this NEED - it is said - did this people starting to cultivate domestic plants and animals. Due to the sharply marked SEASONS it was crucial to keep this cultivation highly organised. As arctic farmers still knows - if you want to suceed living in the Scandinavian area - one have to start the fertilisation already in the fall - and the sawing of seeds as soon as the snow leaves the farmland as the spring appears. Thus all (arctic) farmers still have to follow the seasons very close, - and operate in a highly organised way to get the crop and produce needed to survive the (still) quite long winter-time...
From the facts now known, about the existence of an arctic population during ice-time, - it may be highly relevant to look into a new explanation to the development of AGRICULTURE. It may look like the culture of organised far5ming have developed due to a certain NEED, - congruent with the facts today known about the living-conditions during Baltic ice-time.

This may even coincide with the Mediterranean (and other) stories known about the "shining" ("boat-people", etc.) -
or the "good people" - bringing their natural goods to their tropical brethren. That may also explain the latest archaeological discoveries, as the spread of agricultural knowledge, plants and animals around the sub-tropic and tropic hemisphere.
As we know today agriculture occured in the Anatolian and Etiopian highlands (SUB-tropic climate) about 9.200 years ago.

If agriculture developed in the isolated Baltic, to start spreading in all directions after ice-time - it may also start to explain why theese few but remarkable Atlanteans got such a high regard within ALL the regions of the tropics. Under different names do we find the "Atlanteans", the "shining", the "gods" and the "true white brother" - arriving with extraordinary knowledge of nature and skills of technical kind.

A remarkable discovery is that the Etiopians imported five plants and five domestic animals simultaniously 9.200 BP. The same point is even underlined by the discovery that the same area completed their life-stock with five more domestic animals - arriving simultaniously (!) about 7.400 years ago.

---
According to the same saga there was - about 5-6000 years ago - a imigration to the arctical area from the Himalayan mountains. The Mongolians had long before discovered a rift in the global ice-cap created by the Uralian mountain-chain. Here the Mongul (meaning "yellow-tanned") arrived to the arctic ocean, from where they spread both east and west. We can still find the successors of this immigrations, - spread out in 12 different families - today tribes - still to be found around the North pole...!

---

The emigration of the arctical "Asers" - to the subtropic and tropical areas was - for obvious reasons - a bit more easy. As they met with their tropical brethren theese arcticals, as any caucasian today, could enjoy a better climate; from which they became "shining brown". The Finish Bocksaga tells explcitly about the Aser arriving to 10 different tropical kingdoms - straigth after ice-time. Hereto we have only had "tropical" legends describing these arrivals, such as the legends of the Incas, Mayas, Aztecs, Hopis, Greek, Egyptian, Sumerian and Vedic. With the Nordic myths and sagas, and finally the "Bocksaga" we can add a highly essential and clarifying piece to the overall picture.

In the sagas from Sweden, Norway, Brittan, Iceland and Faroe Islands the first arctical population is known to have called themselves "As-er". But from the later Norse Sagas - written during the religious regime of the Rome - we find the "Aser" redefined as "Headon Gods". A paralell treatment was already given to the legimate rulers of both the Greek as the Roman cultures, who both where overrun by warlords that evidently became "tyrrant-kings". With the clarifications from the Bocksaga it may be understod how Zeus and Jupiter - with their complete courts (Pantheons), - once was a real-life kingdom with a hands-on gouvernment of the old, legitimate Greek and the Roman cultures.

According to the Bocksaga they both originated on Crete, straigth south of Hel, todays Hel-sing-ki. This happened just after the Aser escaped the ice-time and arrived in the Mediterranean (about 9.500 years ago) where they made a pact with their tropical brethren, establishing one Eastern and one Western Kingdom, with Zeus/Pan and Jupiter/Bochus as their respective head-titles.

This happened with the support from the old, Finish capitol "Hel" ("Whole"/"Holi") and their "As-Hel-culture". Thus we may find the orgin of the "Hel-As-culture", created on Crete about 9.500 years ago. This is also giving a straigth, logical explanation of the relationship between Crete and the origin of the Mediterranean cultures, as well as their connection to a historical "Alt-land-is" ("All-land-ice").
Just note the potential sigificance of old names like Hel-io-pol-is, Per-Se-pol-is and Agro- or Akro-pol-is.

If one cares to do the work needed to understand the basic sound-system behind the Fenno-Scandic languages one will find inherent, but completly clear meanings in a lot of the names, places and persons of ancient stories. From this lingvistical codex - collected in a stringent and logic sound-system called the Alphabet (!) - one may find an overwhelming amount of relations between the arctical and the tropical myths. Just to indicate how far and wide this sound-system have reached I may mention how the sound "A" - as in "As" - still remains in essential tropical names, from Az-tec (and Co-As-Co-A-tell...) to As-tor-ia, As-ov, As-ia and even A(u)s-tral-ia.

The more one gets to understand from the different mythologies of the world the more one tend to reconize their similarieties, both in structures and functions. If one add the arctic mythologies to the picture it becomes clear that they all arrive from a common, ancient time and culture.
With the newly revealed Bocksaga at hand it even becomes possible to understand the HISTORICAL main-lines of our common, cultural background. We just have to be open and non-prejudicial, but objective and truly scientific about the matter.

It may simply be for us to enjoy,
what we are all about getting to know.


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-19-2004).]

IP: 195.159.185.221



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:00:38 am
Acid
New Member posted 02-24-2004 07:00
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ALT = Everything, all
Land = LAND
IS = ICE
It's swedish.
One HUGE mistake in the Bock Saga is the fact that there is no such place as UUDENMAA in Finland. It's UUSIMAA meaning new land, given by the Swedish people when they moved eastwards. The genetive form of 'uusi' is 'uuden' hence 'the area of uusimaa' is 'uudenmaan lääni'. It's rediculous to state that the name whould have anything to do with the Norse god Oden.

During the rading I found many similiar 'facts' that are not true. Anyway the story is compelling and there might be some truth in there too.

The part called 'Masterplan' had not much thruth in it whatsoever. Statements like 'Festival was held at the winter solstice, 22nd of December, 23rd was the day to sacrifice, (the ”X”in X:mas means two men to ”drink” each others sperm in ”69” position)' would back that up...


IP: 193.41.170.225





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:01:00 am
Faravid
New Member posted 02-24-2004 15:01
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Hi all,
I personally find the "Alt-land-is"-theory very fascinating and think that the sound-analyzing of the Bock saga gives here quite interesting result.
The Bock saga's idea is different to many other theories and maybe not so "cool" as some other visions about the Atlantis. I however regard the Bock saga's idea of it very clever, which definetly doesn't mean that I regard all other information about Atlantis as a false information. After all, the Bock's saga is only a family saga of one family.

I think that the birth of the white race according to the Bock saga is a logical idea. Also it's easy to understand why Nordic people would worship return of the sun after every winter if one thinks about Bock saga's vision about the arrival of the ice-age.

The time-frame of the saga's Alt-land-is sounds to me like a rounded number (50 million years). I'm also aware that currently scientists think that there were several (four) ice-ages, not just one during the last ca 100 000 years.

Acid wrote:
"One HUGE mistake in the Bock Saga is the fact that there is no such place as UUDENMAA in Finland."

What kind of mistake is that? Bock saga (to my knownledge) doesn't say that in the modern Finland exists a place called Uudenmaa... Saga simply says that there used to be a place called Uudenmaa. And think about this: at the coast of the Uusimaa there exists an island called "Odensö" ("Oden's island" in Swedish). Doesn't it someway point to the connection between Uusimaa and Oden? Kristfrid Ganander also mentions the island in his book "Mythologia Fennica".

And Boreas: it's "Finnish", not "Finish"...

[This message has been edited by Faravid (edited 02-24-2004).]

IP: 195.165.1.7





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:01:10 am
Acid
New Member posted 02-24-2004 23:42
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, this is from the 'Masterplan':
<I>The area around Helsinki is still named ”Uudenmaa”, officially.</I>
IP: 193.41.170.225


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:01:24 am
Faravid
New Member posted 02-25-2004 04:34
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Acid:
I'm sorry, you were right. I still don't understand why there reads so. It doesn't make any sense.
Regarding the fertility cult you mentioned earlier in the context of the Bock saga it's interesting to note how the modern science regards it healthy for one's health.

IP: 195.165.1.5





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:01:37 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 02-25-2004 12:20
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was wondering about two things. Is there any reference to copper water in the Bock Saga (or other myths)?
The words "Atl" and "Antis" are themselves of native America origins meaning "water" and "copper" respectively.
Atlantis is the place of the copper water in the American derivation. Not too close to the "All Land Ice" derivation. Let us not forget that Olympus (the home of the Greek gods) has been claimed to be derived from Atlantis (by Ignatius Donnelly).

My second question is the caste system described by the Bock Saga. Seems this comes straight from India (or vice a versa depending on one's point of view). I've not heard this said of Norse mythology (till the Bock Saga). Is there independent evidence to verify this claim?

John


IP: 128.231.88.4





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:01:47 am
Faravid
New Member posted 02-25-2004 14:08
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi John,
regarding the "copper water" which you mentioned I have to say I have never heard of such thing.

You asked also of an independent evidence to verify claim of Nordic caste system. I also haven't read from anywhere else that there would have been any similar system. (Perhaps there's something similar in the "Oera Linda book", I don't know.) Of course the general history knows the different social statuses (karj, jarl, etc.) of the old Nordic societys, but I believe researches tend to think that they existed mainly at the Viking era (and after) and were not connected in any major way to the creating of the next generations. Of the Aser-Vaner-system in Finland I have found only one weak clue. In his book "Mythologia Fennica" (published 1789) Kristfrid Ganander mentions one count Bonde who believed that the "Asars" had led the Finns in the ancient times. (The count used as a proof some words, little like in the Bock saga words are analyzed.)

IP: 195.165.1.5





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:01:58 am
via mars
Member posted 02-26-2004 07:44
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
just a couple of things ...
cesidio - about those discoveries of yours, namely the discs that have a tether. perhaps the tether is the "lifeforce" of the contraption, so to speak. what better way to harness heat and magnetic properties of the earth? call it a seed that sends it's root into the ground ... i believe it possible to extract energies of various natures by taprooting into the ground. you could literally build your own enclosure (house), and receive sustenance from mother earth. great way to keep warm during the ice-ages ...
boreas - does anything regarding theories of lloyd pye, i.e. genetics and agriculture ring a bell? can some of it fit the equation? interested to hear your take on those.

one thing i would like to point out about linguistics. coincidence of sounds and utterences - it happens. just because some culture used a certain term or spelling, doesn't imply a connection to a similar term or spelling. yes, there usually is a connection, but not always. kirk out

IP: 138.88.82.150



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:02:26 am
via mars
Member posted 02-26-2004 07:50
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
tarkin - are you hailing from middleburg? best regards, via mars 22207
or philomont?
IP: 138.88.82.150





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:02:55 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 03-02-2004 10:24
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Via Mars: I hail from Vienna, Virginia.
Faravid: Thank you. I think of the Norse as leaders, warriors, and everyone else. No formal caste system. I've never heard of "ringland" before, but what an intriging idea.
Though I subscribe to the Atlantis in Antarctica theory, here is a site claiming that Atlantis is in South America. Got to keep an open mind eh? http://www.geocities.com/webatlantis/

John

IP: 128.231.73.39



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:03:07 am
rockessence
Member posted 03-02-2004 19:22
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regarding Tolkien...I used a Web Translator on the section on Tolkien that was in German at www.bocksaga.de and it was really amazing. A difficult translation but still full of goodies and well worth checking out. I watched a documentary on PBS last night about Hitlers SS search for the ideal race in their ancestry and realized that the Bock saga may reveal the true basis for their crazy idea. The true race was not a race but but a mental and physical connection between the original humans and way of relating through the sound-system which formed a planet wide religion which was broken and destroyed forever by the onset of the ice age by separating the center of the ringland from all outside rings. Whew..sorry about that sentance. People today cannot conceive of most of this information. Too weird, too pagan, too strange and seemingly unverifiable. BUT...That there is still even ONE living member of the original pagan peoples is astonishing enough, but that this information is available to all the world is so unique, so amazing, that it stuns me that we can look forward to more revelations coming from the last original voice from the beginning of time.
Felice Vinci's document on "Homer in the Baltic" on www.bocksaga.de and another document from him I found on the net are so great....This shows the completely logical movement of northern peoples into the warmer climate of the Mediterranean AFTER Homer's heroic period.
[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 03-19-2004).]
IP: 67.250.189.118





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:03:19 am
Riven
Member posted 03-03-2004 02:52
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Boreas,
I only wish to express an opinion towards the Bock Saga and the Norse legends.
I sense that you may be confusing this with another lost civilization in regards to Atlantis.
Look NW of Ireland under the Ocean blue water on Bathymetric maps. I feel that the rectangular, village like, impressions,before Iceland, far below adhere to this lost civilization which could be responsible for the Neanderthal\Norse (Northern) cultural evolution relating to Odin and this Bock Saga's blood lines.

Truly.






Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:03:30 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 03-03-2004 12:08
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The Celtic Sea, also known as Land's End, was once above water in the distant past. Great Britain was connected by land to Europe. Let us not forget the English myths of a people who lived under the sea.
Imagine all of the continental shelves above water in the distant past. I.E. the time of Atlantis.
The North Sea, Baltic Sea, Barents Sea, Berring Sea, Gulf of Finland, etc. were dry. Australia was connected by land to Asia. Japan was connected by land to Korea and China.

The pole and equator were in different locations. The earth was a different place back then.

IP: 128.231.73.39



[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 11-09-2004).]



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:04:14 am
via mars
Member posted 03-04-2004 11:28
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
there is an area in the up-country of sri lanka called land's end or world's end - lots of strange myths associated with it. don't have any info handy on it though. when i get some more time ...
IP: 138.88.70.198



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:04:30 am
Old John
New Member posted 03-05-2004 18:27
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I hate to be an Atlantis party pooper and spoil all the Indiana Jones type adventures, but Atlantis isn’t anywhere we can see it. To help you find it, you need to draw a map.
Draw a circle with a line across the centre. Write “mind” in the top half and “body” in the bottom half. This is the map of “self” - you and I and everyone else. We can’t see the mind because it is metaphysical, or simply “information” for materialists. The body is obvious because it is physical and material. This map is part of who we are and appeared to us the moment we evolved a new brain and mind to become hominids.
By projection onto our universe, this map also represents Heaven and Earth, because Heaven (mind) is metaphysical and Earth (body) is physical. Mystics prefer to say that Heaven (the metaphysical) and Earth (the physical) are real and our minds and bodies simply follow the same pattern.

We can’t see up into the mind or Heaven because the line across the centre is a mirror (Alice’s mirror) that reflects back at us. Since before recorded history, the mirror has been represented by glass, mirrors, water, crystals, lakes, etc. This is why we use crystal balls to see into the other side, or why ghosts come from the other side through mirrors, or we cast bodies into lakes to send them on their way, or cast coins into water to please the God on the other side, or for that matter baptise ourselves in order to “pass through” to Heaven and be purified. Shamen bathe and do the same to pass into their Heaven during trances. All of these things come from the same source. The presence of the watery mirror between Heaven and Earth gives us all the classic triads such as Father (above), Son (on Earth) and shimmering Holy Ghost, all in one circular “thing”.

Men evolved to go out of the den of civilisation to hunt and fight for resources, resulting in men measuring success in hierarchies of competitive power with a single male at the top. In the Heaven/Earth map above, it puts a male monotheist God at the top of “Heaven”. In mysticism, this is called the male view or the male journey to enlightenment (or religious belief). It also explains the Sun God, rising to cross the heavens by day and sinking to visit the underworld at night in the daily cycle.

Women evolved to stay in the den of civilisation and do all the utilitarian and concerned things involved in turning the resources into nurture and reproduction, resulting in women working in flat circles of sorority and networking, where success is measured by popularity (and today’s secular celebrity “religion”). The female view or journey is very different to the male view. It produces a more harmonious pantheist, fertile view of “God in everything” as in the mysteries. It also inverts the male view, so that Earth is now on top and the “female Heaven” becomes Middle Earth, to use a popular phrase. They are separated from each other by a lake or sea. It is inverted because women have to do all the real practical work in the den while the men sit philosophising between battles. Don’t laugh boys – nothing changes – in Africa today, the men sit under the trees yakking while the women hoe the fields with babies on their backs, and in modern companies, the boardrooms are full of men discussing competition surrounded by women doing all the practical administration.

So what has this all to do with Atlantis? Well, when we evolved from animals and got a new mind, the mirror appeared. You could say that when God created humans and humans appeared on Earth, humans got up to all sorts of rumpy-pumpy sinning, so God sent a flood to “cut us off” from Heaven. It’s the same idea as baptism, but inverted because God was angry. It also explains why “dirty” Eve caused “perfect” Adam’s downfall (the story was written by men). Thanks to Noah, we survived…in rumpy-pumpy pairs, two by two. It’s a poetic way of saying that when we evolved our minds, nature (or God, if you prefer, Creationists), drew the mirror (water, the flood) across our minds and our existence.

That is how the fabulous Middle Earth became a land beneath the water, a female view (as in Lady in the Lake, and throwing the male sword into the lake in peace). It is a very, very, very ancient female type tale. When there weren’t many of us humans about, we didn’t have to be competitive, so early civilisations were predominantly female in flavour, and Heaven was middle Earth or Atlantis. Trees were worshipped because they draw their goodness from Middle Earth and bring it up to the daylight. Islands were mystical because they were peaks (top, God) of Atlantis sticking up out of the lake (mirror, flood). As we became more numerous, human groups grew larger and more competitive, so we switched to the male competitive style of living with male religions and God went up into Heaven. When He went up, Atlantis became a folk-tale and we have been searching for it in our myths ever since.

I hope it makes sense. Personally, I prefer to keep the Atlantis story. I understand all about flour, sugar and fat, but I prefer mine in the form of delicious cake. It is wonderful to be human and able to create such rich embroidery with the mind.

John Nash


------------------
John Nash
There's more at nashmatrix.com

IP: 217.43.97.8



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:06:36 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 03-09-2004 15:10
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've seen a satellite image of Sri Lanka, suggesting that a "land bridge" once existed to the mainland (India). An underwater city was discovered recently off the coast of India.
I've heard the "Meta Physical Atlantis Myth" story before. It is a valid point of view. But it does not explain the physical evidence, not to mention the archaeological evidence.
My favorite line is when Plato mentions the "counter continent". How would the Greeks know about the Americas?

Plato did not say in front of the Pillars of Hercules, but "beyond". This is rather vague, but in the context of the world ocean, the counter continent and the Mediterranean Sea but an inlet, this tells me Antarctica.

But there are many suggested locations of Atlantis. Lets keep looking!

John


IP: 128.231.88.4



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:07:10 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-10-2004 16:58
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi again,
Since I heard about the Bocksaga first time - in 1989 - I have spent a load of hours checking its "farfetched" statements and incredible outlines.
Of many relevant sources I looked on all the known, historical material from the northern countries, containing the oldest myths and legends known of "pre-christian" Europe. Due to its specifc relevance to the Finnish area I focused on the oldest litterate sources of Ireland, England and Iceland/Norway.

After three yars of minutious comparision I was still not able to find ONE undisputable recognition from all this material that really contradicted the essensials - or even some details - of the "hillarious" - or even "outrageous" Bocksaga.

Thus the old poem "RIGS TULA" - a Norse issue of the more famous "RIG VEDA" - clearly tells the story of how Rig, the procreating King, created the three levels of people, - namely the "Jarls" (Earls), the Kars (Peasants) and the Trels (laymen) -to constitute the different functions of a cultural society - of his people...

---

Later did I come across a Finnish tourist-map from the 1950-ties, where the county surrounding Helsinki was labeled "Uudenmaan Lääni", obviously referring to the old "Odens land" - and not ONLY as a genitive of "Uusima" ("New-land").
(This name is obviously a mere transalation of the Fenno-Swedish name of that same area, "Ny-land" also meaning "New-land".)

----

The conventional view to the "Swedish" language of the Finnish coastline - and the Helsinki area especially - is explaining that all the fenno-swedish names came with the Swedish "conquerors" - arriving around 1250-1300.

Though, - common sense alone will ask for the logic explanation to how a swedish "ruling-class" would spread into each and every nook and corner of the Finnish coastland - all the way from todays Carelia to the top of the Botnic Bay. Especially since the fenno-swedish language seems to be covering all the significant identities existing in this vast landscape -with hundreds of thousands of names - identifying all theese places around the yards, farms, villages, cities, bays, oceans, lakes, rivers, beaches, flatlands, woodlands, hills, hilltops and mountains. As well as all the other objects and identities one may find in theese areas.

---

Using conventional OPINIONS - such as the well-known theory of the "Mideval Swedish expantion" into Finland - to prove the origin of the Fenno-Swedish language and culture - is a very risky endavour. That is if you are really looking for the truth of the matter. If one like to be CRITICAL - not to say "sceptic" - to this Saga-material one need to exercise the exact same critical review on the conventional information.

There is - to put it siple - still NO scientific proof established that really can tell if the coastal Finns where speaking Fenno-Swedish before 1250, or not. It is not even clear from where this population of southern Finland arrived - when the area around Helsinki got populated by new settlers in the 13th century.

It is likewise a major historical puzzle WHY this very core area of Finland was not populated (seemingly not at all) in the period between 1050 and 1250...

---

To ridicule and gag about a new (and thus fragile) concept is very easy. It doesnt even take courage, yet alone intelligence. And still it may be very tempting - especially if one is "convinced" of some former opinion in one or many of theese matters.

Thus a highly stigmatized topic may still be hard to present or discuss. Such as the male fallos and its very essence; the spermea. Even among modern, well-educated and agnostic - or even professional scientists. Not even hundreds of rock-carvings and paintings are "understood". Although they -loud and clear - are telling that our ancestors, all over the world, kept the fallic exponence in the open. Obviously without "shame" or "disregard", but with a high degree of regard and proudness.

Still WE tend to view that as "primitive" or even "wrong". Thus when the Bocksaga refers to theese historical time, telling in length about this old "fertility-culture" - the re-action is close at hand. Especially since the saga goes straigth to the core of the most heavy condemnation of the former "headon culture", that was exercised by the religous or fundamental gouvernments all through the mideval age. Today we may just wonder about why, how and what started this condemnation of our natural organs, our geneticals, our recreative force and the essence of it all; being the "seed-of-life", namly the sperm, itself.

According to the Bocksaga values such as health, vitality, vigour, beauty and brigthness was regarded, cheerished and stimulated/developed during pagan time. One way of doing this was to keep our most highly developed cells, - the spermia - in a recirculative process within the body. By simply drinking the "life-water", also called "wisdom water". Arousing from the stones it may also explain the mythical "white stone of wisdom" - without the need of mysterious abstractions.

We may still find elements of this very priciple actually existing - at the base of old "headon" traditions, such as the Yogic, Tantric and Taoistic schools of wisdom. But after a millenia of catholic regime this knowledge was completly erradicated from the we4stern hemisphere. Even today do we find this topic difficult, embarassing or prejudiced. And not even the moist learned historians are able to give a founded and logic explaination to the mentioned rock-carvings and paintings - showing a number of aroused maledoms dancing around poles or fires.

Not to wonder that even young intelectuals still have a difficult time accepting the specifications of the Bocksaga; telling that not only did all men usually keep and cheerish their sperm as the manifesto of their inherited genuinity, vitality and wisdom. Not only did they drink their sperm to recirculate and reinforce this qualities, - but at occasions they even shared their individual qulities by sharing their sperm.

Today we may "share" a bottle - of beer, wine or liquor. But some of us have to be unconsciously drunk to even accept the possibility that two brothers or best friends - during the festival high-light of the pagan culture - could share a "natural high" - exchanging their "wisdom-water". It MAY seem strange, or even very strange, to us. But so does also our sexual taboos - and their resulting promiscuity, side-by-side with a quite funny "drug- and alchohol-culture".

It is hardly any evidence against the Bocksaga when it tells about theese "cultural traditions" of the pre-religious societies of ancient Eurasia.

Due to OUR hang-ups may the genuinity, the logic and the completeness of the Bocksaga be difficult to comprehend - not to say accept. At first. But keeping an open mind -at a second or even third reading - it may dawn on one that this saga-story is something different than a exiting myth, and exotic legend or a fabolous story. It may be the genuine result of an authentic, oral tradition - comprehended, kept and contributed by the most cultually councious and conservative family of the entire Finnish-speaking area.

---



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:07:30 am
As I have explained already; there have been concrete, hands-on information given by this Saga - during the years of 1984-87 -that sounded completly "unbelievable" - or even "impossible". Though; later discoveries - within geology, archaeology, biology and genetics - have actually proven theese "incredible" statements to be rigth. And then we may include late discoveries that have caugth the entire scientific community by surprise...

---

Now I am waiting for the geneticians answer to the puzzle of Darwins "missing link" - to explain how the monkey evoluted to become man. Before further research gets closer to an answer it may really be a stupid mistake to rule out the statement of the Bocksaga - claiming that the first human beeings - once upon the time - evolved as a cross-breed between a monkey and a nanny-goat.

What if some genetic research-team found this combination to be "possible", not to say "likely". Would we bother to change our minds then? Or would we still insist that the idea is "just to stupid to be true" ?! Who and what is really stupid - one may just wonder...


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 03-10-2004).]

IP: 195.159.185.78



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:07:47 am
Faravid
New Member posted 03-11-2004 14:20
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Hi Boreas,
I would like to just comment to some things you have mentioned. I agree with you that some of the commonly thought "Swedish" names on the Finnish coast are older than the invasions by the Christian Swedes or Danes. For example the paganic name Odensö is good example, but there are many more. On the western coast (a little north-west of the city Turku) we can also find even today "Aasaland" (Aasamaa). Could they be names given by the pagan Vikings? Perhaps, as (not only in the Sweden but also) in the Finland exists old tales which even name the actual Viking settlers on the Finnish coast. We of course must not think that this denys the option that some Finns already spoke the Swedish or "Root" language. For example some Nordic tales claim that some of the Viking dynasties originated from the Finland. In addition the Finland's Swedish is not pronounced like Swedish, but instead similarly like in the Gotland. This was surprise to me, as I didn't believe it until I saw one document about people of the Gotland. Now it's interesting as the historians tell us that the Swedish speaking population arrived from the Sweden, not from the Gotland. (Could there be a connection between the Go(a)tland and the many "bock" named place names at the southern coast of Finland?).
About the Rig. As you are probably aware it's commonly believed that the Rig is actually the same mythological person as the Heimdaller (a Viking god taking part in the Ragnarök). Again quoting the before mentioned Kristfrid Ganander it's interesting to note what he tells us about the Heimdaller:

"Heimdaller, priest of wisdom in Finland at the manor house of the Island [Saari]."

(Kristfrid sees here connection between the word "Saari" and the names "Czaar", "Caesar", "Aesar" etc.)

I personally haven't heard from anywhere else that the Viking god Heimdaller would have been actually a real living person in Finland. But it's not at all surprising to me hear so because relatively lately I have found many bits of information (from a very different sources) telling about connections between mythological Viking gods and the ancient Finnish royals. This all has not - yet - been approved by any Finnish historians as they still, for some odd reason, 'officially' consider Finns as some kind of unorganized barbarians surrounded by civilized Vikings and Russians...

IP: 195.165.1.8



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:07:56 am
via mars
Member posted 03-11-2004 16:22
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
and to the east of gotland we have goteberg which i believe, is south of gotaland. gotaland is northeast of copenhagen. so what's up with all the gotas (goats)?
sounds suspiciously like the egyptian minotaurs and other weird creatures ... maybe those creatures existed afterall?
tarkin - elephants that swim, cobras, tigers, it's all their in ceylon. must mean that land bridge theory is correct?
one of earth's great accomplished humans, arthur c. clarke, found paradise and more when he lived out his last days there ...
IP: 151.200.34.244



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:08:10 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 03-12-2004 09:31
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I saw a National Geographic special about the "swimming elephants". I would not have believed it until I saw it. Amazing!
Also, I recall reading on the internet that an ancient Indian myth said there was a road, city, etc. Those myths say a lot about other topics too. Especially the flying machines.
I love Arthur C Clarks's work!

IP: 128.231.88.4



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:08:22 am
Sadie
Member posted 03-14-2004 14:12
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A "lost continent" smack dab in the center of the known world? No more far-fetched than a lost continent in the Black Sea, the Mediterainian or north Africa, I s'pose.
Has anyone (in this forum) ever read the sanskrit vedas and upanishads?
The Chinese "discovered" Atl Antis more than ten thousand years ago - were driven off by the Atl Antian Air Force and forbidden to sail in that direction EVER again!






Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:08:44 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-15-2004 10:02
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Thanks for inspiring tips and informative comments!
Via Mars;
I am sorry to admit I do not know the works of Lloyd Pye. Any web-adress?!
Riven/Via;
The geological and geophysical history of our planet is still far from complete. One major reason for the difficulty of modern geology is the eradications and "cataclysmical" changes created just before, under and at the very end of Ice-time, when enormous glaciers started moving - to reach the oceans...

Consequently it is difficult to state exact lines of age, tectonical history and movements of/under or beside the different
areas that we may wish to investigate. One such example is the essential question about ice-time; When did it start? How? And how far did the ice-caps reach - on it maximum size?
Another question still not solved is this;
How could the warm gulf-stream reach the Baltic area already 500.000 years ago - if the global ice-cap covered all of Norway-N orth Sea and Scotland? Via the English Channel? Yes, - but also this area was different at this time - since Holland and England where connected. But - inside of Holland there where yet another lowland - that used to be UNDER water. So it may very well be that the way of the Gulf-stream, pressing northwards from Biscaya, had a different route than today - and that the "English chanel" use to further east.
But - since the hot mexican water indeed have reachede Denmark, Sweden and the Baltics - DURING the entire period of the ice-time (acording to coral-reeves found in Denmark and Gotland).

Thus a reference to some old Geologists opinion - that the English Channel once where completly closed - and the Baltic Ocean a closed sweetwater Sea - has changed ultimatly with the dsicoveries of the 1990`s - as refered earlier (see above).

So it is obvious that the surface of our planet - with the thickness like the skin over one apple - have the ability to adjust, much like the baloon. When it gets pressured at one point it adjusts by swelling somewhere else. So when two enormous ice-caps appeared on the both northern and the southern polar areas, the impact on the earths surface have been quite dramatic. And there is still much to investigate and research to clarify these matters.

Consequently we have to keep a very balanced view on statements of older research and science. Especially if we refere to "public knowledge" - and not to specific repports; we should keep in mind that conventional books and sources regulary have to change and correct their basic opinions and "facts" evry 20th years...

Tarkin;
Focused on Nordic history and Norse Mythology I have not more than briefly heard about the works of Ignatius Donally; on Atlantis, the origin of the phonetic alphabet, etc.

It was indeed impressing how deep an understanding this man have to the core-elements of these questions. A comparision to the mentioned Bocksaga is simply a great inspiration and eye-opener. Thanks for the tip! The following site contains it all; www.sacred-texts.com/atl/ataw/index.htm

Acid;
You may need to have a critical look on Your etymythological sources of understanding. To be able to deal with the questions of linguistical origins and root-associations You may need a more exstensive curriculum than the avarage academian. On what basis are Your statements resting; such as the one telling that the saga-material contains HUGE mistakes in interpretating the fenno-swedish language, as well as its history?
May it be that the conventional understanding are leading You to believe that IT is rigth and this "alternative stuff" MUST be wrong?!

For instance: Take a very simple and well known fenno-swedish word, say: "JUL". What`s its general meaning? What may be its root/stem? How did it occur to bear those meaning(s)?

Sadie;
I think the Pi-King-people had a solid branch rigth up there in the Himalayas during some millenias of the ice-time. Thus they adjusted quite much to the cold and windy climate of the higher and more northern side of the mountains. Today we know them as monguls/mongolian and tibetan.

We also know that the monguls found a paveway heading straigth north through the enormous ice-cap that used to cover all of northern Russia. This paveway was created by the Ural mountains - and the Himalayans could find their way to the arctic ocean. This may have happened some 8-10.000 years ago. About 6000 years ago this new branch of monguls was established by the arctic ocean - from where they spread east and west, creating TWELVE different tribes around the North pole, as we still recognize as inuits, eskimos, samis, etc.
But it may be - that the very first emigrants to the Kara Ocean and The White Sea area was denied permanent setling by the Altlantis-popolation - that occupied this area already 40.000 years (or more) ago.

But it sure is correct that the Piking-Monguls found and connected with the Caucasians trapped in the Arctic/Baltic
area before any other tropical where able to visit the high north...

---

I`ll get back to Kaukamoinen and some other highly interesting apsects - a.s.a.p. Have a nice day or evening!






Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:09:00 am
IP: 195.159.182.228

via mars
Member posted 03-15-2004 11:17
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i have a sneaky feeling that the next great repository of ancient "things" will be unearthed deep in the jungles of the old tea colony - ceylon.
unless we get to mars first!
IP: 141.156.132.190





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:09:19 am
Sadie
Member posted 03-15-2004 13:35
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Ah, yes, the one-way land bridge! Quite interesting that the oldest known human-built habitat is at the tip of Tierra del Fuego; AND that the present day inhabitants of the region share DNA codex with only one people - who happen to be from Mongolia...
I KNEW I was gonna dig this forum!
love&light2all,S

IP: 171.75.22.124


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:09:35 am
via mars
Member posted 03-15-2004 13:51
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boreas - if you're so inclined:
lloydpie.com
for what it's worth ...
hi sarah - you sure have some ecclectic interests. welcome to our humble adobe!

IP: 141.156.132.190



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:09:59 am
via mars
Member posted 03-15-2004 18:02
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
but you're not sarah are you? anyway, interesting points you have made here and there.
on to other things ... our backyard sure has had some wild things going on in mid-ancient times. heck, the jury's still out on dinos, indians, and other "non-european" viewpoints pertaining to north america. i wonder what the australian aborigines have to say about this part of the map. (it has been a flat world until recently)
see, that's the thing that has me perpetually wondering ... white creatures from the north (us), and these fellows from across the orb. they know a lot of ****. ancient stuff - and they're way cool about nature. stars? heck, they know a lot about them too. but, without a telescope. go figure.
anyway, just a few things to ponder.

IP: 138.88.28.233

Boreas
Member posted 03-15-2004 19:17
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Sadie;
Do you have some more info (reference) to the habitat of Tierra del Fuego?
The old Norse sailors used to call it "Ildlandet" (The Land of Fire)- as it may still be called in Scandinavia.
Do You say that the indigenius Chileans are proven to be of Tibetan/Chineese origin?!
Please elaborate!


IP: 195.159.181.140

tarkin22180
Member posted 03-16-2004 09:08
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I'm speculating, but it is possible that when the Northern Icecap was at the Hudson Bay location (circa 12,000 years ago), the artic ocean was probably the source of the "warm stream" of water mentioned in the Bock Saga. There would be no Bering Strait (sea levels a lot lower), making the artic ocean a closed body of water. Like the Gulf of Mexico, this would make it quite warm. And there is a deep path between Greenland and Spitzbergen for the current to flow.
LOL, it is called the Boreas Plain according the map I looked at.

Though how it could get the Gulf of Finland I do not know. The stream would warm the coast of Norway; therefore, all of Scandinavia would be warmed.

Relative to the Hudson Bay pole, Finland would go from 60 latitude to 40 latitude. This is where Spain and Greece are today, quite mild. The mountains of Norway would offer a barrier to the cold north winds. Another plus for a mild Finland climate.

Gee, sounds a bit like Plato's description of Atlantis eh? Ah, but the Trans-Antarctic mountains would do the same! My support of Atlantis in Antarctica is viable!

John


IP: 128.231.88.4




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:10:25 am
Sadie
Member posted 03-16-2004 14:33
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If what we're looking for is - i.e. 'was' - an empire that is at least hinted at and more often spoken openly of and even called by name by virtually every culture on the planet, we ought to be finding evidence of it everywhere; and we are!
Sure, there are gonna be tiny minded persons with their preconceptions, prejudices and pet theories who will always refuse to see the trees for the forest, but once inna while somebody's gonna stop, stoop and take a whif of the flower(s) of reality.
Patagonians descended from Mongols? Maybe. Maybe the other way around, though. Think differently, 'cause thinking the same olde way is only gonna lead you to the same olde conclussions.

Here are some links from my bookmarks that ought to have the DNA info re. Patagonia: http://www.tracegenetics.com/index.html http://www.comic.sbg.ac.at/staff/jan/ancient/logo.htm http://users.mstar2.net/spencersa/evolutus/index.html

(&@many more to list here! happy hunting!)

A continent in the middle of THE ocean...

Oceanographers have proven that there is only ONE ocean on our planet - that the GulfStream gyre that flows from the meteor crater we call the Gulf of Mexico up the east coast of Vespucciland, across the North Sea, then down the west coast of Europia, continues to traverses the Pacific and Indian oceans before heading back up the west coast of Africa.

A continent in the middle of the Atl Antic ocean would practically connect south Vespucci with Africa - but a continent in the middle of THE ocean would BE south Amerika...

n'est ce pas?


IP: 171.75.16.61





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:10:41 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-16-2004 18:32
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There was only one page o be found; the publication "Ancient Biomolecules", nr. 1, page 43-54.
Well, this site is "brougth to us" by the old and distinguished university of Oxford.
And to gain acess You need to be a "MEMBER" of course. Paying, seemingly.
Any chance You could give us an accurate adress of an open source, Sadie?!
Sure would apreciate it...

Best regards,

IP: 195.159.183.204





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:10:56 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-16-2004 19:50
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HI Faravid,
I think you are pretty close to a lot of essential questions to ask - if we are to figure out the real and true relevance of the ancient Eur-asian traditions, legends and myhologies.
In the midle of the old, arctic world we still find Finland in the geographical, etnological and linguistical centre. It may even seem logic that Finland - both historically as today - have defined and connected the "far east" with "the way west". Still we may find the famous "Blueroad" ("Sininen Intje") crossing Fenno-Scandia, from Helsinki to westcoast Norway...
It may be as logic that this very Finish "sub-continent" have been the very centre of the old, original arctic population. And there is no doubt that both Anglo-Saxon, Frankish, Celtic, Roman, Greek, Arabic AND Norse legends are all mentioning, if not pointing to the northernmost lands, as a place of cultural significance.
Thus it is very funny how Finnish historians still insist that their own ancestors "actually" where pretty savage and uncivilized, with no clue about the culture of their imediate surroundings. Not long ago the high-school graduate had to know that "Finland, during the Viking-time was a "dark corner of Scandinavia"", where; "The population had only simple, occasional setlements and survived by moving after their main prey-animals..."
I could undestand if the Swedes - always competing their eastern neighbours - in a sudden attack of cheuvinism could have created such a stigmatized picture of the ancient Finn. Unfortunately - it is more serious than that.

This stigmata once originated by a hostile, Catholic conqueror, arriving between 1050 and 1250, as the regin of Finland finally gave up to Rome, as the last "headon" (read; "free" or "independent") kingdom in all of Eurasia. From that time on both the Norse and the Finnish cultures - and their history - got heavily stigmatized, distorted and destructed, - to be exchanged with black Roman collars, latin monoteism and a harshly disiplining, emperial rule introducing common, annual tax...

Today - soon 500 years after the rennesaince and the reformation - one could expect that also Finnish Historians had discovered the rich legacy of Finish archaeology to imply a new and different view on these basic views on their very own roots.

But - unlike other Nordic countries - it doesnt seem that the Finish historians are willing to make the effort and do the (intelectual) work neccesary to review the old, stigamtic pictures of themselves, i.e. their own history.
I do understand that it may be uncomfortable to change ones mind. I may even understand that it may be discomforting to change anything at all. But - I have also experienced the end result of an intelectual and communicative stand-still. We may call that shere idiosyncracy, i.e. stupidity.

So - Farvid, until Finnsih academia cares to investigate this saga-material or the archaeological evidences, - we may just wonder; If "stupidty" is a sign of lazyness or fear, what may the sisu-expression "idiotic stupidity" imply?
And, by the way, which of theese to conditions would be the most Finnish...?

Best regards!


IP: 195.159.184.246





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:11:17 am
dj@starcomone.com
New Member posted 03-16-2004 20:38
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Brig
I just want to let you know that an underwater survey will begin in the summer of the coast of Cyprus using a multi beam ROV surveyin 400 sq miles of the location.
Its a good second step.

Lets see what lays there before judgement is made.

cheers

dj

IP: 203.134.130.1





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:11:29 am
Sadie
Member posted 03-16-2004 23:24
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
... Seems to me as though the Mongolian-Patagonian DNA link was made in the late 80's and featured in both Nat'l Geo and Omni mags, among others (JAMA comes to mind) - I'll dig deeper into my own archives & get back.
Meanwhile, your mention of celts and the fertile crescent (seemingly incongruous but uncannilly linked!) promts me to ask how&why both cultures point across the Atl Antic ocean to the 'land in the west' as being "where the gods came from?"
The children of the moon (Tuatha Da Dannon) were said by the celts to have come from across the ocean BY AIR, to have worn the finely tanned hides of deer and other beasts, to have worn feathers in their hair and to have been able to change into animals at will... They also taugtht the celts the sacred symbol of the quartering of the uniVerse into active and passive principles - a cross in a circle (this 'celtic cross' must not be confused in any way with the medicine wheel of the Hopi, Zuni or Navajo, no, no!)

Gilgamesh the king also had to cross the ocean beyond Gibralter to aquire the leaves of the burning bush / tree of life with which to restore the life of Inkidu.

Go figure!

IP: 171.75.22.170





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:11:46 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-17-2004 19:25
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hi Sadie,
I think You may be pointing towards England. As you may know the southern parts of these isles where (as the Baltic isles) kept ice-free, all through the eons of time when the "global" ice-cap dwelt on the rest of the northern hemisphere.
When the Baltic isolation where broken, 10.000 years ago, England became a key-area for the emigrating "caucasians", - as they searched to the south and the milder climate. Thats why the meso- and neo-littic cultures in England may show so clear and impressive signs corelated to the culture of Atlantis.
We also know that agriculture came very, very early to the Brittish isles, where seeds of 8.000 years old domestic plants have been found. (A few years ago they found a 8000 year old, cealed jar of burnt clay containing seeds of hemp. The professional asessment was that the plant had been used as a drug "for ancient religious exercises". It may seem that todays Brittish historians of today have completly forgotten that hemp used to be "the arctic bamboo", as it served as a raw-material for "almost anything", such as isolation and roofing, sails, ropes, clothes and covers, brushes and household-tools, oil and food. And - as we all know, but only some accept - hemp has always been smoked also, - for rest and relaxation.

One may wonder what "religion" really have to do with a 8000 year old archaeological site. And who can tell if theese people where "religious" - long beofe anyone have mentioned the word "religare"...? They may have been completly convinced agnostics for all we know!

Most likely did the old englishman have a solid philosophical grounding, based on a historical understanding of themselves and their inherited culture. Anyhow, these early artic culture have been very close to a highly observant, most realistic and methodic study of nature and its cycles - merely to survive...! That implies that the arctic culture - with a most impressive neolittic and bronze-age-prdoucts - where definitly occupied by the natural sciences, as we see the enormous megalittic temples, halls and astronomical observatories. Not to mention the development of advanced metallurgy, such as the creation of bronze, "to shine as gold".

---

Today we know that the Mediterranean cultures, such as the Egyptian and the Phoenician, where regulary sailing all the way to England for puposes of trade and cultural interchange. May the Sumerians and the Assyrians have done the same?!

The route to England, and then further north, through the North Sea and the Baltic Sea are also described in the Homeric litterature, - according to Dr. Felice Vinci and others. Did you check on his homepage, Sadie? (The link "Homer in The Baltic" is found on the homepage of www.bocksaga.de

UNfortunately I do not know the Celtic material you refer to. But I have heard and read some similar stories to the vessels you describe.
According to the late Dr. Thor Heyerdahl stories about "Vessels of Feathers Flying", "Arriving from the East - over the Ocean" was found in all the myths and legends that Senòr Kon-Tiki found and got to investigate "among the 500 different tribes still existing in the Americas."

Theese myths even tell about white, bearded men, etc. and refering to "The Teacher"/"The Migthy"/"The Good (God) One"/"The True White Brother"/etc. Heyerdahl found the similarity to the well-known Viking-ships to be obvious, since they look like "featherd bodies - FLYING in the Wind (Air) - as they aproach from the horizon..."

I think the old arcticals new much more about nature and the world than we normally credit our anchestors. And I think they made a major effort to link all parts of the world back to ONE common knowledge of our globe, our nature, our own origin - as well as the basic eras of our development ("history") as human beings. Based on real ("scientific") knowledge and a wide understanding of THEIR past and present.

Along the line - some 2.500-3.000 years ago we can detect the first abruption of violence and warfare. Then we see the development of warlords using their force to conquer capital cities, killing the kings (such as the JuPiters, Zeus` and later the Pharao-lines) to become rulers - or "tyrant-kings" themselves. Thus we got nationally organised "armies" - to conquer, rob, rule and enslave any accesible neighbour.

Thus we see that the existence of the old, legal kinglines - and their nobilities - got estinguished - in more and more countries. Soon it was even prohibited to keep the memory, not to mention the history of the old culture and its forebearers. Finally we got the horrors of a millenia, namely the cultural desert-land called "The Midle Age" - where "a new time" and "the heavenly kingdom" was introduced and ministered with the most intricate disipline.

At the end of the day all memories of the old, classical world was as good as lost - and all stories, books and traditions that told about "pagan time" was completly and entirely eradicated. So was also all memories and stories connected to the old culture, that reflected out common history and our legitimate, constitutional leaders.

Thanks to an ongoing endavour of individual, social and political unrest there is hardly any clear, lityterate source left explaining the realities of our ancient culture. Not before an incredible Family-saga appears - from the deep forests of Finland, litterally at the fringe of "civilisation", as we consider it - in OUR day and time.

Since this new material exists we have to take it into consideration. Although this story may seem more than fantastic it has proven rigth on a number of tests. Moreover it has risen statemnets hereto unknown to science, that have actually proven to be rigth. To everybodies surprise...

Today the Finnish saga-material have proven its scientific basis - beyond doubt. The pictures, figures and repports given on the mentioned web-site are not animated, they`re excavated! Accordingly we have to review our history as our known mythologies in this new ligth. Just as the "Celtic" cross - the encircled sun - may be a uni-verse-all symbol, brought straigth out of Atlantis/AltLandIs/AtlAntis - to all four corners of the world...




Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:12:04 am
via mars
Member posted 03-18-2004 06:00
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
arctic bamboo - that's a new one on me. gotta send that one to HT editors!
IP: 141.156.194.26


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:12:52 am
Andre
Member posted 03-19-2004 12:53
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So Atlantis was Finland eh.
I guess there are many myths of Atlantis just about every nation may have one. Here is the Dutch version, the Oera Linda Bok
A priceless story.
Happy speculating.

IP: 217.229.202.221



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:13:16 am
indy
New Member posted 03-19-2004 06:25
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Some years ago I had the chance to see this mountain in Finland that we are talking about.
Actually I was an Egypt fan but after I gave it a close look I had to admit: Yes, here is something that is very very worth exploration.
I also see the difficulties that come from the long search of Atlantis in so many parts of the world where I was always wondering why the north was so explicitly excluded from the arising speculations of the searchers. (Too cold, too far away, too difficult languages,too much nature, too strange ???)By this fact - the exclusion of the north of Europe - it came under my suspicion as the true source.
Furthermore Atlantis might not only be a place but a period in time that really existed everywhere on the planet and also for sure has left kind of remains and artefacts. But actually we want to know where the centre was.
Grace to you, ladies and gentlemen we come closer to our goal: a point of reference and identification. Thank you.
How far can we honestly go back and how are we to explore the sources? What has to happen to "convince" the authorities to look at their very early ancestors? And may be just dig some smaller or bigger holes into the ground??

So I am very grateful for this interesting and fair - nearly academic- discussion. Thank you very much.
And please go on, it is a real pleasure and a relilef in the same time to read your postings.

Cheers from Germany

IP: 213.73.116.172





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:13:31 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 03-19-2004 15:37
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Regarding:
Meanwhile, your mention of Celts and the fertile crescent (seemingly incongruous but uncannily linked!) prompts me to ask how&why both cultures point across the Atl Antic Ocean to the 'land in the west' as being "where the gods came from?"


Interesting. From the Hudson Bay Pole's perspective, West would be "our south" as far as the Celts and Fertile Crescent are concerned. South would remain south from the Maya and Inca's perspective. The myths of the "white men" arriving from the south and the gods coming from the west are in agreement.

This all points to Antarctica!

John

P.S. According to the archaeological record, the Maya have toy "airplanes" as do the Egyptians. Not such a far-fetched idea after all.


IP: 128.231.88.4





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:13:50 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-19-2004 16:19
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andre,
Agreed. The Oera Linda Boek is indeed a genuine, unique and preiceless story. As you may have read above I have already mentioned it - as it was the basis of Dr. Robert Scruttons book "The Other Atlantis", published 1972.
As the Atlantis-myth have been in the air - under changing winds - for centuries, there are a number of "theories" on where it was located. During the last decades we have seen a growing number of archaological discoveries, - such as large structures both under water and under ground. Many of these bear witness of age old cultures, - some far more sophisticated and "industrious" than the common belief have been about our ancient ancestors on this planet.
Indy/Rock
It is quite obvious that "higher civilisations" have existed all over the planet, - during ice-time as well as after.
When we get to study the new evidences we may recognize that our Ancient Antiquety (i.e. "pre-historic time") really have been a quite flourishing period of human life on earth. Furthermore we have reason to suspect that all the different cultures once where connected.

Moreover;
It is pretty obvious that mankind started with both a man and a woman present - creating what we may call the "first family". Thus we may - also - use sheer logic to reason about this topic.

So it all started with this first family. Being able to reproduce they obviously did so, and they must have had a good number of childred too, in order to make sure that this ability to reproduce was kept in shape, rigth? But how could the children of this first couple go on, getting more children? Well obviously by copulating with each other - since no body else would be avaliable! Consequently it took many generations before one could have "marriages" between more distant relatives, as is the "obvious" standard in our day and age.

As mankind suceessfully grew and reached all corners of the world, it had to be as different "branches" from this first family, rigth? And, although we seem to no little or nothing about the culture of this first, world-wide population, they obviously had one. "Culture" that is.

They may even have been more "civilized" than we are. It is quite obvious that mankind NEVER had succeded if we where born envious, sinister, agressive and cynical towards our fellow beings. Whish means that the biblical genesis of Kain and Abel is an evident misunderstanding (or falsification) of our inherital nature as beings. Any higher specie with that inborn tendency would simply self-destruct, before it reached anywhere. An WE, the humans, obviously reached far and wide outside the garden of Edon.

That may very well point to the realm that many traditions figured out long ago, defining our present era as a "time of trancendence". Only during the very latest millenias of our history have mankind behaved so gravely in contradiction to its own nature and existencial interests.

All traditions also speak of their respective Kings and Queens, as their central and stabilizing "first family". In most mythologies these royal lines are explained to be straigth descendants from the "GodS" - i.e. the mentioned "prime-family". Thus, through a straigth, unbroken line the Royal Family carries the genetical inheritance that represents the population and their political, cultural and existential legacy . Such we may see the historical origin and function of all known mythologis frgom our ancient civilisations.

These ancient king-lines, being the fundamental legacy of the all old cultures got under hard and continous attack, as violence and war where waged - and various warlords grew strong enough to remove or estuinguish entire family-lines, to take their assesories and position.
So today almost all the old, legitimate inheritorial lines are gone. Though we still have some King-lines left on the earth. But today they are very few, and mostly out of work...

---



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:14:13 am
By the appearance of the global ice-time the different branches of the "prime family" got separated due to the appearance of ice-time. Now each region got a structure by themselves, based on the straigth descendants from the prime "Allfather Family". This created the different Kings and Kingdoms around the globe, that - by time and time again - developed their own charachteristics, as to etnicity, language and culture.

Today we may still see the results of that process, as the different kingdoms still exist as populations, to be defined from their common etnicity, area, language. But, we may also recognize our COMMON origin, both in our nature and our culture. The more we study ancient stories, sagas, myths and legends the more clear it becomes that also all mythologies realy are related.

Thus we may find The Widsom of The Ages inherrent in all the old cultures, - from the Inuits to the Aborgines. All the larger stories happen to have the same structure, dealing with "the beginning" and the following processes of "evolution" in "space" and "time", - even in paralell types of chronology. Not to mentioned the coherence of pictograms AND advanced writing-systems. But also the "structural stories" signifies a common basis of culture. And; they all reflect the "Royal principle" as the basis of their social and political culture.

Slowly, slowly we may understand that once we had a world-wide co-existence between populations that consciously shared a common origin, with a common set of structures, values and traditions. So we should not be to surprised really, when modern archaology now are digging up ancient PY-RA-MID`s all around the equatorial world. It is just proving what mythologers have suspected for quite ome time. The world once WAS one. For a long time, - before it got diversed. By ice-time. Today also known as "Altlantis-time".

That period ended 10.000 years ago, as the caucasians escaped their small refugee-area of the Baltic Ocean. To find back to the tropical populations existing in the south. Which they did about 9.200-9.500 years ago. Then we find arctical people, such as The Kennewick Man - and arctical produce, such as domestic plants and animals - spreading to all corners of the world.

Their intent was to re-establish a global unity, somewhat like it existed before ice-time. Thus these articals managed to reach and connect to the populations of the different continents - to establish a communication that could start to inform and align the different cultures of the wide tropical world. Bringing the diffrent kinds of useful items and knowledge - as well as "news" from "other worlds" these altlanteans became both famous and admired.

---



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:14:27 am
With the Greek-Roman takeover of Eurasia we got a dramatic shift in this process. Over lem of the last milennium the old legacy have been seriously changed and altered. With the introduction of "The New Time" did the Roman powers form the Emperial Church, some 16-1700 years ago. In the centuries to come the clerical Emperor sensored, banned and destroyed all memories of the old cultures. Not only did they destroy or kill the rigthful descendants of the Atlanten north, such as all the Royal and Noble lines of northern Europe. They also banned all stories, plays, rites, books and other knowledge that remindend, upheld or maintained the old, "atlantean" culture. Such as the annual celebrations following winter and summer solistice. Not to forget the chess-game. In 1244 the bishop of Paris alone detected, collected and burned more than 30.000 chess-sets in Paris alone, starting a ban that did not become lifted before the reformation 1534 reintroduced "free thougth" in Europe.

So whats the secret of the Chess-board?!

Simply that it reflects the very basic of the old, traditional and legitimate political system that had existed sine "time origin"!

So the chessboard was originally created as a teaching-device, to get a clear and good insigth into the structure and function of the old, pyramidal society - created already in the beginning of the Altantis-period.

Now, - today everybody can see and understand that the chessboard reflects the hierarchial, but vibrant strucure of the old Kingdoms. But, even if we again may find the chessboard freely used all over the world - there are hardly anyone understanding its original significance.

Although we start to get a good clue on our ancestoral past, we still - rigth here and now - have some tricky problems with our thougth-procsses within this subject.
The complete dis-continuum created during the dark midleage, - still affects us like an "information-lag" as we try to sort out and adjust to the real and relevant information given by an objective modern science.

Not any of us have really overcome this jet-lag, to become as clear, focused AND open-minded as it is required by the term "objective".


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 03-19-2004).]

IP: 195.159.182.137



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:14:43 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-19-2004 16:19
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andre,
Agreed. The Oera Linda Boek is indeed a genuine, unique and preiceless story. As you may have read above I have already mentioned it - as it was the basis of Dr. Robert Scruttons book "The Other Atlantis", published 1972.
As the Atlantis-myth have been in the air - under changing winds - for centuries, there are a number of "theories" on where it was located. During the last decades we have seen a growing number of archaological discoveries, - such as large structures both under water and under ground. Many of these bear witness of age old cultures, - some far more sophisticated and "industrious" than the common belief have been about our ancient ancestors on this planet.
Indy/Rock
It is quite obvious that "higher civilisations" have existed all over the planet, - during ice-time as well as after.
When we get to study the new evidences we may recognize that our Ancient Antiquety (i.e. "pre-historic time") really have been a quite flourishing period of human life on earth. Furthermore we have reason to suspect that all the different cultures once where connected.

Moreover;
It is pretty obvious that mankind started with both a man and a woman present - creating what we may call the "first family". Thus we may - also - use sheer logic to reason about this topic.

So it all started with this first family. Being able to reproduce they obviously did so, and they must have had a good number of childred too, in order to make sure that this ability to reproduce was kept in shape, rigth? But how could the children of this first couple go on, getting more children? Well obviously by copulating with each other - since no body else would be avaliable! Consequently it took many generations before one could have "marriages" between more distant relatives, as is the "obvious" standard in our day and age.

As mankind suceessfully grew and reached all corners of the world, it had to be as different "branches" from this first family, rigth? And, although we seem to no little or nothing about the culture of this first, world-wide population, they obviously had one. "Culture" that is.

They may even have been more "civilized" than we are. It is quite obvious that mankind NEVER had succeded if we where born envious, sinister, agressive and cynical towards our fellow beings. Whish means that the biblical genesis of Kain and Abel is an evident misunderstanding (or falsification) of our inherital nature as beings. Any higher specie with that inborn tendency would simply self-destruct, before it reached anywhere. An WE, the humans, obviously reached far and wide outside the garden of Edon.

That may very well point to the realm that many traditions figured out long ago, defining our present era as a "time of trancendence". Only during the very latest millenias of our history have mankind behaved so gravely in contradiction to its own nature and existencial interests.

All traditions also speak of their respective Kings and Queens, as their central and stabilizing "first family". In most mythologies these royal lines are explained to be straigth descendants from the "GodS" - i.e. the mentioned "prime-family". Thus, through a straigth, unbroken line the Royal Family carries the genetical inheritance that represents the population and their political, cultural and existential legacy . Such we may see the historical origin and function of all known mythologis frgom our ancient civilisations.

These ancient king-lines, being the fundamental legacy of the all old cultures got under hard and continous attack, as violence and war where waged - and various warlords grew strong enough to remove or estuinguish entire family-lines, to take their assesories and position.
So today almost all the old, legitimate inheritorial lines are gone. Though we still have some King-lines left on the earth. But today they are very few, and mostly out of work...

---



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:14:56 am
By the appearance of the global ice-time the different branches of the "prime family" got separated due to the appearance of ice-time. Now each region got a structure by themselves, based on the straigth descendants from the prime "Allfather Family". This created the different Kings and Kingdoms around the globe, that - by time and time again - developed their own charachteristics, as to etnicity, language and culture.

Today we may still see the results of that process, as the different kingdoms still exist as populations, to be defined from their common etnicity, area, language. But, we may also recognize our COMMON origin, both in our nature and our culture. The more we study ancient stories, sagas, myths and legends the more clear it becomes that also all mythologies realy are related.

Thus we may find The Widsom of The Ages inherrent in all the old cultures, - from the Inuits to the Aborgines. All the larger stories happen to have the same structure, dealing with "the beginning" and the following processes of "evolution" in "space" and "time", - even in paralell types of chronology. Not to mentioned the coherence of pictograms AND advanced writing-systems. But also the "structural stories" signifies a common basis of culture. And; they all reflect the "Royal principle" as the basis of their social and political culture.

Slowly, slowly we may understand that once we had a world-wide co-existence between populations that consciously shared a common origin, with a common set of structures, values and traditions. So we should not be to surprised really, when modern archaology now are digging up ancient PY-RA-MID`s all around the equatorial world. It is just proving what mythologers have suspected for quite ome time. The world once WAS one. For a long time, - before it got diversed. By ice-time. Today also known as "Altlantis-time".

That period ended 10.000 years ago, as the caucasians escaped their small refugee-area of the Baltic Ocean. To find back to the tropical populations existing in the south. Which they did about 9.200-9.500 years ago. Then we find arctical people, such as The Kennewick Man - and arctical produce, such as domestic plants and animals - spreading to all corners of the world.

Their intent was to re-establish a global unity, somewhat like it existed before ice-time. Thus these articals managed to reach and connect to the populations of the different continents - to establish a communication that could start to inform and align the different cultures of the wide tropical world. Bringing the diffrent kinds of useful items and knowledge - as well as "news" from "other worlds" these altlanteans became both famous and admired.

---



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:15:08 am
With the Greek-Roman takeover of Eurasia we got a dramatic shift in this process. Over lem of the last milennium the old legacy have been seriously changed and altered. With the introduction of "The New Time" did the Roman powers form the Emperial Church, some 16-1700 years ago. In the centuries to come the clerical Emperor sensored, banned and destroyed all memories of the old cultures. Not only did they destroy or kill the rigthful descendants of the Atlanten north, such as all the Royal and Noble lines of northern Europe. They also banned all stories, plays, rites, books and other knowledge that remindend, upheld or maintained the old, "atlantean" culture. Such as the annual celebrations following winter and summer solistice. Not to forget the chess-game. In 1244 the bishop of Paris alone detected, collected and burned more than 30.000 chess-sets in Paris alone, starting a ban that did not become lifted before the reformation 1534 reintroduced "free thougth" in Europe.

So whats the secret of the Chess-board?!

Simply that it reflects the very basic of the old, traditional and legitimate political system that had existed sine "time origin"!

So the chessboard was originally created as a teaching-device, to get a clear and good insigth into the structure and function of the old, pyramidal society - created already in the beginning of the Altantis-period.

Now, - today everybody can see and understand that the chessboard reflects the hierarchial, but vibrant strucure of the old Kingdoms. But, even if we again may find the chessboard freely used all over the world - there are hardly anyone understanding its original significance.

Although we start to get a good clue on our ancestoral past, we still - rigth here and now - have some tricky problems with our thougth-procsses within this subject.
The complete dis-continuum created during the dark midleage, - still affects us like an "information-lag" as we try to sort out and adjust to the real and relevant information given by an objective modern science.

Not any of us have really overcome this jet-lag, to become as clear, focused AND open-minded as it is required by the term "objective".


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 03-19-2004).]

IP: 195.159.182.137





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:15:21 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-19-2004 18:13
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Andre,
I forgot to point to the fact that The Oera Linda realy refers to the same waters as do The Bocksaga. There is realy no significant contradiction between them. On the contraryg - they realy confirm eachother.
I even heard that there exists other similar Family-sagas in Holland/Friesland - explaining they have inherited this "duty to keep the olde stories". This is actually congruent to historical facts of many old cultures, where the different functions of state and society where bound to the different family-lines. Thus the proword; "As father so son", as was the reality also in Europe until the 19th century,- nobilities and laymen alike.
From what I hear one of the Dutch families of story-tellers also is named Bock...!

Tarkin,
I am realy impressed by the shrude observations and strong logic you present. And I am already convinced tht Hudson Bay has something to do with the early articals/"atlanteans". But still i dont get a real clear picture on what/how/why...

Since the Kensington stone was proven genuine I am realy convinced that the old Norse sailors, and their PREDECESSORS, sailed TO the Hudson Bay, short after ic-time. Here at Kensington we find the exact midle-point between east and west of the continent. Moreover we find the great waterways of Cananda/USA, from Hudson to Huston so to say, connected with the close waterway west to the Pacific, where the Kennewick Man was found.

It is litle doubt that this 9.200 years old guy is Caucasian. And there is NO reason to doubt that we have had a civilisation inside the Baltic Ocean during ice-time.

The traces are measured to be OLDER than 450.000 years. That implies more than 100.000 generations of isolated procreation, which may start to explain the appearance of the very fundamental genetical changes needed to divert from the orignal tropical man into the palefaced Caucasians. Thats why we have to start there. But I still agree to that the Hudson Bay must have been highly significant to the further expension of these "atlanteans".
Just as England was a bridge-head on the way south, the Hudson bay have been a traffical centre-point of early origin.

But I can`t realy see what discoveries and facts that exist FROM Antarcica, to back up that opinion.

IP: 195.159.182.137





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:15:40 am
rockessence
Member posted 03-20-2004 10:27
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
In looking at the Kensingson stone material on line is a description of hundreds of boat-mooring holes found in large rocks along the shores of the Great Lakes.
There have been articles over the years in ANCIENT AMERICAN Magazine about evidence of copper mining on a massive and lengthy ongoing scale at Isle Royale area in upper Lake Superior relating to the period leading into and during the Bronze age. I will search for more info today. In doing a map search I notice that Alexandria Minn, the seat of the county where it was found, and the current location of the stone, is directly off the point of Lake Superior.
[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 03-20-2004).]
IP: 67.250.82.44



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:15:51 am
via mars
Member posted 03-20-2004 12:15
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i tip a bock beer to you guys, this is great reading!
IP: 151.200.32.247



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:16:04 am
rockessence
Member posted 03-20-2004 19:54
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How funny! Please go to www.bocksaga.com then to Articles, then to Leo Nygren Writings- BEER. Enjoy!!
Also funny is the use of the small "i" in your greeting as the original meaning of "i" is so ON THE SUBJECT!! Hooray via Mars!!
IP: 67.250.184.92



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:16:11 am
docyabut
Member posted 03-20-2004 21:40
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sure maybe a few vikings and phoenicians landed on the American shores before Columbus, but that sure as hell does`nt mean Atlantis was in the Americas,or the Antarctica ,which it has been frozen for the last 200,000 years.It sank for God sake.:0)remember.
IP: 205.188.116.21


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:16:21 am
docyabut
Member posted 03-20-2004 23:18
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Sorry Boreas, however as far as Atlantis being in Finland is a little out there and the nanny goat and monkey.In the fetus stage we have all the sighs of evolution, from a tapole to a fish with fins, to a reptile, to a manmul.Please explain what you mean?
IP: 205.188.116.21



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:16:31 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-21-2004 07:43
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Via,
Thanks. Hope you enjoyed the dark "father of all beers" - as they`ve been brewing labeled Bock-beer since 1050...

A few weeks ago it was repported that the later astronomical observations disaprove of the expanding universe. That means the Big Bang-theory is out to dry.
Not only opinions, but also theories good as "facts" seem to have a hard time. So also with the creation of the two first human beings. There is actually little or nothing that we do know about the preconditions, the place or the time of this incident. "We don`t even know what weather it was that day"! Correct, - so it was not neccesarily raining...

Dockey,
I think this is answered above. Please go through from the top. If needed - just clearify the questions and I`ll try to answer.


IP: 195.159.182.169



[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 02-28-2005).]



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:16:43 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 03-23-2004 11:39
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Proof of Atlantis in Antarctica? Well, it is difficult to look for proof. It is a misnomer that Antarctic was covered with ice for 200,000 years. With the Hudson Bay Pole, the corresponding South Pole would be roughly between Australia, Africa and Antarctica. Marie Byrd Land and the Antarctic Peninsula would have a mild climate. Just like Finland would have a mild climate.
Anyway, Antarctica is not the only site for Atlantis, just my leading candidate. In my opinion it fits the "known facts" better than any other place.
John




[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 03-04-2005).]



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:16:58 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-25-2004 11:24
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well Tark, what about the facts recently presented; about the ancient civilisation of the Baltics, - who obviously escaped "a deluge" - to enter the Mediterranean area - in boats - just about 9.200 years BP?!
Regards
IP: 195.159.192.5



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:17:10 am
via mars
Member posted 03-26-2004 07:02
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
why does a special branch of swiss guard watch over the vatican? could there be a connection to certain elements discussed within this thread?
always searching ...
IP: 138.88.60.179



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:17:54 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-26-2004 10:57
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Via
There are obviously some historical reason to why the former "world reign" of the Vatican keep Swiss men as the heads life-guard. But what are the issues discussed in this thread that you refer to?
Regards
IP: 195.159.190.239



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:18:08 am
via mars
Member posted 03-27-2004 08:10
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boreas - i am not quite sure, but maybe a stroll through the latter pages of "in god we trust ..." in the egypt and the pyramids threads? spec. the tidbit offered by anonymer feigling ...
in short, it's all about alliances. but was hoping someone of your vast knowledge might have an insight? or two?
back to that oh so cold region, scandinavia - i have a couple of friends, one swedish, one from norway, who are quite mum about your supposition(s). not to reflect negatively on your contentions; to the contrary. i see much merit in what you have written here as of late. but no one soul has the complete "vision". and i know you are trying your best. please keep it up, now we're getting somewhere ...

IP: 138.88.185.207





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:18:18 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-28-2004 17:34
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Via,
1. I did not find a reference to your question in the thread /title your refered. It`s interesting in itself - but mabe a bit outside the topic of this thread?!
2. Great that Scandinavians too get to dwell on this info. And, by the way; the case I bring forward is basically a result of the amazing, new source of info I REFER to, - namely the saga. The rest is just a matter of keeping updated on contemporary archaeology and related science. Hopefully I may add some common sense - at times.
3. ... And I do indeed agree to your conclusion; at least this material sheds a brand new ligth to the legends of Atlantis, as well as other. Together with the hard evidence from present science it is sure giving us a good push into a far better, more logic and closer understanding of teh basis of our history, culture and identity.

Best regards






Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:18:28 am
via mars
Member posted 03-28-2004 19:03
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thanks boreas - you are much more grounded than i when it comes to this subject. i tend to put -2 and 2 together, not to say that doesn't mean anything ...
... but in the scheme of things, your path is clearer. do carry on.
perhaps the answer is on planet y.

IP: 138.88.78.253





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:18:35 am
docyabut
Member posted 03-28-2004 19:14
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Boreas, as with the flood stories the Atlantis stories went around the world, in every culture.Plato said Atlantis excisted in the bronze age,which could only be 900 years before Solon ,not 9000,in the stone age.
IP: 205.188.116.14


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:18:44 am
Boreas
Member posted 03-28-2004 22:24
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Via,
The answers to your questions are obviously not to far away. I guess you have been reading about the close links between the power of Rome and the treasures collected during the crusades, not to mention since Columbus.
And where could the precious gold be more safe than up there, high in the mountains.
So it may be the ideal deal; You have my treasuries - I have your most treasureous sons" Officially as lifeguards - off course... So the Vatican gold could be safe - in Switzerland. And all that gold would be the most secure security for everybody who would be 100% safe about their bank-deposits.
Dockey,
There is NO doubt about that ice-time existed, until 10.000 years ago - when enormous masses of ice SLIDED INTO the oceans, causing the ocean level to rise aprox 100 metres (or more) in about 100 years. Thats 1 meter a year - and THAT`s a flooding. Someplaces - as in ther Black Sea and the Medditerranean, - the shift in waterlevel was even sharper!

And it happened about 8.700 - 9500 yers ago, according to the most recent hydrological research.

Onwards;
Does Platou describe that they arrived 9.000 BC - calling THAT bronze-age? Or does he describe that the Atlantens made bronze?
That is two very different statements. So which is it?

Regards

IP: 195.159.182.121





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:18:52 am
via mars
Member posted 03-29-2004 06:22
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as mentioned earlier, i believe that alliances are the key - and not just in this instance.
gold is one thing, knowledge is another. which is more valuable in this case?
IP: 141.156.150.86



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:19:04 am
rockessence
Member posted 04-01-2004 18:59
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Boreas, The currant issue of Atlantis Rising, with Leonardo on the cover has a big article: OLAUS RUDBECK'S "ATLANTICA"
Is There a Case for Atlantis in Sweden? I am sure you are familiar with this material. I hope all who have followed this thread will read it and compare the information with the document I mentioned previously, by Felice Vince, on HOMER IN THE BALTIC, available for download from www.bocksaga.de OH joy! It feels like it will all come together at last! I have been reading Mr. Vinci's thesis, around 300 pages long, and it is so chock full of proofs regarding the bronze age habitation of the Baltic, preceeding the Mediterranean cultures, it is really stunning! It makes perfect sense that the memory of the time of the gods, foggy even at the time of Troy, recalls Atlantis Alt Land Is inundated with water as the ice slid into the sea!
IP: 207.108.210.244



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:19:19 am
Boreas
Member posted 04-01-2004 20:35
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Thanks Rock,
Yes, it is somewhat important to keep in mind that also ice and snow is WATER.
Just remember the old story about the guy who walked on water? Well thats rather commonplace in the northern hemisphere, - not only in the Baltics, but also in the Asov and Caspian winter. And where did he actually come from - this 12 year old "prodgidy" that amazed the Egyptian Templars and scholars with his knowledge, some 2000 years ago? As we know the story today he walked on The Sea of Genesareth, - but may also that be an inaccuracy in the tales told - before or at the time this peculiar "phenomenon" went on record?

Or is it inproper to keep a critical mind towards such a source? Or may it be "speculative" in itself - to even contemplate a logical explanation behind this and other myths surrounding the famous guy from N-as-ar-et?

Forgive me for asking, but the answers to these questions may be highly relevant in order to understand how information can be misdelivered, misunderstood, wrongly interpretated or counsciously altered (to fit contemporary needs/objectives) by the ancient narrators - constituting the records being our source-material.

Today we know pretty much about alternative sources to the New Testament with different signatures, giving alternate profiles of Jesus and his teachings. We may have to adapt some of the same critical view to our understanding of Plato, especially since his version is occuring not only decades and centuries, but even millenias after the actual occurence of the Atlanteans happened.

To many biblical scolars, not to mention clerics, this "alternative" information on Jesus and his life are hard to accept. Quite a few of them do not even want to hear about the content and the impact of the Dead Sea Scrolls or the Qumran texts. The problem is, though, that these alternate references DO exist - as historical evidence. Let us hope that the scientific minds, investigating the reality behind the legends of Atlantis, are more open to a new, exstensive source of historical information - as it recently occured with the Fenno-Swedish legend of Altlandis.

To reject this reference material before giving it a proper check, - would not only be non-scientific, but unfortunate to the whole process of identifying the reality behind Platos great work. His aim was to keep the core of the basic memory, telling about a higly important period in human history. Anyone who want to pay the great Greek his due respect should indeed keep BOTH eyes open, as they re-read Platos material, understanding that some of his details may be sligthly altered. Considering the millenias that actually passed from the happenings to the recordings it is highly impressive that anything at all from this ancient antiquety remained at all.

Among impressive archaeological discoveries as well as huge sites and monuments of higher ancient cultures, we now have another LITTERATE source of information, - describing the period of Altlandis in more detail and with a more clear, historical chronlogy and stringens than even Plato himself. If one dare to look!

IP: 195.159.177.200





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:19:41 am
Boreas
Member posted 04-01-2004 21:34
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Today we have many and astounding discoveries from "pre-historic times" - repported from all around the globe. There are obvious traces of civil and cultural activity, some remains showing clear and strong indications of "higher" culture.
Mapped together this information - some being more than 40.000 years old - are pointing towards a much higher degree of cultural communication and interchange than previously recognized.
But there was a new impact and speed to this interchange that happened about 9.-10.000 years ago, as ice-time was rapidly disapearing. It is this change that spured off the development leading to the classcical cultures that we have been discussing on the different threads in this forum. The different results, discoveries and reflections presented here are showing many an impressive process of research and investigation, - not only of Platos work itself, but of an array of related works - from ancient records to present science.
By now we may see a new ignition of a world-wide communication appearing after ice-time, sparked off by the "sea-people" reffered to by Plato and others. Thus I have introduced the Fenno-Swedish saga and its history of an ancient pre-boral population in tha Baltics, surviving as people, society AND as a ancient culture. Since this saga was known first time in 1984 there have been a number of archaeological discoveries manifesting the outline of this oral tradition.

The saga references the origin of the arctic man, to go on telling exactly and chronologically how this culture developed furter as it spread rapidly around the open areas of the northern hemisphere.

Simultaniously this Baltic culture obviously started to communicate with the age-old civilisations of the sub-tropical hemisphere, such as the Mediterranean area. The connections grew so strong and steady that we can talk about a Eurpean community of trade and culture being excercised already around 7000 BP. As the English professor of European Archaeology, Barry Cunliffe, have shown in his last works; there was a balance of peaceful trade and stable communion between the peoples of the Atlantic Coast and the Medeiterranean shores for about 5000 years, - not to be broken before the Caesarian army introduced war in Northern Europe.

Nowing that there was a time - even an eon of time - where war was still unknown -it should be obvious, not strange, that we have a lot of cultural sites, monuments and items showing centras of higher culture around the globe, existing already before as well as after the end of ice-time.

It should be likewise obvious that we have a new impact created by the arctic people and their culture, regaining access and contact with theese culture as ice-time ended. The significance of this arcticals are still to be further investigated and understood, but it is simply beyound doubt that their appearance in the subtropical and tropical waters occured some 9-10000 years ago, coincide with the time and the nature of the legends refered to BOTH in Plato and the Bocksaga.

The impact of this co-existance is a main reference also in Homers litterature, such as in OdeZevs (Zevs in Oden). In the Norse sagas we have a parallel royal figure by the name of Ull, also called Ullu-se-us. That is one reason to look further into the recent research done by our contemporary professor, Dr. Felice Vinci.

Another evidence of this ancient connection is discovered in the Vedas, where astronomic references today are investigated scientifically. The amazing results shows a clear-cut connection between information given in the Indian Vedas and a pre-boreal civilisation dwelling in the highest north, during ice-time. (See Solon12`s neighbouring thread: "More than one Atlantis" for more profound facts). Similar equations have been made on information given in Norse sagas, establishing a "pre-viking" sailing-route between Northern Norway, Greenland and todays America.

The number of stories and and archaeological proofs are about to become far to many to uphold the view of the early co-existence, between the Baltics and the Mediterranean, as a result of ancient or contemporay "fringe elements".


IP: 195.159.176.248





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:19:48 am
via mars
Member posted 04-02-2004 05:55
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great stuff guys - i have long held the belief that a certain religion has been hoodwinking the common man in various ways for hundreds, if not thousands of years. so many little clues ... thanks for continuing to bring forth what could be the start of some new textbooks, that may one day replace the incredibly biased science fiction passed off as fact(s).
IP: 141.156.18.30


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:20:03 am
Ancient Star
New Member posted 04-02-2004 10:57
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Evolution explaining the "white" race??
No, evolution did NOT "explain" the "white" race. In reality, "evolutionists" have actually explained absolutely nothing. Sharks, frogs and other mammals, etc., et al, still appear today as they did millions of years in the past. The only skulls these frauds have come up with are some old primates, along with some ancient aboriginal skulls. And yes, the aborigials ("original" blacks, without too much "white" genetic material at that time) hunted Europe after the ice age (maybe before even). These folk were known to "go with the flow," lived simply, follow the land, as well as the animals, being meat eaters and hunters. They have left their hunting scenes on European (Spain, etc.) cliff walls.
All these old skulls prove is, that the ancient black aboriginal race frequented post ice-age Europe, as well as many other places on the earth. Once upon a time the oceans were about 426 feet lower than they are today, making it possible to travel by foot (long "walk-abouts" with camp-outs) for great distances, not to discount any rafts or simple-to-make canoes. etc.

IP: 209.165.57.172



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:20:19 am
via mars
Member posted 04-02-2004 12:44
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i never made a connection to the aborigines travelling about the world, but it's possible ...
funny how the central africans and australian natives are discounted though. what's going on?
sometimes i think that we are two or three different creatures (the surviving humans).

and who really is in control of genetic info and how it is disbursed to the public? now, there's not a snowballs' chance in hell that this new info is being manipulated is there? ... just like other sciences being so robustly correct all these years?
how do we really know about all these genetic comparisons being bandied about? how do we really know?

IP: 138.88.69.199





Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:20:34 am
tarkin22180
Member posted 04-02-2004 14:25
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Boreas,
Regarding:
"Well Tark, what about the facts recently presented; about the ancient civilisation of the Baltics, - who obviously escaped "a deluge" - to enter the Mediterranean area - in boats - just about 9.200 years BP?!

Regards"


In my opinion, an ancient civilization in the Baltics before the deluge is a possibility. I've heard many dates (12,000 BC, 9,600 BC) for the deluge. This corresponds well with the end of the ice age and the destruction of Atlantis.

The author Rand Flem-Ath concludes that many peoples escaped the deluge. One example is South America. There are settlements on or near the Andes mountaintops. Why would anyone farm on a mountaintop? Perhaps a racial memory of a cataclysmic event, i.e. a worldwide deluge. And, there are mountains near Finland after all!

Note the following, my comments are in ():

======================================
Atlantis Rising Magazine #45, Page 62:

Like all his prophecies,
Century II.22 is
open to interpretation.
Nostradamus refers
to lsle submergee
as Nobril du Monde.
Atlantis, the sunken
isle, was also known
as the Navel of the
World.

(Antarctica is known as the “navel of the world”)

According to Cayce, the present island of
Bimini anciently belonged to the western
portion of the Atlantean Empire known as
Poseidia, named after the sea-god described
by Plato, and the mythic founder of Atlantis.
In 1933, Cayce described it as “the sunken
portion of Atlantis, or Poseidia, where a portion
of the temples may yet be discovered
under the slime of ages of seawater” near
what is known as Bimini, off the coast of
Florida. Eight years passed before he mentioned
Bimini for the last time: “Poseidia
will be among the first portions of Atlantis
to rise again.

(Note the emphasis on “western portion of the Atlantean Empire”, not Atlantis itself.)

===========================================

The Atlantean Empire was huge (as Plato describes). It would not surprise me if the Bahamas, Finland, Egypt, India, South America, etc were all part of the Atlantean Empire.

The Nile, Tigris Euphrates, Indus, and Chinese civilizations are the descendents of Atlantis (my opinion). These are considered the "great ancient civilizations". The Maya, Aztecs, Inca, Pacific Peoples, Africans, Australians, etc are also descendents of Atlantis (my opinion).

The theorist says humans evolved in Africa and migrated from there. Perhaps, but I say that humans migrated from Antarctica / Atlantis to the other parts of the world.

And then there are the Annunaki.

I'm fascinated by the story of gods who from the sky came down to earth. This is in the written record (or in the clay to be more precise). There are many myths saying that the gods educated mankind, not just Sumerian. Plato says that a god founded Atlantis! And as the Roman gods are based on the Greek gods, so are the Greek gods based on the Sumerian gods!

Regards,

John



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:21:07 am
Boreas
Member posted 04-04-2004 18:58

Story from BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/sci/tech/3361925.stm
IP: 195.159.184.151
Boreas
Member posted 04-04-2004 21:36

More useful "comments"; http://www.odinic-rite.org/CoO/giants.html http://www.geocities.com/TheTropics/Lagoon/1345/caucasian.html
IP: 195.159.184.151

Boreas
Member posted 04-05-2004 13:40

Until some clear-cut evidence are completed it may not be possible to get this discussion beyound the issue of location. So far we have to deal with the scarce material that exists of the Greek legends, explained and re-explained througout the last century.
Because of the exstensive debate that have evolved out of Platos dialogues it seems to be difficult to add a brand NEW source of information, even though we may find it highly compatible to the legends presented by Plato and others.
Due to early 20th century books of the esoteric writers - from Blavatsky/Cayce and onwards - it may be hard to see the discrepancy between all the fictions, speculations and ideas occuring, - and the facts of genuine sources, -that being the authentic stories from Greek writers or the Finnish Saga-keepers. Especially the later, as it still is brand new and "unusual" to most of us.
Though, sinc it is backed by recent research of both archeological and mythological nature - it is becomming more and more difficult not to give the Finnish source-material its due credibility.
IP: 195.159.178.207
via mars
Member posted 04-05-2004 18:53

boreas - with all due respect, screw the plato theory - full steam ahead with yours.
now you can get past the mish-mash. as you so eloquenty and diplomatically put it, there are many avenues, none to be discounted, but the prevailing theories are just that ... prevailing. enough of the other "stories" already. they have their own holes and glaring inconsistencies, not to mention non-encompassing locations (too many people focus on one place, instead of one empire).
keep giving it a whirl ... or i'm going home. (vote of confidence)
IP: 141.156.195.157

(Please Excuse the fact that part of this thread is missing here....as you can see by the dates. Rockessence)

Boreas
Member posted 09-17-2004 15:31
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Just like Allfather once was A real, naturally born (human) being...
As he was the straigth descendant and heir of the first Man to walk this planet - he could be VERY real, and still considered to be the Highest (of heredity) and the First (among brothers). Not to forget that he was the elder of the (large) Aser family, - once widely regarded to be the origin of all royal families known...
Now, since royal families still exists - WE may have a chance to what our ancient evolutional and cro(w)nological history was all about. Before it got altered, forgotten or twisted. And changed into pure superstition. As the Oera Linda says - "by the Magis", i.e. priests.

This superstition is still bearing a great impact on how we consider the essential parts of nature, - such as the "esoterical" dimensions, where matter, speed and space meet at a very fine, elementary level.

Today - thanks God (!) - do we have the natural sciences back on the legal side of society AGAIN, - recovered and redeveloped. But still great many people consider the "mysteries" of life as of "supernatural" nature. Because there is still room for the repetitions of a particualr superstition, mixed with both historical information as well as legends.

Today we still regard this kind of superstition as relevant. There are literally billions that still trust beyond doubt in ONE of the three "holy books", - that ALL claim themselves to be The One. To settle - between these monopolistic belief-systems - who is rigth there is only one metod possible, which is power-games, antagonism and outrigth war...

AS long as we - the citizens of this day and age - keep our fossil deceptions in regard. Though, - it does look as we have been getting somewhat more sober during the later weeks, months and years. At least a good few people NOW seem to understand that these very mechanisms - of sociologal, cultural and historical nature - actually have unfolded during the last millenias. Leaving us all in a cul de sac...

When time allows I hope we may elaborate some more on the basis of the sound that form the word and the meaning of "mystery".
The first syllable "MY" is indeed a biggie within the sounds of our languages. So we may have some goodie in spare for the winter...

Good to back online!

Best regards


IP: 195.159.181.57



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:21:20 am
Boreas
Member posted 09-19-2004 19:37
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The My-sound still causing me trouble. At present the analyzis have come a bit further, - and the more we understand the bigger it gets.
The feminine aspect of the whole word - My-S-Te-Ra is completly ob vious. Still we have the i in the beginning/end, that is re-pointing/re-inforcing the whole thing once more.
Then there is occuring a number of essential connotations (i.e. sounds as words AND ascociations ("meaning")). Like My-Sa(winking), My-Ga (mosq-i-to), My-Ra (ant), Myrra (Myrrh), My-Se (whey), My-Te (myth!). And it just keeps growing, multidimensionly, from there. A basic word from the latin pop-ups are my-cel-i-um.

"i-um" refers to the phrase "home", also in terms of our planet. Thus ium also reflects to an earthly "omni-presence".

Then "my-cell" reflects the most tiny, microscopic cells. Like my-cro/mi-cro is inside the visible nature, while ma-cro reflects the large, or overall, grand sum of visible nature.

Finally we check the whole word itself - and what it is used to describe - as of today. That takes us to the world of Biology, - where the mycelium is known to has an awful lot to do with the origin AND present basis of all biological life, as we know it...

So the impact and implications of the sound "my" may be seen to be of "vast proportions".

IP: 195.159.190.127

[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 02-25-2005).]

[This message has been edited by rockessence (edited 02-25-2005).]



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:23:15 am
Absonite
Member
Posts: 982
From: Florida
Registered: Dec 2003
  posted 11-24-2004 20:18             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
4. THE ANDITE INVASIONS OF EUROPE
80:4.1 While the Andites poured into Europe in a steady stream, there were seven major invasions, the last arrivals coming on horseback in three great waves. Some entered Europe by way of the islands of the Aegean and up the Danube valley, but the majority of the earlier and purer strains migrated to northwestern Europe by the northern route across the grazing lands of the Volga and the Don.

80:4.2 Between the third and fourth invasions a horde of Andonites entered Europe from the north, having come from Siberia by way of the Russian rivers and the Baltic. They were immediately assimilated by the northern Andite tribes.

80:4.3 The earlier expansions of the purer violet race were far more pacific than were those of their later semimilitary and conquest-loving Andite descendants. The Adamites were pacific; the Nodites were belligerent. The union of these stocks, as later mingled with the Sangik races, produced the able, aggressive Andites who made actual military conquests.


80:4.4 But the horse was the evolutionary factor which determined the dominance of the Andites in the Occident. The horse gave the dispersing Andites the hitherto nonexistent advantage of mobility, enabling the last groups of Andite cavalrymen to progress quickly around the Caspian Sea to overrun all of Europe. All previous waves of Andites had moved so slowly that they tended to disintegrate at any great distance from Mesopotamia. But these later waves moved so rapidly that they reached Europe as coherent groups, still retaining some measure of higher culture.

80:4.5 The whole inhabited world, outside of China and the Euphrates region, had made very limited cultural progress for ten thousand years when the hard-riding Andite horsemen made their appearance in the sixth and seventh millenniums before Christ. As they moved westward across the Russian plains, absorbing the best of the blue man and exterminating the worst, they became blended into one people. These were the ancestors of the so-called Nordic races, the forefathers of the ScandinavianÊ, German, and Anglo-Saxon peoples.


80:4.6 It was not long before the superior blue strains had been fully absorbed by the Andites throughout all northern Europe. Only in Lapland (and to a certain extent in Brittany) did the older Andonites retain even a semblance of identity.


http://urantiabook.org/newbook/papers/p080.htm

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:23:48 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 12-04-2004 02:01             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Abso,
I am afraid I can`t really relate exstensivly to the stories covered by the Urantia papers.

The populisation of Northern Eurasia is obviously ARTICALS. But, - the time and place of the origin - of the first artical population is still far from sufficently explained. By proof.

But, - we do already know that there have actually been existing A Artical Population
already 280.000 years ago. In Finland. We also know that "modern man" visited the White Sea and The Kara Ocean, - already 40.000 years ago.

We also know that this population disapeared - due to the "deluge" appearing when the glacier covering 95 % of Fenno-Scandia started moving, aprox. 10.700 years ago. As this glacier broke up, the part covering Finland started moving south. As the glacier slided towards the ocean the ancient population of the Finnish archepelago would either escape - or being pushed into the ocean.

Seemingly some of them did escape and survive, - since we still see a relative large group of artical populations still today. And we can even follow a line of development of this culture, from the time when the first groups of ALL the artical populations (Europeans, Russians) arrived about 10.000 years ago. And we can still see that this populations still express a large number of etnical, lingual and cultural expressions - closely related to the Artical Nature.

This simple time-line is based on the growingly famous discoveries made over the last decade by Scandinavian and Russian scientists. (www.nba.fi, etc.)

So far the oldest of ALL known artical populations is found in the Finnish Archepelago. Consequently we have to direct our attention to this specific area to establish a historical background for the fully and completly "climatized" kind of human, that populated the Finnish archipelago already DURING ice-time.

9-10.000 years ago this people started populating the vast and empty area of the artical climate-zone. Given the speed they have expanded by it must be this ONE, pre-boreal population that have developed the skills and abilities to sustain the artic winter, under scarce circumstances. Thus we may explain the origin and the fast expension of the artical population, that already 8000 years ago covered the entire Eurasian continent, from Biscaya to The Chinese Wall. 6-7.000 years ago they sailed across the Atlantic Ocean, populating the Orkneys, The Feroe Islands, etc. As to when they reached the American continent is still not clearified, - but the mentioned Clovis culture may still be an early appearance of articals, populating coastal areas of the Artical America, as we have seen from the excavations on New Foundland.

A funny piece in the puzzle is actually a picture of a highly organized society and a gouvermental order depicted in the cultural antiquities today found from the Eurasian mesolittic (early stone-age). Already 8.000 years ago we find a organised culture covering the east of Eurasia, while western Europe had a similar but still distinctly separate expresions. Cross-referencing a gross amount of archeoloigcal items one seems noe to agree that we have had eastern AND western charactheristics separate already 8.000 years ago...!

Still today we can divide the linguistical and etnical border of Euraisa by the same old line, starting at the top of the border between Finland and Sweden - following the old border-river straigth south, crossing Aland before following the old border-river Weichsel/Wizla in todays Poland, before reaching Balkan, Moldovia and the shores of the Black Sea.

Just recently we had another astonishing discovery revealed in this matter;

---

"Prehistoric skeleton unearthed in Bulgaria"

The skeleton of a prehistoric woman believed to
represent the first agricultural civilization
existing on Bulgarian land was unearthed near the
village of Ohoden, Vratsa district, northwest
Bulgaria. Archeologists found the skeleton on the
river bank of the local Skut river. The finding
was approximately dated back 9,000 years, which
makes the 'Bulgarian farmer' five centuries older
than the already known humans to have lived on
the Balkan Peninsula.
The skeleton was revealed during excavation
works in a pre-historic village unearthed from a
depth of 2 m. "This woman skeleton is five
centuries older than those which were found in
the Balkans and belong to the first generation of
farmers that inhabited this region," said
archaeologist Georgy Ganetsovski, who made the
discovery.
The village seemed to be very well
preserved after being devasted by a big fire.
Archeologists said that the people living on
these lands in prehistoric times were the first
to invent ceramics and to build thermally
isolated solid houses. They were convinced that
the Ohoden finding would redraft the history of
human civilization.

Sources: Novinite, (31 October 2004), The Hindu (7 November 2004) http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=40971 http://www.hinduonnet.com/thehindu/holnus/003200411072167.htm
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:24:07 am
Faravid
New Member
Posts: 18
From:
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 12-07-2004 05:41             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ohoden - what an interesting name! Could it be related to the Oden (like Odessa)? Or does it just mean something else in Bulgarian language?
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:24:16 am
Faravid
New Member
Posts: 18
From:
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 12-07-2004 05:41             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ohoden - what an interesting name! Could it be related to the Oden (like Odessa)? Or does it just mean something else in Bulgarian language?
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:24:50 am
Lochmodor
New Member
Posts: 9
From: Norway
Registered: Nov 2004
  posted 12-07-2004 13:49             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Just wanted too mention that the word "Trel"
or "Trell" is still used in Norway today.
meaning slave or worker.
We do also use the word "Træl" or "Trael" (if your comp doesent support this letter)
to describe hard or troublesome work.

The same word are also used for hard skin areas in the palm of hands caused by hard work.


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:25:08 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 12-09-2004 02:11             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Lochmodor,
A little more about Trel (Trelet: Trel-branch) from www.bocksaga.de
"In this time that was called PARADISE people lived in harmony with nature laws and -powers. At that time the earth's axis stood perpendicular to the sun. For this reason existed a land at the North pole with a diameter of 250km where the sun never went down but instead described a golden ring at the horizon. This land was called the ringland UUDENMAA, the sunland. Today it is a province in the South of Finland. In the time called PARADISE the South Pole was located in the ocean. The center of UUDENMAA was a city built on seven hills and seven islands. It was the cradle of humanity with the name HEL. The planet was divided in ringlands which all had a center connected with HEL. Inside UUDENMAA lived the ASER. In the outer ringlands lived the VANER who were descendants from the ASER.

Humanity was one family consisting of five classes: Piru-et, Rus-et, Jarl-et, Karl-et and Trel-et
PIRUET and RUSET are the ASER in UUDENMAA, JARLET, KARLET, TRELET are the VANER outside of UUDENMAA. The ASER spoke ROT language (speak: root) from which todays Swedish originates. For the VANER they created in all ringlands the VAN language (speak: one), comparable with todays Finish. PIRUET created RUSET, RUSET created JARLET, JARLET created KARLET and KARLET created TRELET. Thus a pyramidical family structure was guaranteed.
The top of the pyramid was formed by the Bock-Family (Piruet) which consisted of PER ( The Allfather), and ELLA (The Earthmother), Bock and SVAN who created at least 12 sons and 7 daughters. The first son was RA (Ers), the first daughter MAYA (Maj). They became King and Queen of the family when they were 27 years old. They did not make any children, nor did the following ten brothers and 6 sisters. When the 12th son became 27 years old he took over the position of his father and became the new Bock who again begot 12 sons and 7 daughters with a new SVAN -choosen under the Vaner.

Together with the DISAS (the stem-mothers) Bock created the second class-RUSET consisting of RABIS, NARS, DISAS and SIENARES. The RABIS became the Allfathers of the ringlands outside UUDENMAA. The NARS represented the male part and the sienares the female part of the information system that spread out from HEL over the whole planet......"

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:25:27 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-06-2005 20:40             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The works of Jonathan Adams is of the few reliable updates on the ice-age, that being in America or Eurasia.
http://www.esd.ornl.gov/projects/qen/nerc.html#maps http://www.esd.ornl.gov/projects/qen/nercNORTHAMERICA.html

As we see the same main stages of development are paralell in time, using geological time-frames. Understanding that "ice-time" began - endured, and ended, - at the same periods all over the Northern Hemisphere.

The last stages - before our time - have been so well understood, today - that modern geologists like Adams have the with to collect and verify the mass of information neccecary to create A all-over-view that may result in a world-map, describing the globe, 10.000+ years ago.

Over the last years we have seen more and more maps constructed, - both locally, regionally and continentally. Based on the remarkable work by Danish climatologists we can now get "technically confirmed" information about the climate over the Greenland Ice-Sheet over the last 170.000 years. That confirming archeological/biochemical estimates from different sites over large areas have helped a lot to get clear on the periods of the climate at the time, such as "melting periods" and "interglacials".

Together with an exstensive body of geological information it is possible to draw maps of the last 120.000 years. Somehow.

But there is still MUCH ground to cover before we have a clear, scientifically confirmed picture of the entire ice-time.
Some one year ago I asked Johnathan Adams
if there is chance of getting a map describing the glaciers definite MAXIMUM size, understanding that is a key to get closer to a definite age/duration of the anamolay that occured as the globe started to freeze - from both south and north, simultaniously...

The answer was most clearly; "Not possible". Which corresponds to the feed-back I got from other geologists/climatologists at the time, normally adressing the problems of gaining certanity about anything older than 120.000 years - occurring ON the surface of the crust...

Luckily, Mr. Adams is a young and vigourous scientist. When I see the work he already have added to his merrits over the last year I guess he will be among the first to pull that investigation together...!

Meanwhile we may keep focus on what happened over the last 120.000 years, - since both "Modern Civilization" as well as "Atlantis" is much younger than that.
It also means that the population existing within the Baltic Ocean 120.000 years ago - already - have had to be very, very artical.

This means that nature have been able to develop ONE tribe of the original man, outside the tropical world, - to survive and endure in an "high-artic climate", where the ground is covered with ice and snow half of the year...

Adapting to such a complete "climate-shock" is incredibly demanding. The chance that such an isolated culture is minimal. And its less than nothing if these people was unable to undergo many serious adaptions, - such as food, warmth, health, habits, work, etc. - in order to simply survive. To pic up more sun, during the shorth summer, - the skin got lighter, even turning completly white. Pale white. Only a few birthmarks with pigments - keeping the color of their original, tropical skincolor. That also why the articals developed green/blue ices. They`re still low on sunshine & pigment.

Today we have artical people still existing. We call them caucasians.
If they did NOT exist 120.000 years ago, - then WHICH kind of people did then exist inside the Baltics 120.000 years ago? Another artic population??!

I have still to hear a etnologist defending the theory that we have had TWO different types of artical man. If so; How many Etruscans/Chineese/Mayans/Aboriginals/Neanderthals? Do any biologist find it likely that TWO - different - hybrids should occur twice, - from one and the same parental origin?!


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-06-2005).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:25:42 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-08-2005 18:59             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
One more step - to understand Eurasias "stone-age antiquety".

Laurence Gardiner:
"Genesis of the Grail Kings",
Lecture at Nexus Conference, Sydney 1999.

It seems like hardly any time since I was here. It's only ten months ago, I guess, but in the past few months Genesis of the Grail Kings has been completed, published and is already making a significant impact in Britain, with launches now taking place further afield.

Duncan has asked me to begin by giving some background about myself once again. I am involved with a number of organisations - the Celtic Church being one in particular, for which I'm the Grand Prior in Britain [that is, the Celtic Church of the Sacred Kindred of St Columba]. Not necessarily that the established Church organisations like the Celtic movement very much, but that's the way of it. I am also appointed as a Presidential Attaché to an organisation called The European Council of Princes.

The Council was founded in 1946, directly after the War, and the object was fairly straightforward. (In fact, some of the financing actually came from this country [Australia], and a lot from America as well). It was at a time when there was a tremendous fear about the build-up of further extremist right-wing factions, and there was also the fear that the communist left-wing might take a hold in Europe. It was decided, therefore, to set up a watchdog committee called The International Council of Government, whose brief was to keep an eye on the extreme political factions. As it transpired, it didn't have very much to keep an eye on and, once the European Common Market came into being, it became much more involved with that from the 1960s. The Council quite liked the idea of the trading agreements and the general mutuality, although it doesn't like things too much in the way they have now developed within the European Union.
About ten tears ago, the Council changed its name to become The European Council of Princes. With the eventual establishment of the European Parliament, there could hardly be a Council of Government as well. In fact, the Council was not a government at all: it was simply an advisory body consisting of thirty-three European royal houses. These might be reigning houses, dispossessed houses or deposed houses but, whatever the case, various princes and princesses of these families formed the Council. For the longest time now, their objective has been a fairly simple one, and that is to look after the constitutional clauses within the various nation states (European countries, with the exception of Britain, have Written Constitutions). And so, when the European Parliament decides to enact this new law or impose that new dictate, the Council of Princes is able to say, "Look, you can't actually do that because it contravenes, say, clause 7 in subsection (b) of the Constitution of this or that country".
The Council of Princes is not especially political - it is more of a social Council in practice; and I am appointed as an Attaché by virtue of the fact that its President since 1992 has been HRH Prince Michael of Albany, the current heir to the Royal House of Stuart - the House that was deposed in Britain from 1688.
The House of Stuart, having taken over the presidency of the Council from the House of Habsburg-Austria, related it to its one-time Royal Academy, which was a very scientific establishment. In fact, in the 1700s in particular, it was highly Rosicrucian - very scientific and alchemical. From the time of Robert the Bruce, the Chancellor of that organisation was given the title Prince Saint Germain. This title had little to do with the 5th-century saint himself (except indirectly), but it had to do ultimately with the Stuart Royal Court in France, at the Palace of Saint Germain.
The Chancellor title was changed in the 1700s to Count Saint Germain, and in the 1890s it was changed again to become Chevalier Saint Germain. My present title is that of Chevalier Saint Germain - which is where the knighthood comes from. As distinct from an English knighthood, mine is a Franco-Scot distinction attached to the Stuart Royal Court of France [as ratified by King Louis XIV in 1692], in the key Noble Order of the Royal Palace of Saint Germain-en-Laye, near Paris.
Being a Stuart supporter, I am not really a great fan of the House of Hanover, as you know. However, I have now become attached to a particular Hanoverian establishment. The oldest antiquarian society in the world, constituted by the House of Hanover [by charter of King George III of Britain] in the middle 1700s, is an association called the Society of Antiquaries which, in Scotland, forms an adjunct to Historic Scotland - a Government department. Well, as a non-fan of the House of Hanover, I was privileged and delighted a few months ago to be made a Fellow of the Society of Antiquaries of Scotland - so it rather looks as if I've been blessed to have a little bit of a foot in the establishment's academic camp.
Now, back to where we are today. I have to begin of course by thanking Duncan and the NEXUS team for affording me the opportunity to link my first Australian visit for the new book, Genesis of the Grail Kings, with the NEXUS Conference. And I would like to thank those of you who, since I was last here, have written to me. Some of you may have had a reply by now; my correspondence was more or less up to date around Christmas, but it has fallen behind again. So, if you're still waiting, please bear with me; I will respond.
I first began to talk publicly about the subject matter of Genesis of the Grail Kings back in October 1997 and, indeed, we covered a good deal of related ground at the NEXUS Conference last July. So, with the book now completed and published, I guess the time has come to move on to other things in preparation for future works.
Originally, and beginning with Bloodline of the Holy Grail, I had planned for a series of three books on the Grail theme, covering some 6,000 years of Messianic inheritance from the time of Adam, through King David and Jesus, down to the present day. However, in the course of compiling this genealogical descent and its fascinating history, the concept for another book has arisen. This has come about more by popular demand than by strategic planning, and I have become so enthused with the idea that there will now be four books in this particular series. It is, in fact, about this fourth book (rather than the immediate Genesis successor) that I would like to speak today.
Bloodline of the Holy Grail covers an historical period from the time of Jesus through the past 2,000 years. Subsequently, Genesis of the Grail Kings was written to answer the most asked of all resultant readers' questions: Why was the Grail Bloodline so important in the first place? Why was the kingly line which descended to Jesus and beyond so unique from the outset in old Mesopotamian times?
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:25:55 am
This was the subject which we discussed here last year, and we saw how the Messianic succession of Grail dynasts (or Dragon Kings) was alchemically conceived and purpose-bred for the role of earthly leadership. We looked at the records of ancient Sumer, which talked of the Anunnaki gods and their "creation chamber". We saw how the great vulcans of the era produced the enigmatic Highward Fire-stone (the white powder of monatomic gold) that was used to feed the Light-bodies of the Babylonian Kings and Egyptian Pharaohs. And we saw how this substance, when ingested, had stunning effects on the body's endocrinal system. Ultimately, we followed the senior line of royal descent (a line that was genetically determined by the mitochondrial DNA of the Dragon Queens) down to the time of Moses. And we visited the Temple, discovered in 1904, high on the Bible's Mount Horeb, where the monatomic fire-stone was made.
Now we shall take a look at the wider scheme of things, in terms of the folklore and fable which have emanated from the alchemical realm of the Pendragons. And we shall consider, in particular, the longstanding disputes which have prevailed between the sacred Bloodline and the Church establishment. These stories and their historical roots (whether portrayed in fairy tale, nursery rhyme or Gothic romance) will form the basis of a forthcoming book, entitled Ring Lords of the Dragon: Beyond the Portal of the Twilight Realm.
So, today, we shall be looking at the world of enchantment, with a little myth, a little magic and a good deal of historical fact, as some of the characters of popular legend take their place on the stage of reality. And, at the conclusion of this talk, we shall open the door to one of the most intriguing, but suppressed, secrets of our heritage.
On the face of it, the Grail-related stories (whether of Cinderella, Robin Hood, Sleeping Beauty or Count Dracula) each hold their separate mysteries and enchantments, but it is not generally understood that they all stem from a common historical base which is rooted in the culture of the Grail Kings. Even though some of the themes have their origins in very old lore, the majority of tales (as we know them) were newly slanted from the Dark Ages onwards, and especially from mediaeval times when the Church's persecution of Grail heretics was in full swing, leading to the Catholic Inquisitions.
Among the best known of these heterodox Christians (or "heretics") in the Middle Ages were the Cathars, the Pure Ones of the Languedoc region in southern France. And they, in line with the Dragon tradition of the Ouroboros Ring Lords, referred to the Messianic Bloodline as the Elven Race. As we shall see, the terms "elf", "fairy", "pixie" and the like were all representative of various castes within the kingly succession.
The Ouroboros (as detailed in Genesis of the Grail Kings) was a symbol of wholeness, unity and eternity, usually identified by a serpent (in the form of a ring) clutching its own tail. With a cross positioned beneath the ring, the emblem becomes the familiar device of the female - the Venus symbol (as portrayed on the cover of Genesis of the Grail Kings). Alternatively, with a cross positioned above the ring, it becomes the masculine Orb of sovereign regalia. And with the cross positioned within the ring, it becomes emblematic of the Holy Grail itself - identified as the Dew Cup, or the Rosi-crucis.
In the Cathar language of old Provence, a female elf was an albi (elbe or ylbi), and Albi was the name given to the main Cathar centre in Languedoc. This was in deference to the matrilinear heritage of the Grail dynasty, for the Cathars were supporters of the original Albi-gens - the Elven Bloodline which had descended through the Dragon Queens of yore, such as Lilith, Miriam, Bathsheba and Mary Magdalene. It was for this reason that, when Simon de Montfort and the armies of Pope Innocent III descended upon the region in 1209, it was called the Albigensian Crusade. Through some 35 years, tens of thousands of innocent people were slaughtered in this brutal campaign - all because the inhabitants of the region were champions of the original concept of Grail kingship, as against the pseudo-style of monarchy which had been implemented by the papal machine.
In practical terms, Church kingship prevailed from the 8th century and it has continued through the ages to the present day. But the fact is that, under the strict terms of sovereign practice, all such monarchies and their affiliated governments have been illegitimate.
So, what is Church kingship? It is precisely that with which we have become so familiar. It applies to all monarchs who achieve their regnal positions as a result of Church coronation - by the Pope, or, in Britain, by the Archbishop of Canterbury. In terms of true kingship, there is no necessity for coronation because kingly and queenly inheritance are, and always were, "in the blood" - to be precise, in the mitochondrial DNA of the Sangréal.
In the old scheme of things, kingship was automatic because it was an alchemical inheritance which, in practice, had nothing to do with ruling over anyone or anywhere. By virtue of an illegal dictate, however, monarchies were brought under Church control and the magical Realm of the Ring Lords was supplanted by the material and territorial reigns of the papal kings.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:26:52 am
This was the subject which we discussed here last year, and we saw how the Messianic succession of Grail dynasts (or Dragon Kings) was alchemically conceived and purpose-bred for the role of earthly leadership. We looked at the records of ancient Sumer, which talked of the Anunnaki gods and their "creation chamber". We saw how the great vulcans of the era produced the enigmatic Highward Fire-stone (the white powder of monatomic gold) that was used to feed the Light-bodies of the Babylonian Kings and Egyptian Pharaohs. And we saw how this substance, when ingested, had stunning effects on the body's endocrinal system. Ultimately, we followed the senior line of royal descent (a line that was genetically determined by the mitochondrial DNA of the Dragon Queens) down to the time of Moses. And we visited the Temple, discovered in 1904, high on the Bible's Mount Horeb, where the monatomic fire-stone was made.
Now we shall take a look at the wider scheme of things, in terms of the folklore and fable which have emanated from the alchemical realm of the Pendragons. And we shall consider, in particular, the longstanding disputes which have prevailed between the sacred Bloodline and the Church establishment. These stories and their historical roots (whether portrayed in fairy tale, nursery rhyme or Gothic romance) will form the basis of a forthcoming book, entitled Ring Lords of the Dragon: Beyond the Portal of the Twilight Realm.
So, today, we shall be looking at the world of enchantment, with a little myth, a little magic and a good deal of historical fact, as some of the characters of popular legend take their place on the stage of reality. And, at the conclusion of this talk, we shall open the door to one of the most intriguing, but suppressed, secrets of our heritage.
On the face of it, the Grail-related stories (whether of Cinderella, Robin Hood, Sleeping Beauty or Count Dracula) each hold their separate mysteries and enchantments, but it is not generally understood that they all stem from a common historical base which is rooted in the culture of the Grail Kings. Even though some of the themes have their origins in very old lore, the majority of tales (as we know them) were newly slanted from the Dark Ages onwards, and especially from mediaeval times when the Church's persecution of Grail heretics was in full swing, leading to the Catholic Inquisitions.
Among the best known of these heterodox Christians (or "heretics") in the Middle Ages were the Cathars, the Pure Ones of the Languedoc region in southern France. And they, in line with the Dragon tradition of the Ouroboros Ring Lords, referred to the Messianic Bloodline as the Elven Race. As we shall see, the terms "elf", "fairy", "pixie" and the like were all representative of various castes within the kingly succession.
The Ouroboros (as detailed in Genesis of the Grail Kings) was a symbol of wholeness, unity and eternity, usually identified by a serpent (in the form of a ring) clutching its own tail. With a cross positioned beneath the ring, the emblem becomes the familiar device of the female - the Venus symbol (as portrayed on the cover of Genesis of the Grail Kings). Alternatively, with a cross positioned above the ring, it becomes the masculine Orb of sovereign regalia. And with the cross positioned within the ring, it becomes emblematic of the Holy Grail itself - identified as the Dew Cup, or the Rosi-crucis.
In the Cathar language of old Provence, a female elf was an albi (elbe or ylbi), and Albi was the name given to the main Cathar centre in Languedoc. This was in deference to the matrilinear heritage of the Grail dynasty, for the Cathars were supporters of the original Albi-gens - the Elven Bloodline which had descended through the Dragon Queens of yore, such as Lilith, Miriam, Bathsheba and Mary Magdalene. It was for this reason that, when Simon de Montfort and the armies of Pope Innocent III descended upon the region in 1209, it was called the Albigensian Crusade. Through some 35 years, tens of thousands of innocent people were slaughtered in this brutal campaign - all because the inhabitants of the region were champions of the original concept of Grail kingship, as against the pseudo-style of monarchy which had been implemented by the papal machine.
In practical terms, Church kingship prevailed from the 8th century and it has continued through the ages to the present day. But the fact is that, under the strict terms of sovereign practice, all such monarchies and their affiliated governments have been illegitimate.
So, what is Church kingship? It is precisely that with which we have become so familiar. It applies to all monarchs who achieve their regnal positions as a result of Church coronation - by the Pope, or, in Britain, by the Archbishop of Canterbury. In terms of true kingship, there is no necessity for coronation because kingly and queenly inheritance are, and always were, "in the blood" - to be precise, in the mitochondrial DNA of the Sangréal.
In the old scheme of things, kingship was automatic because it was an alchemical inheritance which, in practice, had nothing to do with ruling over anyone or anywhere. By virtue of an illegal dictate, however, monarchies were brought under Church control and the magical Realm of the Ring Lords was supplanted by the material and territorial reigns of the papal kings.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:27:10 am
One might ask why this was allowed to happen. Why did no one stand up for the legacy of the Holy Grail? Well, the fact is, they did; the Cathars did, the Knights Templars did, the Rosicrucians did. Indeed, any number of gnostic groups and fraternities did, and it was this open support which led to the hideous tortures and executions of the papal Inquisitions and witch-hunts that persisted through so many generations.
By the Middle Ages, the Church controlled the majority of European monarchies (with Scotland a notable exception, as a result of which King Robert the Bruce and the whole Scottish nation were excommunicated). The Church, therefore, influenced governments, parliaments and educational establishments (as it still does today). And, by implication if not by direct instruction, the military forces of the pseudo-kings operated at Church command.
The Church held such enormous financial, political and military power that the Grail adherents became an "underground stream", living in fear of their lives at every turn. They were not only heretics: they were singled out for punishment as sorcerers and necromancers. And since they did not conform to papal dictates, they were clearly Satanists! The women, of course, were all whores, but this was nothing new; the Roman Church had forged this dogmatic classification at the time of its earliest constitution!
Before looking at some aspects of the Ring legacy, it is important to consider the original document which made Church kingship possible in the first place. In this context, I do not use the word "important" lightly, because the implementation of this particular document some 1,248 years ago led to just about every social injustice that has since been experienced in the Christian world. The document to which I refer is called "The Donation of Constantine". All monarchical and governmental practice has, for centuries, been based upon the initial precept of this charter but, as we shall see, the precept is wholly invalid.
There are those in our midst today who, under the dynastic rule of Grail entitlement, are rightful kings and queens. But many of the dynasties which have actually reigned have done so with little or no sovereign heritage. They have gained their positions simply because it suited the Church to crown them as its puppet representatives.
Moving forwards in history from the Pharaohs of Egypt, the Davidic Kings of Judah and the Dragon Kings of Scythia, we arrive in the Dark Ages with the Celtic kingdoms of Europe and, essentially for the purposes of this story, with the Fisher Kings in Gaul (which later became France).
It is because of this continuing period of Grail sovereignty in the Celtic realms that conventional history now refers to the "Dark Ages" - about which, we are told, there is so little documentary record. There is, however, any amount of surviving material from the era. The period is only "dark" because the Church and the imperial overlords decided to veil it from scrutiny, removing documentary evidence from the educational environment in order to perpetuate the myth that everyone and everything outside the Roman establishment was ignorant and barbaric.
As detailed in Bloodline of the Holy Grail, the Church of Rome (founded by Emperor Constantine the Great in the 4th century) had little to do with the Nazarene style of Christianity which it officially superseded and had hitherto persecuted. It was an entirely new, hybrid form of male-dominated "churchianity" based upon a contrived apostolic succession of popes.
The separate Nazarene movement (often called the Celtic Church) continued in opposition under the direction of Grail dynasts from the family of Jesus, and they were styled the Desposyni, meaning Heirs of the Lord.
At that time, the Bloodline houses of the Desposyni held the reins of Dragon kingship in Europe. But the bishops of the Roman Church sought to undermine this tradition, and eventually managed this in the 8th century when they deposed the Merovingian Fisher Kings of the Franks after some 300 years of regnal succession.
With the sudden, contrived demise of this Grail dynasty in 751, a new style of kingship was introduced in the West - kingship not by any right of succession, but by individual decree of the Pope - and it was this which led to much of the fairy tale and folklore which is so familiar today. The new style of papal kingship was made possible by the so-called "Donation of Constantine" which, although now known to have been forged, was not open to debate at the time.
When the Donation made its first appearance in the middle 8th century, it was alleged to have been written by Emperor Constantine 400 years earlier (although, strangely, never produced in the interim). It was even dated and carried his supposed signature. What the document proclaimed was that the Pope was Christ's elected representative on Earth, with the power to "create" kings as his subordinates. The provisions were put into operation by the Vatican in 751, whereupon the longstanding Merovingians were deposed and a whole new dynasty was supplemented by way of a family who had hitherto been mayors of the Royal Palace (the equivalent of prime ministers). They were dubbed "Carolingians", and their only king of any consequence (through some 236 years) was the legendary Charlemagne.
As a result of this strategy, the whole nature of monarchy changed from being an office of "guardianship" to one of "rule". Henceforth, the papal monarchs were territorial governors rather than patriarchs of the people. By virtue of this monumental change, the longstanding Grail Code of princely service was forsaken and European kings became servants of the Church - which had the power to make them or break them.
How do we know today that the Donation is a forgery? Well, there are many reasons, but the most obvious is that its New Testament references relate to the Latin Vulgate version of the Bible. This edition was translated and compiled by St Jerome who was not born until the year 340, some 26 years after Constantine (who died, anyway, in 337) supposedly signed the document! Indeed, there was more than half a century between Constantine's alleged signing and the appearance of the particular Latin Bible that was used in its content. Notwithstanding this, the language of the Donation was, in any event, that of the 8th century and bore no relation to the writing style of Constantine's day.
The truly ridiculous aspect of all this is that the Donation was proved to be a forgery some 550 years ago, during the Renaissance, but its overwhelming dictate, which cemented the Pope as the supreme spiritual and temporal head of Christendom, has prevailed regardless.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:27:41 am
As explained in Genesis of the Grail Kings, the monarchs of the Grail succession were called Messiahs (Anointed Ones) because, in the early days in Mesopotamia and Egypt, they were anointed with the fat of the sacred Messeh (the holy dragon or crocodile). By virtue of this, they were also called Dragons. The Dragon, emblematic of wisdom, was the epitome of the Holy Spirit which, according to the Book of Genesis, moved upon the waters of time, while the Grail was the perpetual Blood Royal - the Sangréal. Originally, in old Mesopotamia, it was called the Gra-al - the Sacred Blood of the Dragon Queens - and it was said to be the "nectar of supreme excellence". The ancient Greeks called it ambrosia.
The concept of fairies (the fair folk) was born directly from this base, being a derivative of "fey" and relating especially to "fate". In the Celtic world, certain royal families (especially those of the Pendragons, or Head Dragons) were said to carry the Fairy Blood - that is to say, the fate or destiny of the Grail Bloodline - while the Elf Maidens of the Albi-gens were the designated guardians of the Earth, starlight and forest.
But how was it that the dragons, fairies and elves of history became enveloped within a shroud of supernatural enigma? Why was it that their stories were moved from the world of reality into a domain of romance and nursery tale? What had all this to do with the Donation of Constantine?
To answer these questions, we must now step through the Portal of Enchantment into the Twilight Realm of the Shining Ones, for theirs is the enlightened Realm of the Ring Lords.
Three Rings for the Elven Kings under the sky.
Seven for the Dwarf Lords in their halls of stone.
Nine for Mortal Men doomed to die.
One for the Dark Lord on his dark throne,
In the Land of Mordor where the shadows lie.
One Ring to rule them all.
One Ring to find them.
One Ring to bring them all
And in the darkness bind them,
In the Land of Mordor where the shadows lie.
So it is cited by Gandalf the Wizard in Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings, one of the most popular tales of all time.
In essence, the contested ownership of the One Ring is little different to the enduring quest for the Holy Grail. Although presented from quite opposite standpoints, both are quests for the maintenance of sovereignty, but each has been misapplied at various stages of history by those who perceived the Ring and the Grail as power weapons. Hence, it was imperative (in the respective stories) that access to the Grail was protected by severe questions, just as it was essential to keep the One Ring from the evil Sauron of Mordor, who eventually lost his power when the Ring was destroyed in the fires of the Mount of Doom.
There is, however, an essential difference between Tolkien's One Ring, which is portrayed as dark and divisive, and the Golden Ring of Grail romance, which is a ring of love and enlightenment. The latter was further symbolised by the ring of iron-clad knights who sat at the Round Table - a ring that was broken (leading the land into chaos and waste) when Arthur forsook the Celtic Code in favour of the Roman persuasion (or, as the later Christianised version of the story differently explains, when Guinevere was unfaithful to Arthur with Lancelot).
It has been said on occasions that the great genius of 19th-century composer Richard Wagner was that he recognised the Ring saga as a version of the Grail Quest. However, if anything, the reverse is true. What he recognised was that the popular Holy Grail legends were, in fact, stylised retellings of the more traditional Ring Quest.
Both Richard Wagner and Alfred, Lord Tennyson (in his Arthurian writings) understood that the Grail Quest was a spiritual aspect of the Ring Quest, but that in essence they were alike, if not the same. What they also recognised was the fact that both the Ring and the Grail could bring disaster, though by different means. The power of the Ring had to be withstood, otherwise it would enslave its master, whereas the power of the Grail would retaliate with vengeance if misused. Either way, the moral is the same in that, ultimately, power is self-destructive when achieved through selling one's soul. Hence, the Ouroboros Ring can be a halo or a crown, but it can equally become a noose.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:28:23 am
Adolf Hitler's fanatical obsession with finding the Hallows of Grail Castle was a prime example of this misconceived notion of power. In his search for the Hallows, he obtained an ancient lance (said to have been used by Charlemagne) which he insisted was the Longinus spear that pierced the side of Jesus at the Crucifixion. This, he reckoned, was the sacred Spear of Destiny, so revered in Grail lore. With this in his possession, Hitler was confident that his empire would be as strong as that of Charlemagne. But legend had it that, after many great victories, Charlemagne was doomed to defeat from the moment he lost the magical weapon. And so it was that on 30 April 1945 - the very day when the American 7th Army, under General Patton, seized the lance from Nuremberg Castle - Adolf Hitler accepted his defeat and [apparently] shot himself.
Whether applied in fact or fantasy, the concept of the Ring and the Grail was such that it inspired hope for the social and natural environments. The Grail Hallows (the Sword, Chalice, Ouroboros and Spear) were traditionally regarded as tools of princely service but, when presumed to be weapons of power, they would always, one way or another, destroy the wielder from within. These Hallows were represented in the four suits of the Tarot's Minor Arcana as the Swords, Cups, Pentacles and Wands - subsequently to become the Spades, Hearts, Diamonds and Clubs that we know today.
Throughout the best part of this millennium, no organisation has misused the Grail Chalice symbolism to greater effect than the Christian Church establishment. From the earliest times, the Rosi-crucis (the chalice and wine of the Grail sacrament) was a prerogative of the Albi-gens, being emblematic of the Blood Royal in the womb of the Dragon Queen. However, the Church has long misappropriated this aspect of the Hallows ceremony to become its Eucharistic power-weapon, supposedly to bind its followers into communion with ecclesiastical dogma. But, as time goes by, this very power is being seen to subside as the congregations diminish in the quest for greater truths and more substantial enlightenment from legitimate sources.
In William Shakespeare's A Midsummer Night's Dream, the Queen of the Fairies is Titania, whose name represents the pre-Olympian god-race of the Titans. In particular, she is the Moon Goddess Diana. Their king, Oberon, however, had an historical base, being inspired by an ancestor of Shakespeare's colleague Edward de Vere, 17th Earl of Oxford. He was a founding member of Elizabeth Tudor's 16th-century Court Poetry and Magic Syndicate - along with Francis Bacon, John Dee, Edmund Spenser and others of the Rosicrucian "underground stream" who aided and guided much of Shakespeare's work.
Edward de Vere was, at that time, Lord Chancellor of England - as had been many generations of his forebears, including Albrey, the 12th-century Prince of Anjou and Guisnes, whose titular name, Albe-Righ, meant Elf King. What the Syndicate knew full well, despite their loyalty to Elizabeth, was that the House of Tudor had no prior right to the English throne, having simply taken it, by might of the sword, from the preceding House of Plantagenet.
That apart, the Plantagenets themselves were a junior branch of the House of Anjou, whose senior branch was the House of Vere. Indeed, in 1861, the noted royal historian Baron Thomas Babington Macaulay described the Veres as "the longest and most illustrious line of nobles that England has ever seen". Their ancestry was jointly Pictish and Merovingian, descending from the ancient Grail House of Scythia. Here was a true kingly line of the Elven Race, and it was for this reason that Oberon (a variant of Aubrey/Albrey, the historical Elf King) became Shakespeare's King of the Fairies. Such was the translatory nature of all Rosicrucian symbology, whether portrayed in stories, artwork, watermarks or the Tarot.
Some time earlier, in 1408, Edward de Vere's ancestor, Richard (Lord Chamberlain and 11th Earl of Oxford), had been invested as a Knight of the Garter by King Henry IV at Windsor Castle. Also invested at the same time was King Sigismund of Hungary, who had revived the ancient Egyptian Order of the Dragon - within which Richard de Vere held the hereditary distinction of Lord Draconis.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:28:46 am
One way or another, the nursery tales which emanated from the "underground stream" were stories of lost brides and usurped kingship - based upon the subjugation of the Grail Bloodline by the Church of Rome and, in later times, by the sectarian Puritans of the Protestant movement. The Catholics had their Dominican Grand Inquisitor, Tomâs de Torquemada, and the Puritans had their equivalent in Matthew Hopkins, the Witchfinder-General. Favoured executions, in each case, were hanging, drowning or burning at the stake, and the common command was: "Kill them all - God will know his own!"
The fairy tale concept was essentially geared to stories relating to these persecutions: allegorical accounts of the predicament of the true Royal Family - the Ring Lords of the Sangréal, whose fairies and elves (having been manoeuvred from the mortal plane of orthodoxy and status quo) were confined to a seemingly Otherworld existence.
They were tales of Grail Princes who were turned into frogs, of Swan Knights who roamed the wasteland, and of Dragon Princesses locked in towers or put to sleep for hundreds of years. In the course of their persecution, the Elf Maidens were pricked with bodkins, fed with poisoned apples or condemned to servitude - while their champions swam great lakes, battled through thickets and scaled mighty towers to secure and protect the matrilinear heritage of the Albi-gens. They include such well-known stories as Sleeping Beauty, Cinderella, Snow White and Rapunzel.
In all cases, the underlying theme is the same, with the Bloodline Princess kept (through drugging, imprisonment or some form of restraint) out of reach of the Grail Prince who has to find and release her in order to preserve the dynasty and perpetuate the line. For the most part, the establishment of the "Mother Church" was symbolised by a malevolent stepmother, an evil witch or some other jealous female with an opposing vested interest. Always, the stories are reminiscent of the Lost Bride of the King in the Old Testament's Song of Solomon. Their content also embodies the forlorn aspect of Mary Magdalene, the bride of Jesus, whose royal heritage and maternal legacy were so thoroughly undermined by the Christian bishops.
An interesting feature of many classic fairy tales is that they truly are very old stories. Take Cinderella, for example. If asked who wrote Cinderella, many people would answer that it was the Brothers Grimm, while others would say it was Charles Perrault. However, these men were not actually writers of fairy tales, as is commonly thought. They were collectors, compilers and interpreters of the tales. The story of Cinderella can be traced back to the Carolingian era, with its first known version appearing in the year 850. Perrault published his well-known edition in 1697 in France, while Jacob and Wilhelm Grimm produced their German version in 1812.
Over the years, many people have likened Tolkien's wizard, Gandalf, to Merlin of the Arthurian tales. At the same time, Tolkien's Aragorn has been likened to King Arthur but, as Tolkien himself pointed out, there is really a closer similarity between Aragorn and the historical Charlemagne.
The challenge which faced Charlemagne, who had been charged by the Church to establish a viable Empire from various disunited kingdoms, was not unlike that which confronted Aragorn, who reunited the divided kingdoms of Middle Earth. But there was a marked difference in practice, for Aragorn was far more like Arthur in having an advisory wizard, whereas Charlemagne did not because the Church would not consent to counsellors outside its own appointees.
Aragorn's was therefore more of a Celtic-style environment, with the enemy being the evil Sauron. Charlemagne, on the other hand, was a champion of the Roman Church whose adversaries were the supporters of the unlawfully ousted Merovingian establishment - an establishment to which Aragorn would personally have been well suited.
In the event, it became essential for the Church to settle some form of Ring entitlement upon Charlemagne so that he was perceived to conform to the Dragon tradition. And so a suitable tale was invented to the effect that a serpent appeared at his court with a golden ring in its mouth - an enchanted ring that compelled him to love whoever's finger it was on.
At this stage, it is of interest to note that a newly proposed three-film series of Tolkien's The Lord of the Rings is currently in its early stages of development. After some 18 months of negotiation with the American film company Newline Cinema, the $260-million contract has been acquired by New Zealand film-maker Peter Jackson.
Various parts of New Zealand will apparently make ideal Middle Earth locations for the project, and it is hoped that the first film (based upon Book I of Tolkien's 1950s trilogy) will be released within the next couple of years. This film, The Fellowship of the Ring, will subsequently be followed by The Two Towers and The Return of the King.
With a speaking cast of about sixty and many thousands of extras, it has recently been rumoured that one of the key roles, that of Gandalf, is hotly tipped for Sean Connery. Given that The Lord of the Rings has been voted "the most popular book of the century", and with stars of this calibre, we could well be looking at one of the first mammoth box-office attractions of the new millennium.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:29:04 am
The composer Richard Wagner's personal association with Grail lore and, of course, his own famous Ring Cycle are well known. It is therefore very appropriate that one of the present hopeful contenders for The Lord of the Rings film score is Richard Wagner's own descendant, Adrian Wagner, who is now in touch with the film company in this regard.
When Bloodline of the Holy Grail was released, I was heartened to learn that the Wagner Grail tradition of Lohengrin and Parsifal was still very much to the fore. At that time, in parallel with my book, Adrian Wagner released an album called The Holy Spirit and the Holy Grail. Now, as a companion to my latest work, he has composed the compelling musical suite, Genesis of the Grail Kings. [See Audio Reviews, this issue. Ed.]
One apparent fact about Tolkien's elven folk is that, unlike the cute little elves of many children's tales, these characters are actually larger and more powerful than average mortals. They are also endowed with greater powers of wisdom, they ride magical horses and closely resemble the ancient Irish king-tribe of the Tuatha Dé Danann. In this regard, Tolkien was quite accurate with his assessment of the original Ring Lords of the Albi-gens who, in the far distant years BC, were called the Lords of the Sidhé (pronounced "shee").
The Sidhé was a transcendent intellect, known to the Druids as the Web of the Wise, while "druid" (druidhe) was itself a Celtic word for "witch" - an English form of the Saxon verb wicca, meaning "to bend" or "to yield" (as indeed do willow and wicker).
The Tuatha Dé Danann (or Dragon Lords of Anu) were masters of the transcendent Sidhé, and were duly classified as "fates" or "fairies". Before settling in Ireland (from about 800 BC), they were the world's most noble race, alongside the early Kings of Egypt, being the Black Sea Princes of Scythia (now Ukraine). Like the original dynastic Pharaohs, they traced their descent from the great Pendragons of Mesopotamia; and from them sprang the kingly lines of the Irish Bruithnigh and the Picts of Scotland's Caledonia. In Wales they founded the Royal House of Gwynedd, while in Cornwall in the southwest of England, they were the sacred gentry known as the Pict-sidhé - from which derives the term "pixie".
So, from a single caste of the original Blood Royal - whether known as the Sangréal, the Albi-gens or the Ring Lords - we discover many of the descriptive terms which sit at the very heart of popular folklore. For here, in this one noble race, we have the "elves", "fairies" and "pixies" - not beguiling little folk, but distinguished Kings and Queens of the Dragon succession.
One of the most important Scythian words was uper, which meant "over" or "above" - a word that we still use in today's English in such definitions as "superintendent" or "supervisor". In titular form, a Scythian Uper was an Overseer or, more importantly, an Overlord - the equivalent of a Pendragon. Later, in the Hungarian and Romanian regions, the word gained the variant form, Oupire.
Until the mediaeval fabrications of the Christian Church, there was nothing remotely sinister or supernatural about the definition of Oupire, but this was eventually destined to change when the witch-hunts began, for the priestly/kingly Oupires were, in the eyes of Rome, the equivalent of Magian Druids. They were therefore witches, and the Sidhé definition (Web of the Wise) became newly dubbed as "the Web of the Weird".
In the main, outside the Celtic regions of Britain, the traditional Oupires had been apparent in the Balkan and Carpathian regions of Europe, having prevailed from Transylvania to the Black Sea in ancient times. They were therefore not only associated with witches but with Gypsies. The Church bishops and Inquisitional friars suspected them of being the ultimate rulers of the Land of Elphane - the twilight realm of fairy gold, magic springs and the abiding lore of the Greenwood, all of which were anathema to the Church. They were said to be wandering people of the night, who consorted with evil spirits. At that stage, a new word was born into the language of Christian Europe. The word, a straightforward corruption of Oupire, was "vampire".
In addition to vampires, another classification was soon to enter the Inquisitional vocabulary as the Dominican Black Friars and the Franciscan Grey Friars compiled their lists of undesirables. They had now moved beyond the realm of ordinary heretics and pagans, for alongside their fabricated vampire myth they conjured another form of shapeshifting phenomenon: the werewolf.
Quite suddenly, there appeared to be no end to the fantastic creatures that were reckoned to stalk the streets and forests in search of unsuspecting victims. But the beauty of all this was that it had the effect of making people lean more heavily upon the Church - the only perceived route to salvation. These vampires and werewolves, it was said, could not be killed by conventional means. Even God was out of the picture, for only the power of Jesus Christ (the Saviour of humankind) could defeat these diabolical beings. They were portrayed as devils, demons and emissaries of Satan, who had to be exorcised and destroyed by the monks and clerics. And so the Church was in business with a whole new genre of scary folklore to counter the Grail Quest legends and esoteric artwork of the "underground stream".
On the one hand, there were the Albigensian tales of Swan Princes, Dragon Queens and Elf Maidens, comprising the lore of the forgotten Bloodline and the Lost Bride, wherein knights and chivalric champions battled against all odds to preserve the sacred heritage of the Holy Grail. In these stories, there were wizards of the Druidic school and wise hermits to guide the knights upon their journeys and missions. But nowhere in these tales of enchantment did a gallant priest or bishop ever ride to the aid of a damsel in distress, for the Church was, in practice, the adversary.

What the bishops did, however, at the 1545 Council of Trento in northern Italy, was they formally blacklisted and outlawed the prophecies of Merlin, withdrawing all related material from the public domain. Eventually, in order to weigh the literary balance in the Church's favour, a new breed of writing was born, and it came into its own as Gothic Romance.
The premise behind these tales was not so much about saving victims, but rather more about destroying the enemies of contrived "churchianity" - with crucifixes galore and gallons of holy water being the essential weapons in the dreaded undertaking against the sinister "evil ones".
Then, in time, the Christian movement had a wonderful idea for its own Merlin competitor: not a wizard as such, but an early Church bishop with canonised status. But, what a very strange choice they made!
Back in AD 325, one of the characters at Emperor Constantine's Council of Nicaea was a certain Nicholas, Bishop of Myra. At this Church conference the bishops were debating the nature of the Holy Trinity and of how Jesus was not simply the Son of God but was also God incarnate. The ageing Libyan priest, Arius of Alexandria, was not at all happy about this new concept and decided to make his feelings known. But when he rose to speak, Nicholas of Myra immediately punched him in the face!
This, of course, brought the debate firmly back onto the required track - subsequent to which, the violent protagonist was rewarded for his effort and duly became Saint Nicholas. This titular name was later corrupted in parts of Europe to become Sinterklaas or Sintniklaus, and then, in the English-speaking countries, to Santa Claus. Now, by virtue of a good deal of strategic propaganda, he is lovingly revered by children as the jolly, gift-bearing Father Christmas - a far cry from the original vindictive bishop of historical record.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:29:31 am
Within the Celtic Church of the Dark Ages (in the days of Taliesin and the Merlin seers to the kings), there had been some very prominent adepts of the old wisdom: abbots and culdees such as St David, St Patrick and St Columba, all of whom were denounced in their day by the Roman Church for their so-called wizardry and pagan beliefs. Even the later papal establishment regarded them all as necromancers and sorcerers, but this is not the way things are currently portrayed. Although the Merlin prophecies were expressly banned by the Council of Trento, the teachings of David, Patrick and Columba were so firmly cemented in society that the Church pursued a different strategy of incorporation.
A thousand years after the lifetimes of these Druidic Magi, the Vatican elected to bring them into the orthodox saintly fold so that the real truth of their Celtic environment would be overshadowed. Then, only a couple of years ago, the British Post Office and the Anglican Church joined forces to promote the gentle St Columba of the Celts alongside his bitter Catholic rival, St Augustine of Rome, who came to England with an express papal brief to destroy the Columban movement immediately after Columba's death in 597. Notwithstanding this historical fact, however, the anniversary postage stamps and substantially hyped propagandist material of 1997 portrayed these two arch-enemies as if they had been blood brothers in a common cause - proving beyond doubt that new myths of "churchianity" are still being created to this day.
With regard to the werewolves, who were said to manifest at the height of the full moon, the definition of were is, quite simply, "man" (hence, "werewolf" is "man-wolf"), but it comes rather more precisely from an ancient High Druidic caste of Wood Lords (called Weres or Wallans). Their totem animal was the wolf - just as other tribes were represented by, say, a boar or a horse. These totems were really no more than the early predecessors of heraldry, whereby families became identified by the animals, plants, shells and other devices on their banners.
Historically, the Wallans became very influential, founding great kingly dynasties in Ireland, Wales and England. The great Cadwallan of Wales was of this Druidic race, as was King Casswallan, the intrepid son of Beli Mawr - the greatest of all the sovereign Wood Lords in about 100 BC.
Other totems, of course, were the various god and goddess representations, and it is especially relevant that one of these still holds a prime British national position today, having persisted though the centuries from the early culture of the Wood Lords.
The original Wallans were apparent in Mesopotamia around 3,800 years ago, in about 1800 BC. They were called the Yulannu, which meant, quite simply, Wood Lords. Indeed, it was from their culture that the original Yule tradition derived, subsequently making its way across Europe to Scandinavia.
The venerated Goddess of the Yulannu was Barat An-na (Great Mother of the Fire-stone). The Sumerians called her Antu. She was the wife of the god Anu, and the mother of Enki. In later times, she was identified with Diana of Ephesus (Diana of the Nine Fires). The cult of Barat An-na spread across Syria into the Phoenician kingdom, where they began to portray her on their coins. In these representations, she sat by the seashore with a torch of fire, and at her side was a round shield bearing the cross of the Rosi-crucis.
Along with the Wallan Druids, the culture of Barat An-na was brought to the British islands, where her name became compacted to Bratanna. And in those islands, her image persisted to the extent that she became the great tribal goddess - a goddess who, despite all the emergent centuries of Christianity, has prevailed to this very day. Her image on the coins has barely altered, except that her flaming torch became a lighthouse, and the Rosi-crucis cross of her shield was amended to become the Union Jack. But, after all this time, she is still the Mother Goddess of the land, the Lady of the Fire-stone: Britannia.
Earlier, I mentioned the mighty King Casswallan who reigned in Britain at about the time of King Herod the Great. By virtue of being the son of the great Beli Mawr, he was not only a Wood Lord but was also a Ring Lord of the Cassi; hence, he was Cassi-Wallan or Casswallan.
The Cassi tribes were also from Mesopotamia, prior to which (having previously settled in the northern Zargos Mountains along with the Yulannu) they were Carpathian princes of the Sidhé. They were, in fact, of the Tuatha Dé Danann Fairy strain. They reigned in regional Mesopotamia from the 18th century BC and, from about 1600 BC, they governed all Babylonia for another 500 years.
This particular race developed one of the oldest Ring cultures in history and, in ancient Ireland, they were the sacred race of the god-men: the Vere-Bolg. The greatest of their Ring shrines still exists, known as Newgrange today - originally a sacred royal seat identified as a Rath. These shrines ("fairy rings") were called the Creachaire (temple-tombs), and they housed the Raths which were turf-covered mound dwellings constructed upon a framework of poles. In later times, they were called Tepes (pronounced "tepesh") - from which derived the American Indian tepee - and they were reckoned to be Portals to the Netherworld, the sacred domain of ancestral souls.
It is from this mound-dwelling practice that the tribal name of the Cassi Kings evolved, for a Cassi was a Place of Wood. They were the seats of the Portal Guardians: the Oupires, the Ring Lords of the Sidhé, who, as we saw earlier, were later dubbed "vampires".
One of history's best known Grail Fairies was Princess Melusine, daughter of the Pictish King, Elinas of Alba - a descendant of the 2nd-century King Vere of Caledonia, Lord of the Dragon. In the year 733, Melusine (maintaining the family heritage) married Rainfroi de Vere, Prince of Anjou, and among their offspring was Count Maelo, the commander of Emperor Charlemagne's army. From Maelo's own marriage to Charlemagne's sister sprang the Vere Counts of Guisnes who, as previously mentioned, were the reputed Elf Kings and became England's Great Chamberlains and Earls of Oxford.
In the Arthurian and Magdalene traditions of the Ladies of the Lake (as discussed in Bloodline of the Holy Grail), Melusine was a "fountain fey" - an enchantress of the Underwood. Her fountain at Verrières en Forez was called Lusina (meaning "Light-bringer"), from which derived the name of the Royal House of Lusignan - the Crusader Kings of Jerusalem. The Fount of Melusine was said to be located deep within a thicket wood in Anjou, and Melusine was often depicted as a mermaid - as she is still beguilingly portrayed in an old painting at Count Dracula's Bran Castle in Romania.
In the 12th-century, Melusine's descendant, Robert de Vere, 3rd Earl of Oxford and legal pretender to the Earldom of Huntingdon, was appointed as King Richard I's Steward of the forest lands of Fitzooth. As Lord of the Greenwood and titular Herne of the Wild Hunt, he was a popular people's champion of the Sidhé heritage - as a result of which he was outlawed for taking up arms against King John. It was he who, subsequently styled Robin Fitzooth, became the prototype for the popular tales of Robin Hood.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:29:49 am
Of all the monarchs who ever sat upon the throne of England, the Tudor Queen, Elizabeth I, was by far the most in tune with ancient cultures and wood lore. She was even called the Faerie Queene and, before being formally crowned, she was installed by the people as their Queen of the Greenwood. This was an ancient ritual of the Shining Ones - the Elven Race of the Albi-gens. The ceremony was conducted in the mist of early dawn in the depths of Windsor Forest and, to facilitate the installation, the customary Robin Hood legacy of the House of Vere was brought into play.
At that time, the Queen's Lord Chamberlain was Edward de Vere of Loxley, 17th Earl of Oxford, and it was his office to invest Elizabeth by first deposing the Caille Daouine. This was the traditional King of the Forest (whose name had given rise to Scotland's Pictish realm of Caledonia) - the mighty Stag of the Seven Tines, upon whose back Lord Vere rode into the ceremonial clearing.
Edward de Vere of Oxford was a friend and student of the Rosicrucian alchemist and Secret Service operative John Dee, and he worked closely with the statesman and philosopher Francis Bacon (later Viscount St Albans). Between them (along with others) they comprised the Royal Court Syndicate which was responsible for providing much of the material for the works of their playwright colleague, William Shakespeare.
As mentioned in connection with Melusine, fountains, springs and water in general were always associated with the Ring Lord female line. This stems from the very earliest times of the Anunnaki, whose founding mother (as explained in ancient Mesopotamian literature) was Tiâmat, the Sea-dragon. In later times, these queens were commonly represented as mermaids (mere maids), and were often called Ladies of the Lake. This was a style granted to Mary Magdalene when she had settled in Provence from AD 44.
While the male descendants of Mary Magdalene and Jesus became the noted Fisher Kings in Gaul, the female line retained its Dragon Queen status, in a quite separate dynasty, as the matriarchal Queens of Avallon in Burgundy. They were known as the House del Acqs (the House of the Waters), and among their number was the great 6th-century Queen Viviane, revered as the Lady of the Lake in Arthurian romance. This heritage was so important to the Celtic Church that, when King Kenneth MacAlpin united the Scots and Picts in 844, his extant installation document made special mention of his descent from the Queens of Avallon.
The true significance of King Arthur was his immediate joint descent in both the male and female lines of the Albi-gens. His father was King Aedàn of Dalriada, the Pendragon of Britain in the year 559 and a descendant of the Wood Lord Beli Mawr. His mother was Ygerna del Acqs, the daughter of Queen Viviane, whose grandson (by Ygerna's sister, Viviane II) was the legendary Lancelot del Acqs. Ygerna (sometimes called Igraine in the Grail tradition) was the High Queen of the Celtic kingdoms, and her daughter Morgaine (by her first husband, Gwyr Llew of Carlisle) was High Priestess of the Sisters of Avallon.
Over the years, there have been any number of speculations concerning the historical Arthur, but these are mainly fronted by tourist establishments endeavouring to claim the Arthurian heritage for their particular parts of England or Wales. The fact is, however, that (in line with the traditional accounts) there was only ever one High King of Britain called Arthur. There was only ever one Arthur born as the son of a Pendragon. There was only ever one Arthur whose mother was Igraine of Avallon and whose grandmother was the recognised Lady of the Lake. There was only ever one Arthur with a son named Modred, and there was only ever one Arthur with a sister called Morgaine (or Morganna as some of the stories refer to her).
In this regard, the old annals of Scotland and Ireland, along with the records of the Celtic Church, are unanimous in identifying Arthur mac Aedàn of Dalriada. He was invested as Sovereign Commander and High King in the year 575 by the Druid, Merlin Emrys, and his primary seat was at Carlisle in the north of England, from where he controlled the military defence of the English-Scottish border country.

Returning to the Raths (or royal mound-dwellings), we should perhaps consider the fact that, as mentioned, these Portals to the Netherworld were called Tepes - for this was the very style afforded to one of the most enigmatic of all Gothic figures: Count Dracula. Historically, and quite outside the Christian propagandist mythology which surrounds the vampire character of Bram Stoker's famous novel, Dracula was Prince Vlad III of Wallachia, who is often referred to as Vlad Tepes.
Since the word tepes relates to "wooden poles", it is often thought that Vlad's descriptive nickname relates to his individual method of executing enemies of the State by impaling them upon wooden stakes. Hence, Vlad Tepes is sometimes said to mean "Vlad the Impaler". This, however, is completely untrue. He was called Tepes (as were many other Druidic elders before him) because, within the ancient Ring Lord culture of the Sidhé, he was an appointed Creachaire Portal Guardian.
Vlad Tepes, a 15th-century Prince in Romania, founded the capital city of Bucharest. His popularised name, Dracula, means "Son of Dracul", and Dracul (or Dragon) was a style by which his father was known within the Grail fraternity of the Ordo Draconis (The Imperial Court of the Dragon) from 1431.
During this past century, ever since the 1897 novel, Dracula, was published, Vlad has become an archetype of the Church-promoted Gothic tradition. However, the establishment's real fear of Dracula was not his harsh treatment of enemies, as is so often cited, nor that he was a blood-sucking vampire in the Stoker tradition. What they feared was his in-depth knowledge of alchemy and the fact that he was truly an operative Oupire - a venerated Overlord of the Rath, a Portal Guardian in the ancient Yulannu manner of the Ring Lords.
Those of you who have read Bloodline of the Holy Grail, or maybe even Genesis of the Grail Kings, will be familiar with the terracotta portrayal of the Sumerian goddess, Lilith, from around 2000 BC. In this depiction (as in those of other Anunnaki hierarchy) Lilith is seen to be holding the Rod and Ring of Divinely Measured Justice. The Rod was actually an instrument of measure, and in some portrayals it is very clearly marked in calculable units (like a modern ruler). By Babylonian times, it was referred to as the Rule, and the one who held the Rule was the Ruler - which is from where our governmental term derives.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:30:36 am
The Ring (as mentioned at the beginning of this talk) was a symbol of wholeness, unity and eternity. It represented a continuance of Divine Justice - a justice that was measured by the Rod (or Rule). Hence, the Ring was the ultimate insignia of the Anunnaki Overlords - the enigmatic Oupires who were responsible for the establishment of municipal government and kingly practice - for they were the progenitors of civilisation from about 4000 BC.
In view of this, it is of particular interest to note that Tolkien, when asked about the Middle Earth environment of his book, The Lord of the Rings, answered that he perceived its setting to relate to somewhere around 4000 BC. "The cauldron has always been boiling," he said. "We simply add new ingredients to the soup." In this respect, his popular tale, although enthralling, was not actually new in concept. From the earliest of European times, the Saxon god, Wotan (or Odin, the equivalent of the Sumerian Anu), was said to have ruled the world with eight rings, having one more, the ninth ring (the One Ring), to govern the others.
During the mediaeval days of the Church's persecution of heretics and, indeed, through the Middle Ages and beyond, all manner of Grail-related subject matter fell prey to the wrath of the bishops and friars. Unsuspecting victims were accused of any number of apparently unsavoury practices, and any association with the Ring culture was proscribed. Indeed, when Joan of Arc was accused of witchcraft, one of the charges laid against her by the bishops was that she used magical rings for enchantment and curative purposes. As a result, she was burnt at the stake in 1431. But, in 1920, the Church reconsidered her case and she was pardoned and canonised!
As detailed in Bloodline of the Holy Grail, not only were proscriptions levelled against the writings of Merlin - with a good deal of other literature confined to the supposedly "lost" coffers of the Dark Ages - but pictorial art also came under close scrutiny and many new rules were made. One of these was that the Virgin Mary could only be portrayed wearing blue and white (just as she is commonly depicted today). The reason for this was that other colours, especially the red of the cardinals, might have implied that she held some form of ecclesiastical office within a Church that afforded no clerical status to women.

What is not so commonly known is that the Church's regulations also applied to music - in particular, ancient music which could be traced to cultures other than that of Rome, Greece or Lydia. It is by virtue of these implemented regulations that so many of today's reference books determine that, for the most part, music evolved either from Greece or from various parts of the Roman Empire.
It is precisely the same with the English language, which is largely, but quite erroneously, said to derive from Greek and Latin. To cement this notion very firmly into our culture, we are taught from the classical literature of Homer and Virgil; but what is always forgotten is that both the Greek and Roman languages themselves evolved from other, far older, sources. Much of the language of Europe, including the English language, can be traced back into Phoenicia, Syria, Egypt, India and Mesopotamia, with many of the word stems being thousands of years old.
In the world of music, we have the very same scenario and, by virtue of discoveries made in the past few decades, there is no doubt that structured and sequenced music played a major role way back in the days of the Babylonian kingdoms and beyond. Silver pipes, bells and drums, along with beautifully ornamented harps and lyres, have all been unearthed in ancient Sumer from graves dating back five or six thousand years, and it is known that lutes were also used.
Buried along with kings and queens of the Dragon succession, these finely produced instruments were clearly ceremonial and would appear to have been used in ancient Star Fire and Fire-stone rituals, as described in Genesis of the Grail Kings. The Fire-stone ritual (the ritual of the goddess Antu, or Barat An-na) was largely a levitation ceremony conducted with the monatomic, superconductive element of the Highward Fire-stone (the white powder of gold).
Even in modern times, music has been used to perform levitational feats - notably in Tibet, where prohibitively large stone blocks have been lifted and positioned high in the mountains by using anti-gravitational sound frequencies. The ritual involves nineteen musicians and, behind them, 200 monks, radiating outwards in lines (in groups of five) at five-degree intervals, facing towards a mountain cave. The musicians use thirteen barrel-drums of variant sizes (weighing up to 150 kilograms apiece), suspended from wooden frames and directed towards a bowl-shaped cavity in which the required boulder is placed, between the musicians and the cave. Also, there are six long trumpets positioned at intervals between the drummers. On command, the trumpets and drums begin, with the monks at the rear providing a baffle whilst chanting. The time span before levitation of the stone occurs is four minutes and, in this manner, stones have been lifted some 400 metres, to be lowered into their necessary mountain temple positions.
Having made an intensive study of the intricacies of this ancient procedure, Adrian Wagner has recreated a musical enactment in "The Phoenix and the Fire-stone" track of the Genesis of the Grail Kings album - strategically breaking the sequence with a Golden Mean partition and concluding immediately before the four-minute deadline. Locked within this are frequencies that are so low as to be inaudible to conscious awareness, but which resonate directly with the frequency of the pineal gland. This, as many of you will know, is the gland responsible for heightened states of awareness and perception.
Also included within the Genesis album are aspects of musical harmonics which were banned by the Vatican in the Middle Ages, subsequent to their use by the Knights Templars and Cistercian monks in the construction of their Magdalene-dedicated Notre Dame cathedrals, which are noted for their architectural defiance of gravitational theory. The knights of this particular branch of the Templars (constituted by King Baldwin of Jerusalem in 1118) were called the Guardian Princes of the Royal Secret.
One of these musical sequences is the most famous of all: a tritone dubbed by the Church as "the Devil's interval". This is a direct extraction from the discovered harmonic scales of ancient Mesopotamian deities, which include the Enki scale, Enlil scale, Anu scale, Marduk scale, Kingu scale, Inanna scale and others.
No composer has done so much to preserve the legacy of Ring lore as Adrian's great-great-grandfather, Richard Wagner. His renowned 16-hour, four-part Nibelungen Ring Cycle - The Rhinegold, The Valkyrie, Siegfried and Götterdämmerung (Twilight of the Gods) - was largely drawn from Burgundian folklore, but derived ultimately from the very old Norse mythology of the Volsunga Saga.
The Ring's ultimately key character is the warrior Siegfried who, while under the spell of a potion, betrays the woman he loves - a goddess-turned-mortal called Brunhilde, who then masterminds his death. Subsequently, however, she realises her error and throws herself upon Siegfried's funeral pyre to be with him in eternity. The magical Ring that Siegfried gave to Brunhilde is retrieved from the ashes by the Rhinemaidens, the rightful Water Guardians of the Gold. And, by virtue of this, along with Brunhilde's self-sacrifice, a hitherto curse (placed upon the Ring by Alberic the Nibelung, Dwarf Lord of the Underworld) is lifted.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:30:52 am
The Ring had originally been stolen from the Rhinemaidens by the Nibelung, who lost it to Brunhilde's father, the sky-god Wotan. Then Siegfried won it by killing a dragon. But, upon the final cleansing of the Ring by the Rhinemaidens, Wotan perishes, together with his dream kingdom of Valhalla. With the Ring now back in its rightful hands, the world is redeemed and the Cycle is complete.
And so, once again the traditional Ring lore is apparent, just as in Tolkien and the Grail stories, for the Ring is finally seen to destroy those who hold it without the right of affinity. The golden Ring itself (forged from the enchanted flat-stone of the Rhinegold) had the power to afford its master the lordship of all the world, but only at the cost of forsaking love and selling his soul to the Ring's awesome power.

In terms of the straightforward Messianic line of King David and Jesus, the most powerful of the Ring Lords was King Solomon, who, in the Hebrew Talmud, was said to be the mightiest magician of the age. His great wisdom and considered judgement as a sorcerer-king were directly attributed to his ownership of an enchanted ring, and the legend of King Solomon's Ring was clearly a major inspiration for Tolkien.
In the same manner as Solomon, Tolkien's Ring Lord, Sauron, used his One Ring to command all the demons of the Earth. Solomon used the demons to build a Temple of Jerusalem, whilst Sauron used them to build the Tower of Mordor. The rings were also similar (as is usual in the tradition), in that each had the power to corrupt and destroy its master. Solomon's Ring achieves his downfall through the agency of the demon Asmodaeus, whereas Sauron is, in effect, his own destructive demon.
Along with the rings, there are also story similarities concerning the possession of light-radiating jewels, with Solomon's being the Schamir and the Elf King Thingol's being the Silmaril - each of which is said to be an heirloom of the respective King's race.
By virtue of such Jewish writings, the Dominican wrath of the Spanish Inquisition (from about 1480) was largely directed against the Jews, especially those connected with Kabbalistic studies, and it was really as a direct result of this persecution that the witch-hunts began.
Prior to that, the Roman Inquisition had been more concerned with heterodox Christians: those heretics who were Christians of one sort or another (Arians, Nestorians, Nazarenes, or whatever), but were not members of the Roman Church, and whose culture revolved, to some extent, around traditions of magic and alchemy that were outside Church control. But, here were the Jews putting forward their own versions of the old lore - particularly those Jews in the Narbonne region of the Spanish Marches, where the House of David had once been given privileged rights of princely independence by Emperor Charlemagne.
It was recognised, therefore, that the net should be cast over a wider arena, so as to take account of those of completely different persuasions. It was no longer a matter of the Church simply endeavouring to clean up the Christian house. What of the Jews? What of the Muslims? What of the pagans in general?
And so, from the late 15th century, the Inquisition began a thorough process of "ethnic cleansing". No one who was other than a full-blooded and obvious Catholic was safe. But, there had to be some new form of classification to pull all the prey into the ever-expanding net. The Grand Inquisitor at the time was the brutal Tomâs de Torquemada, Senior Confessor to Ferdinand II and Queen Isabella of Spain. Under his direction, the answer was found and, very soon, the friars had set their sights upon "the most diabolical heathens who ever conspired to overthrow the Roman Church".
In 1484, two Dominicans, Heinrich Kramer and James Sprenger, published a book called The Hammer of Witches. This evil but imaginative work gave full details of what was perceived to be the hideous new threat posed by all the practitioners of satanic magic. The book was so persuasive that, two years later, Pope Innocent VIII issued an official Bull to authorise the suppression of this blasphemous sect. Up to that point, the cult known as Witchcraft (to the extent that it existed at all) had not really constituted a threat to anyone. It rested mainly in the continuation of pagan ritual and fertility rites by the peasant classes. In real terms, it was little more than the vestige of a primaeval belief in the divine power of natural forces, focused above all on Pan, the mischievous Arcadian god of the shepherds.
Pan was traditionally portrayed with the legs, ears and horns of a goat, but the creative Dominicans had other ideas about the pipe-playing Horned One, and they blackened his image so that he was seen to correspond to the Devil himself. However, since the Inquisitors were all men, it was determined that witchcraft must be a form of depravity linked to the insatiable wantonness of women!
The problem was that nobody really knew who these presumed witches were, and so a series of ludicrously tragic trials and tests was devised to root them out. In the midst of all of this, the harsh Puritan sect became politically allied to the Roman strategy, implementing its own witch-hunts in England and, later, in America. Over a period of some 250 years, more than a million innocent men, women and children were murdered by the delegated authority of the witch-finders.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:31:09 am
It was against the backdrop of this religious fanaticism and persecution that the Renaissance movement was born - an era of rebirth and resurrection, facilitated by an environment of democratic free-thinking. This era (with its height in the early 1500s) was the age when Leonardo da Vinci, Raphael and Michelangelo developed the harmony of classical art to its highest form. And it was the age in which the excitement of pagan- oriented scholarship re-emerged in a burst of colour to cross new frontiers of science, architecture and design.
During the course of this, in 1614 and 1615, two tracts, entitled The Rosicrucian Manifestos, emerged from Germany. These were immediately followed by an associated romance called The Chemical Wedding, written by the Lutheran pastor Johann Valentin Andreae. The publications announced a new Age of Enlightenment and Hermetic liberation in which certain universal secrets would be unlocked and made known.
In view of the advent of Britain's scientific Royal Society and the inspired work of Isaac Newton, Robert Boyle, Robert Hooke, Edmund Halley, Christopher Wren and others a few decades later, the prophecies were correct enough but, at the time, they were veiled in allegory and appeared to convey an even more pertinent message.
The writings centred upon the travels and learning of a mysterious character named Christian Rosenkreutz, a Brother of the Rosy Cross. His name was plainly designed to have Rosicrucian significance, and he was depicted wearing the apparel of the Knights Templars.
The action of The Chemical Wedding takes place in the magical Castle of the Bride and Bridegroom - a palace filled with lion effigies, where the courtiers are students of Plato. In a setting worthy of any Grail romance, the Virgin Lamplighter arranges for all present to be weighed on the scales, while a clock tells the motions of the heavens and the Golden Fleece is presented to the guests. Music from strings and trumpets is played throughout, and all is cloaked in an atmosphere of chivalry, while Knights in Holy Orders preside.
Beneath the castle stands a mysterious sepulchre bearing strange inscriptions, and outside in the harbour are twelve ships of the Golden Stone, flying their individual flags of the Zodiac. Amid this curious reception, a fantasy play is conducted to tell the compelling story of an unnamed princess who, cast ashore in a wooden chest, is discovered by a prince, whom she marries, thereby causing a usurped royal heritage to be restored.
This is another Lost Bride fairy story of the type we have already seen. But, when combined with the two earlier publications, The Chemical Wedding's Grail significance was blatantly obvious, and the Church wasted no time in bringing the full weight of its condemnation against the Rosicrucian movement.

Having considered the historical Fairies, Pixies and Elves, we can now take a look at some others of the so-called Shining Ones: the Sprites, Goblins and Gnomes.
The definition of "sprite" is no more nor less than a "spirit person" - one of the transcendental realm of the Sidhé. The original Sprites were the ancient Scythian ghost warriors who painted their bodies grey-blue to look like corpses when they entered the battlefield.
In Shakespeare's A Midsummer Night's Dream, the character Puck is described as a "sprite", and in traditional English wood lore Puck is identified with a certain Robin Goodfellow who was said to be a "goblin". His father was Herne the Hunter. Hence, Oberon and Herne are one and the same. The name Oberon (a variant of Albrey the Elf King, as we have seen) is itself a derivative of the Scythian Oupire (meaning "over") and Ron (meaning "reign"). Oberon, therefore, means "Over Reign", which is the same as High King or Pendragon.
The description of "goblin" stems immediately from the Germanic word kobelin, and the
kobelins were said to be mine-workers or those who worked underground. In the context of the Ring culture, goblins were, in essence, attendants of the Oupire Portal Guardians of the Rath - the mound-dwellings of the Tepes gateways to the ancestral Netherworld - and they were just as human as the Oupires themselves.
Gnomes, like Goblins, were said to be the guardians of the underground treasures - which is why the word is today associated with banking, as in the so-called "Gnomes of Zurich". The word root is in the Greek equivalent of gno-, from which we get "gnosis" and "gnoble" ("noble"). The Gnomes were therefore, once again, of the noble race and were referred to as "the Wise Ones". Their job was indeed one of guardianship: they were guardians of the gnosis (the knowledge) and the Sacred Bloodline of the Albi-gens. It is by way of the noble (or gnomic) distinction that the Fairy Race in general was referred to as the Gentry - particularly the Druidic caste of the Pict-sidhé (the Pixies) who were the ultimate custodians of law and culture. Their female counterparts were the Behn-sidhé (the Banshee), which, in old Irish, simply means "the Wise Women".
In life, when presented with a seemingly unsurmountable problem, one can either submit to the stress and pressure that it causes or, alternatively, one can mentally diminish the problem. That does not mean that it goes away, but it can appear less harassing and more controllable.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:31:38 am
Well, that was precisely what the Church did with the Dragon succession - the Ring Lords of the Albi-gens, the Sacred Bloodline of the Holy Grail. By way of redefining all the original names - Fairies, Elves, Pixies, Gnomes, Goblins, Sprites, or whatever - they diminished the problem by miniaturising the nominal significance. In so doing, the transcendental race of the Sidhé was portrayed as minute little figures and moved into the realm of mythology. The fraudulent Donation of Constantine was then brought into play and, henceforth, only the Church could determine who was and was not a king!
If this strategy did not work sufficiently on its own, as was indeed the case in the Renaissance (a period of a more general awareness and enlightenment), then part two of the plan was brought into operation. This was more specifically targeted at the key members of the Messianic strain: the ultimate Dragon succession of the Albi-gens - the dynastic Kings and Queens of the Sangréal and their senior Oupires. These people were real, and everyone knew that, so they could not be confined to the superficial realm of fantasy. They could, however, be portrayed as if (being of the Dragon blood) they were of a weird, half-human strain, beyond the Christian pale. At best, they were perhaps mermaids and, at worst, they were vampires, but either way they were the evil, shapeshifting emissaries of Satan!
The fact that anyone believed such nonsense is difficult to comprehend in these more level-headed times. However, the myth is still operative and, to some extent, it is still working with a vengeance. It is even working on some whose apparent mission in life is to expose such propagandist dogma, but who - by way if its own cleverly contrived strategy - have actually fallen prey to it. In this regard, at this very moment there are some well-known, supposedly intelligent folk who should know better, claiming that the British Royal Family, along with myself and others, are really hideous reptiles from another planet!

One of the most surprising things about the Scythian Ring Lords is that their preserved remains from thousands of years ago (discovered even as far north as Siberia) show their bodies substantially tattooed with ring-tailed lemurs. Lemurs, we are led to believe, are native to (and pretty much restricted to) Madagascar and the Comoros Islands off Mozambique, but here they are, where we are told they never were, in northern Europe and the Black Sea regions!
It has long been known that there was once a continent, inhabited by a great king-tribe, which was noted for its lemurs. Hence, it has been dubbed "Lemuria", setting a good many enthusiasts searching for its sunken whereabouts beneath the Atlantic, Pacific or Indian oceans as if it were the lost city of Atlantis. Maybe such a concealed territory does exist. However, the fact is that (by whatever name it was once known) the mightiest Lemurian land tract was never lost. It was the great mainland continent which still exists today, stretching across eastern Europe through the one-time USSR.
This was the original realm of the great Ring Lords, tracing back to about 40,000 BC - the homeland of the Oupires of the Pict-sidhé. It was the land of the mighty Warlords of the Dragon before they migrated and battled their way southwards in the ever-cooling climate of the last ice-age. Undoubtedly, the environment was once very warm there, as is proved by the fact that the lemurs travelled about as far south as they could possibly go by land before Madagascar and the Comoros broke away from the southern African mainland.
What did these early god-kings look like? Well, they are now thoroughly identifiable from their preserved remains, which have been excavated at various sites from as far afield as Transylvania and Tibet. With their light-brown to red hair and pale eyes, the leather-clad men stood at least six foot six inches and upwards, while even the women were over six feet tall. Undoubtedly, these forebears of the Gaelic and Celtic High Kings were among the most awesome warriors of all history.
Of particular interest is the fact that the Anunnaki gods were as much a part of the Sidhé culture as they were of the Mesopotamian tradition. It was not for no reason that the settlement of Anu was hundreds of miles north of Sumer on the Caspian Sea. It was not for no reason that the ancient centre of Scythopolis (Sidhé-opolis), which the Syrians called Beth-Shean (the House of Power), was 800 miles away in Galilee. Indeed, it is now suspected that the Ubaid culture of southern Mesopotamia - the culture which introduced municipal structure from about 5000 BC - was actually the Uper-ad culture: that of the Scythian Overlords, the Upers or Oupires.
It is also reckoned that the subsequent culture of the region, phonetically called Sumerian (pronounced "Shumerian"), was actually Sidhé-murian ("Shee-murian"). In fact, the case for this is now considerable, since the early Ring Lords of Scythia (the Tuatha Dé Danann king-tribe) were actually called the Sumaire. And in the language of old Ireland - to where many of the caste migrated - the word sumaire means "dragon".
So, why have we not learned about these people in our histories? The answer is straightforward. They were, in practice, the real Elves and Fairies of our heritage, but their story was quashed from the earliest days of Roman suppression and subjugation - as the diminution of their figures caused a parallel diminution of their history.
The fact is, however, that for all we have been told about our cultural identity being from the classical scholarship of Greece, or from the imperial majesty of Rome, these things are entirely untrue. Such establishments appeared very late in the day.
The true sovereign heritage of Western culture - the culture from which derived all the so-called myth and legend which sits so comfortably within a collective race memory (no matter what the Church and academics might say in their attempts to sway us) - comes from one place alone. It comes from a place and time that might just as well be called Middle Earth as by any other name. It comes from the long-distant Realm of the Ring Lords.

Source: http://www.nexusmagazine.com/articles/ringlords1.html


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:31:56 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-11-2005 23:57             
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There are many a good reason to keep tracing, investigating and re-considering the historic era of Mideval Europe, - which pretty much coincides with the regime of the Church of Rome.
Built on the ruins of the old Roman Empire, the new clerics organised the "new" or "eternal" city, a Metero(-polis) del la Mundo. With it came the monopolistic culture of "Christendom", an off-spring from the philosophies of the greek-arabic area, where the Jewish descendants were making a cult out of their own "honorful traditions and holy scriptures". By some reason it all ended in monopolistic ideologies, suited as a tool -to subjugate, neccesary to rule a conquered population. Which is what the Emperors of Rome missed - to sustain their empire; The Higher God and His Divine Plan. As alibi.

Based on "The Will of Constantine" - a paper presumeably signed by the last emperor of Rome, he gave the Throne of Rome to the Bishop of Rome, to take over the mundane power of the empire. Unheard of course, - but what could the poor servants say or do about it? Keep their old codex` - and most humbly, but most certainly abstain?

Could that have saved us from the horrors and malice expressed by the religious wars and the inquisition - where people moved with brutality, homicide and terror, inflicting pain that would stay for generations - bringing exstinction or corruption to the old, legitimate rulers. and soon poisoning entire culture?

Could a Divine rejection of Constantins old offer have saved the basic mass of written material that did exist - in Egypt as well as in Ireland and Inguchetia. Could the grosser number of old Egyptian/Greek/Roman texts been saved from the book-fires of the inquistione - both in the streets as in a countless number of smaller or larger "church-fires". In 1352 the national archives of Norway was moved to a church in the "new capital" of Bergen. Finally all the papers arrived - just to become smoke - overnigth. Since than the cultural, etnical and cultural history of Scandinavia was erradicated. As the last part of the continent - to be culturally uprooted and deprived.

If just the old clerics of the Divine could have rejected the "treasures of this world" we would surely have saved much more of the old, "pagan" writings of Egypt, Greece, Rome and N Eurasia. Just like we would have had a world of Indians running The Americas - if the religious Rome havent been in desparate need of refunding - galloping all throughout the 15th century.

And what writing did exist in other Eurasian languages, the ones named "barbaric" - before the church started their row of "cultural cleansing"?

Today it is some 1500 years since this superstitious, dictatorial culture started to spread their regime by the word - and the sword - to rule all of the Mediterranean. Already 1200 BP we had the crazyness of war again running through Europe, - as Charlemagne started a crusade among the Franks, - subjugating all the Frankish men into military service - of The Holy See. Later the Frankish army completed what old Rome never accomplished, - to tire out the Anglo-Saxon and the Danish, and by that acquiring England and Scandinavia.

From now on the Bishop of Rome could oversee "all the world" as his regime. Thus he entitled himself Big Daddy, or Pope - publicly instituted as a "Gods Own Replacement On Earth". From then on the Cardinality have effectivly been operating as "Gods (one-and-only) Secretaries" - taking care for all "his" priviledges, priorities and properties throughout the world.

1000 years ago the "second comming" of the Church had completed one old Roman dream. This time helped by The Holy Book, that states the prophecy that "all the world shall again rejoice". Thats also the immediate reason why material from catolic clerics - written shortly before or in the year 1000 (Anno Domini), tell of a widely accepted expectance - namely that Jesus would walk again in the year 1000. One of the main reason given is the premise of the prophecy; "When all the earth is baptized in his name - he will return". With the subjugation of Denmark - and effectivly Scandinavia - as of 987 - the baptism of "all the world" was considered to be achieved.

But Jesus did not rejoin and until 1066 there was still forces of freedom left in Europe. But from then on the Vatican regime becomes gradually all-migthy. In 1152 the Catholic Church opened a new Region-officed in Trondheim, Norway - appointing bishops even on Iceland, Isle of Man and Greenland. The latter bishop is rapported to have appointed priests to the old norse populations, now congregations, in; "Markland", "Helluland", "Landit Goda" and "Vinland". After five years the entire Norwegian Sea Kingdom is organised in the church-system, becomming the "largest Archibispal Seat" in the entire world. Thus the first Archbishop of Trondheim, the english Nicolaus Breakespeare, became the first and last English ever to become Pope himself - tx to the acheivments he made on behalf of the church - understanding that his work provided the church with the influence all over the northern hemisphere -and thereby reaching all the corners of the world. By 1184 the Bishop of Greenland sent envoys far south into the Americas, getting first hand repports on the earthly treasures of the old indian cultures. Although a further exploitation is not possible - before canons and guns - made it possible to generate shere killing-fields.

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:32:11 am
VINILANDI
Due to well known material, Vinland was taken over by Sir Walther Raleigh, - on the behalf of the English Crown. The Spanish still called that areas "Northumbega" - as they knew of the land, and their norse inhabitants. To put down the mark of England that far south certainly was a new and strong signal - that the English - as the north Europeans - did not like the idea of the Treaty of Tordeisillias, from 1502, where the Pope split the overseas continents between his comrades commanding the Italian, Spanish and Portugeese Fleets.

Before the sea-hero of Britannia baptized Virginnia, we know that this land actually belonged to the Crown of Norway. But at the time of the Spanish and Portuguese raids and conquests the old Norwegian sea-kingdom was all broken - and the regime of the country entirely ruled by the church. Until the remains of the old (legitimate) nobility of Scandinavia conspired, together with the German, French and English collueges - to brake the dictatorship of the Holy See. Evidently this nobel revolt of 1527 started the reformation, - where old and new sources of knowledge and information were allowed - even outside the walls of churches or monastries. For the first time in centuries there could be debate. On the other hand - as the "trade" with the new worlds paid so well off, the Vatican regained its economical strength throughout the 16th century - allowing a serious and long-term financing of millitary and political force directed to re-conquer the lost kingdoms of the north.

As the "contra-reformation" went on as we find decades upon decades with "religious wars". Even 500 years after the reformation there have still been terror and civil warfare - due to religious/political divisions - in the cities of Northern Ireland. It is also funny to note that both WWI and WWII were fougth between the "Holy German-Roman Empire", as it was called already the year 800, when the Bishop of Rome "chrowned" Gods first warlord in Europe, Karl the Great, to be "The Earthly Emperor" of the "Christianized" part of the world.

As more and more of the society and culture was broken down and completly changed, the old nobility somehow survived - with their original language, culture and wisdom intact. Thus we get stories of heroes and of old worlds, of places, people and cultures that may appear strange, mystical or as mere fairy-tales today. Simultaniously we know - for sure - that the pre-christian area is filled with more legends and tales, - but also straigth slander and political/religious stigmatization.

Due to this 1000 year old period of monopoly the Vatican could become very efficent as rulers. But they had to excercise their dominion strict, ruthless and tyrranic. Due to intelectual fear and fundamentalism we then see an effective, all-reaching organisation that goes on the hunt WITHIN their own subjugates, - to find and errase any litterature that were NOT in latin, or not part of the churche`s cultural and educational regime.

Thus we find the inquisitions, as well as the former war-fares, a millenium of destruction, distortion and deceptions of all ancient, but "non-holy" liberies, "pagan books" etc., - which is to say the knowledge and the teachings of the old pagan societies. Who worshipped the ligth of the sun and counted the stars.

Which have made them "sun-belivers". Requiring the logic that our predecessors have considered the sun - and its effects - an issue of discussion...?! About the times before the "start of time", i.e. our anniversial 0.

The most important cradle of the mediterranean culture - before the religions come up with new explanations - seems to be Crete, starting their monumental buildings, etc., close to 9.000 year BP. Both the Roman, the Greek and the Egyptian have nourished from this sources of culture, where art, artistery, travel, trade and communication seems to be the benchmark.

We may see this as a remnisant of Atlantis. We may even have different exprectations, explanations or considerations about the "original Atlantis". We do, though, understand that the pre-christian culture of the Mediterranean area, must be a contimuation of what was "a atlantic culture" arriving, - that were unknown before they suddenly and most surprisingly arrived - through the pillars of Hercules.

There is no doubt that a great part of the early mono-teistic regime went on distorting the main source of just the old culture - of diverse and scientific knowledge - had to overthrow. To gain monopolistic powers it have been neccesary to shun the true history of the Mediterranee, and the influence of Atlantis over all this area. Thats why the inqusition is worth another reply or two; there are still dogmatic misconceptions validating a lot of peoples opinions about the "eternal matters", such as our history as specie and cultures. How else could the entire history of ice-time, the most dramatic change in the history of human life, become a "mere myth" - and a complete misunderstanding - or deception - of an envious air-head, placed behind the Sun, should be the ONLY authority. Thus we slided from being "historically and culturally counscious" to become "spiritually inspired". Just as the "the spirit of the inqisitions" we lost track of all realities behind the different legends. Finally - by the turn of last century - we ended up with the historians describing a human culture of European ice-time as a "mere heresay, a fairy-tale and a vision - bearing no historical significance". That has always been the establishments view on the myth of Atlantis too. As of yet...


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-12-2005).]



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:32:34 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-12-2005 00:58             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
More precious goats...
5000-year-old commercial seal discovered in Iran

The oldest known commercial seal, estimated to be about 5000 years
old, was recently discovered at the historical site of Jiroft in
southeastern Iran. The director of the archaeological team working at
the site, Yusef Majidzadeh, said that the seal, which bears the image
of a goat with its head leaning back, was discovered near the
governmental structure of the site during the third stage of
excavations. "The 2x2cm marble seal was skillfully made, indicating
that the region was a developed economic center 5000 years ago," he
added.

More from:www.stonepages.com

[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-12-2005).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:32:46 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 01-12-2005 11:41             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Boreas,
I hope everyone takes the time to read this material....Thanks


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:33:03 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-13-2005 18:46             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, there certainly once existed a culture in the Atlantic ocean, that appeared shortly after ice-time.
We know that this culture expanded from a common source - some 9.000 years ago. It shows first on the westcoast of Scandinavia, from where this island-jumping seems to have started. Here we also find the historical capitol of this "Sea-Kingdom", until it became invaded/conquered, around the year 1000. From that period this Kingdom ceased to exist - and its hsitory changed completly.
By the 14th century all mainland Scandinavia was also under the inquisitional rule, ending as an obedient part of the Latin rule and culture.

Some of the old remains lived on though - especially in the most northern areas, close to the "rim of existence". One such example being the populations of Greenland and Labrador. As the connection with their old capitol was broken, they were quickly weakened. By 1372 the "Ships with guns" started appearing from the south - slaying and errasing the old neighbours of the Eskimos.

Not even the churches and the Biscopal Seat was saved. During the 15th century the ships returned and soon errased all the old populations around the coast of Greenland, Labrador and New Foundland. Suitable individs were taken captive and enslaved. Thus the Portuguese named one of their new colonis "Labradore" - naming the resources to exploit.

We all know that Christobal Colon
repported to both the Portuguese and the Spanish about his discoveries. What is also brougth to ligth is that Mr. Colon came by the harbour of Bristol in 1477, on his way back south, from a roundtrip in the north Atlantic. It is also clear he visited Iceland, - which was the normal route of the English/Scottish trade-vessels.

In his admiral notes - the noble Colombus explain how this trip enabled him to visit the northern top of this island, which coastline lasts to the "african climate-zone". That means he probably followed to the English trade-ships to New Founland, were the local "North-men" delivered artic skins, white falcons and artic ivory. Even the Basques are repporting to have sailed to Labrador anually - already from the 11th century - getting dried cod.
The trip - and a set of due meassurements, made the Venetian cartographer the assertion he needed, - to evaluate the milage between the Azores, respc. Canary Islands - and the continent of "Insula Fortunate".

But before the Spanish and Portuguese could gain "free access" to the richness of the Americas the old northern connection via Greenland, giving Norway the "rigths" to eastcoast America, was simply out of the question. Thus the connection-point, Greenland, was extincted. Even the Biscopal Seat, as all other buildings and churches was destroyed. Only a few refugees escaped to Eskimo-camps on the inland ice-cap. The eskimo still tell that story in their sagas. But the last remains of the original Greenlanders, - ceased to exist around 1450 - "after three following summers of pirat-ships attacking with guns", according to the stories of the eskimos.

Since than all stories - not to say A history - of this Atlantic Kingdom ceased to exist. Thus America could be "discovered" 1492. Since 1502 the whole area, from Mexico til Greenland were to be Portuguese. By the Treaty of Tordesillias - for those who like to investigate into the intertia of papal politics during its latest, continental expansion.

ARCHAOLOGY
The archeological evidences from New Foundland 1962 proved that the old ship-culture of the North Atlantic INDEED knew of the continent, as the remains of a Norse village were excavated on Lance Deux Meadows.

Since then a growing amount of evidence and source-material are showing that branches of this population went as far as the sub-artic climate reached down by the east-coast. In 1979 they even found the remains of a nail-built ship, about 950 years old, on an island of Haiti. So the long-distance oceanic sailing was obviously presnt in the early, historical atlantean culture.
The last 30 years have been exposing old scams in a series of archaeological discoveries from the US eastcoast, like "Memories From an Errased Past".

At the end of the day we need to re-asses and reconsider the whole picture of the North-Atlantic area after ice-age. Already 9.000 years ago this culture appeared to inhabit ALL the islands of the Atlantic north. In less than 1000 years they populated all these islands, and after another millenia they had rosen giantic stone-structures, - such as the ones on Orkney Island, still standing.

The main characteristics of this culture was:

1. Basic marin food-culture
2. Ship-building
3. Island agriculture
4. Megalittic Constructions
5. Travel and Trade
6. Oceanography and navigation
7. Art, astronomy and academics

Being the only artical population of the North Atlantic these islanders sure qualify to be "specificly adressed" - as an etnic and cultural group. Like their closest neigbours, the Eskimos.

Both Eskimos and their neigbours - called "North-men" have historic and cultural roots. The eskimo from Tibet, the Norse from the Baltics. But from the same origin, - off the original man that tred the earth before we got divided. By the historical ice-time...

If we like to discuss an "Atlantic Kingdom" we better understand that history may have something to do with it.

IP: 195
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:33:32 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-17-2005 00:26             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
THE GRAND PARENTS
Every parent on this globe have discovered something more than gratitude - once they become grandparents. Suddenly one have glimpses of a new understanding - shedding a new ligth on ALL the old facts and functions. Thus we may understand why old people used to speak of their "flowering of joy" - as they witnessed the grand-children succeding in "governing and furthering" our civilsation and culture, our home and family-traditions, keeping all the annual highligths and celebrations - following the great cycle of the Solar year...
In the old north the long, dark and frozen period of the artic winter made it neccesary to stay inside, keeping warm, dry, fed and rested. Thus we may understand why/how a Nordic culture would develop certain preferences for indoor, oral activities. Such as playing, acting, story-telling, singing, resiting, etc.

IGLOO MENTALITY
Then it is not without significance that our bodies, voices and minds are all magnificent instruments of expression, as we express and practice our physical and mental talents. Also called "gifts of nature". In an "igloo-society" the volume of expression had to be tempered, developing rytms, sounds, harmonics that still exist in a broad variety of traditional folksongs all over Eurasia.
Thus we may understand how the North deve

POETICS, ART & ETICS
Communicating with poetry, education and finesse made it possible to deal with an endless world of possible observations, sensations, impressions, compassions, insigths, comprehensions and opinions.

With A clear language, able to express all of this distinctivly and clear, we started to get ways and means to express and keep knowledge "on a collective record". Thus we neccesarily had a first saga, or a proto-type of what we may call "Our History" - with a mythology and language that later diverced into different language-groups, as the world population came to be separated for en eon of time - in order to grow into specific, clearly defined sub-groups, today called "races" or "etnic goups". But still we find very close and basic similarities between the different cultures - in terms of constitution, social behaviour, language, myth, art, building and craftmanship.

A GLOBAL BRAIN - again
We even find clear paralells between the ancient cultures of Meso-America, Europe, Africa, Asia. Like megalittic structures, road-systems, townships, agriculture, playgames, performance and music. Not to forget the characteristic "Bird-Man" and the exactly angled pyramids - of monumental size. All around the globe...


In our generation it has been posible to piece the most vital historic information together - and threat it objectively, - in terms of BOTH religion AND politics. Thus new, withdrawn and hidden information have also been revealed - thanks to the growth of Free speech and modern Science.

Though, we have also to detect a large number of old deceptions - that has been presented as "undisputed truth", even in "The Book of Truth" itself. Ever since the Council of Nikea...
Even among the well-educated of todays academia we find many that refer to political scams as plain, historical "truths". Even when clear proves of simple facts exists. That`s deceptions.

Criminals and illegitimate opressors who succed to gain power always act very causciously after the take-over, to take controll of the media - and write the history according to their personal interests.

Thus the coup-making warloards of Rome were creating a crack in their own culture. Many a great tyrrant had been stabbing his way to the the prior Seats of Power and the respective Halls of Fame. Suddenly there was tyrrants who could issue a "Verdict of Rome" - resulting that the earth could become flat over nigth.

There are a lot of decptions still existing in both biblical as historical litterature. The most advanced and inert deception is worth mentioning, being a "contra-deception" in terms. The principle is as funny as it is impressive; "Have people see, what they understand do not exist."

Just:
1) Claim it does not exist.
2) Claim you owe the truth of it.
3) Conclude it does not exist.

To explain your logic - call it "mere phantasy and fairy-tails". Then reassure you owe the truth of it, anyway. Thats why a "headon figure" like Santa Claus was "explained" - just before 1200 - as the propierty of the Church of Rome. Today Roman Cradinals ban the use of Necklas during Chrisitmas - because of his "headon origin".

That means that the Catolic church of today do not by the explanation from the mideval Church. But here - on the Forum of belearned, modern historians - here I still find the strange old, clerical - and highly biased - view, telling that the ancient, cultural hero - Sant Necklas - ACTUALLY was a good Christian.

"A Bishop actually, from Myrra. Who helped the poor and saved a women from being decaptivated...". Just old politics. Lies, distortions and deceptions - to gain "ownership" to a widely popular hero.
Even todays Roman Cardinals accepts this. Thus they can publish their annual bans on celebrating Santa as a part of Christmas, - explaining the widely accepted opinion - that Santa was a headon figure, connected the pagan "Yule-tide" of Midle-Europe and Scandinavia.

Then it is quite a paradox that academians still may explain Santas historical origin by refereing to "Myrra, Bishop and Turkey".

Old, widespread deceptions may have strong, political roots. The Vatican regime have ruled for centuries - and the impact is still present, even in academic societies of reformed and evangelic countries...

NORM AND NATURE
When norm and nature contradicted each other the old Vatican often labeled nature as the "wrong", "the evil" or "the cause of it". Thus the "up" of Rome came down, "down" was redefined to be "up". Shaping mideval Europe was a "continous development - backwards".

Today we have to re-examine many of out major beliefs - as they may rest on false grounds. A lie doesnt became true by its mere conservation. 200 years or 10.000 years means little or no difference. If the culture keep their celebrations, festivals and holidays - the due songs, ryhmes and speeches were performed, evry year - steady going - for generation to generation. 200 or 2000 - without even a word changing, in either verse, song or play.

As a help when analyzing these and paralell text-sources it may be productive to use a line from the old rennesaince - telling that; "nature" is a premeter to "culture".

Which means we have to study the human conditions with the zest of understanding that the "Normal" not always is "natural". The zest of the rennesaince simpy reminds us that we better skip the norms and the normal, - whenever it is in contradiction with the natural.

ATLANTEAN TIME


Finally we need to point that both our oldest cultures - the Atlantean and the Egyptian - were geared and focused into CONSERVATION. Keeping the Gifts of Nature and the Gifts of Culture - inherited from their most respected Forefathers. Thus we may understand that the Egyptian culture did not have our concept of time, as a motive to move, focus and sweat. They were absolutly not cultivating ACTION or EXPENSION ("development") as such. Thus the Egyptians did not develop a war-culture, and they had no compability when the proffesional warriors of the Persian and Roman Armies marched in.

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:36:47 am
Riven
Member
Posts: 1655
From: Canada
Registered: May 2003
  posted 01-17-2005 16:31             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Late Weichselian and Holocene shore displacement history of the Baltic Sea in Finland
MATTI TIKKANEN AND JUHA OKSANEN
Tikkanen, Matti & Juha Oksanen (2002). Late Weichselian and Holocene shore displacement history of the Baltic Sea in Finland. Fennia 180: 1-2, pp. 000-000. Helsinki. ISSN 0015-0010.
http://www.helsinki.fi/maantiede/geofi/fennia/demo/pages/oksanen.htm

About 62 percent of Finland's current surface area has been covered by the waters of the Baltic basin at some stage. The highest shorelines are located at a present altitude of about 220 metres above sea level in the north and 100 metres above sea level in the south-east.

Around 10,300 BP this ice lake discharged through a number of channels that opened up in central Sweden until it reached the ocean level, marking the beginning of the mildly saline Yoldia Sea stage (10,300-9500 BP). As the connecting channels rose above sea level, however, the Baltic Sea became confined once more, to form the Ancylus Lake (9500-8000 BP).

The ice sheet associated with the Weichselian glaciation, which followed the Eemian interglacial, reached its maximum extent about 18,000-20,000 BP. It was more than three kilometres thick in the area of Finland, so that it depressed the earth's crust to such a degree that a considerable part of the country's present area lay beneath the waters of the Baltic basin immediately after deglaciation. As the burden of the overlying ice was released the crust began to rise rapidly, however, so that it is estimated that the total rise up to the present time has been 600-700 metres on the northern coast of the Gulf of Bothnia, 400-500 metres in the middle part of Finland and in central Lapland, and around 300 metres on the coast of the Gulf of Finland and in northern Lapland (Mörner 1980). The majority of this rise nevertheless took place as the ice was melting, before the ground surface became exposed.


Then, around 11,200 BP, a (possibly subglacial) connection to the west opened up north of Mount Billingen in central Sweden. This remained functional for some 400 years, and allowed the water level in the Baltic to return to that of the outside ocean, presumably implying a decline of 5-10 metres

By the time the Younger Dryas cold phase came to an end, the Second Salpausselkä marginal formation was also in existence, and the sharp warming of the climate around 10,500 BP then caused the ice margin to retreat rapidly (Björck 1995). As a consequence, the Billingen 'gateway' opened up again around 10,300 BP and the waters of the Baltic Ice Lake once more began to discharge into the ocean through central Sweden (Fig. 2B). This dropped the water level in the Baltic basin by 25-28 metres within a few years, regaining the level of the outside ocean.

As the ice margin retreated further, the Närke Strait in the lowlands of central Sweden north of Billingen opened up about 10,000 BP, allowing saline water from the ocean to flow into the Baltic basin (Eronen 1990; Björck 1995)

Ocean levels rose at a rate of more than a metre per century around 10,000 BP, but the water level was still 30 metres below what it is today (Taipale & Saarnisto 1991: 237)

This marked the beginning of the Ancylus transgression, which lasted about 300 years (9500-9200 BP). During this time, the rising water level caused extensive areas of land to be inundated once more, especially on the south coast of the Baltic, where practically no land uplift took place. The water was rising at a rate of 5-10 centimetres a year, and the transgression as a whole is estimated to have been of the order of 15-25 metres (Eronen 1990; Björck 1995).

The rising waters of the Ancylus Lake eventually exceeded the threshold known as the Darss Sill in the south-western part of the Baltic basin and water began to flow out through the Dana River, at the site of the present-day Great Belt (Store Bælt), around 9200 BP (Fig. 2E). This brought the Ancylus transgression to a close and severed the land connection between Sweden and Denmark at the same time. For a time the channels across central Sweden functioned alongside the Dana River, but the rapid regression of the Ancylus Lake, combined with land uplift, soon caused these channels to dry up (Björck 1995).


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:37:00 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-18-2005 01:23             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TRAVELLING WHEELBUROGHS
The ancient connections between the cultures of Eurasia, Egypt and India are doubtless. We just do not know - yet - how and where all the old cultures originated from. Present geological knowledge -explaining a cataclysmic end of the last ice-age, may help clarify the posibile movements of ancient cultures. Knowing that the Scandinavian and the Basques still carry the same genes as did their 10.000 year old forefathers - the first Europeans.

Thus the relation between the Scandinavian and the Basque language should be closer examined. All the more so since a Finnish professor of Egyptology - already in 1936 - concluded an intensive study by a book showing the clear relations between classical Finnish and "Old Egyptian", - an area Prof. Aspenhovi had made his speciale. Before he realized that his desk was covered with old Finnish dialect...

His works show dozens on dozens of related words, - such as house-roof-kitchen, etc, - or head-hand-fingers,toes,legs, etc. Given that his "old Egyptian" is linguistically correct the identical synonomity of words is far beyond accidental. So far it has been viewed as a "incident of syncronicity" by the Finnish collegues. Due to a rather defensive form of modesty they have left the investigation and closed the case.

DEPRIVATION OF HISTORY
Due to a need for quick solutions to difficult questions it is already long-time ago since the Finnish historians concluded that ancient Finnish Kings never did exist. Nor did any cultural connection - to the great civilsations - exist either.

According to the Catolic History of the 12th and 13th century Finland was a dark and murky place, where any good christian could face evil danger and savage people - ommitting sorcery and fraternaising with the devil. Himself...

This old "facts" was originating in the 12th century and re-written in the midst of the 15th century, as in Historica Suecia, 1555. Somehow the Finns still by into that realm. As modern Finnish academia have not found any "authorized documents" that states otherwise, they actually conclude that "there must be something" to the written material.

Some decades ago Finnish academia themmselves concluded that Finland was populated by "smal communities of primitive hunter-gather-culture with no overall, gouvernmental social organisation" - up to the very 12th century. When an English Bishop arrived - backed by some Swedish troopers - to get the province of Finnland into the "heird". Bringing civilisation and culture to the "Fennones".

A MISCONCEPTION
As long as this grave misconception are allowed significance we see old and young historians restrain to investigate historical records or source-material that says otherwise. Such as the Anglo-Saxon Chronichles, the Icelandic and the Norse Sagas. They all refer to Finland as an; "(old) Kingdom". And still the decency of the Finns make them to favour the historical version of their later rulers, the Catolics Swedes.

Might one just reflect that there must have been some intrinsic power and a heavy force behind this mideval deception, as even Finish science is still affected by the Wrath of God, assisted by The Holy Faith of Eternal Truth and the Holy Spirit of Good Behaviour and Admireble Service.

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:37:19 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-20-2005 21:34             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Riven,
The conclusion made above are rather well-known fats - and conclusions - from the Scandinvian debate and research of the ice-age. The contribution reffered to are adding some valuable facts to this debate, -but some are still left out of due consideration...
One quote;
"Ocean levels rose at a rate of more than a metre per century around 10,000 BP, but the water level was still 30 metres below what it is today (Taipale & Saarnisto 1991: 237)". (endquote)

The estimates applied in the Scandinavian models does not take into accounting that a general rise of the oceanlevels are of the size of 120-160 metres, occuring at the end of ice-time, - all over the globe. Which includes the North Atlantic and the White Sea.

Nor does the geodynamic models of the rises of Scandinavia apply. The land-rise were MUCH faster than 1 cm a year, which is the level measured throughout the 50-ties and 60-ties. Today that rise is down to 0,30 cm a year, - clearly stating that the tectonical rise - after ice-time - is just about to end, - at a tectonical balance in the crust of the northern hemisphere. In the most northern west-coast of Finland - where the ice-cap had its core (optimum of 5 km+). Here the rise is still 1 cm a year -which is more than 3 times the speed of any other area of Scandinavia today.

Thus statistic data as this may be misinforming. According to the geodynamical models of Sweden/Norway the land-rise of the first millenium after ice-time (9.-10.000 BP) is about 150 metres, giving a midle value of 150 cm a year. Instead of 1.

Then there are some quite recent facts - from international geology - that doesnt really apply to the models made to explain the sudden disappearance of the ice-sheet and the artic climate.

Thus we get the explanation that the enormous mass of a 3000 metres thick glacier - larger than Fenno-Scandia, upported by a North-Atlantic glacier from the present Nort Pole covering land and oceans as far as South Greenland and Iceland - should have "melted away".
Which takes time.

The stratigrafical measures says that it all melted away between 11-18.000 years ago, covering the time from 1) Maximum extent, to 2)Minimum extent, as todays reality.
Thus the "Baltic bassin" are supposed to have collected all the melting water - as ice-cold fresh-water, inside an isolated bassin. Consequently we find the next argument - the sudden rise of climate in Scandinavia specifically, - as the reservoir of cold water are bursting, as out of a dam - to connect with the oceans.

Simultaniously our geologists get to strengthen their logic explaination to the sudden slide of "the remaining, regional and local glaciers" - as well as the sudden rise in the regional temperatures.
As all the stored coldwater rushed OUT of the Baltic Ocean.

But, - the studies are far from complete. Even if a sharp rise in the Global Temperature may occur - it is difficult to explain the "sudden shifts" described (above, too) as a mere change in the temperature of the global atmosphere. Heating away a 5000-3000 metres thick ice-CAP, by sun and wind alone? Fully possible, - but not in 6000 years.

We still have some fragments of the large ice-cap existing, as the artic ice, Greenland and some more glaciers. But none of them have melted much (more) - in the LAST 9.000 years.

/Before recently, - as the gulf-stream managed to gnaw it way through the Arctic Ice-cap and reach the North Pole. As the ice-sheet is now broken - even during winter - the Gulfstream is repported to have started whirling around it, before levveling out - to both the Atlantic and the Pacific./

The work refferd above keeps the main-line of the "old" explanation to the swift changes of the last ice-time and its "de-glacification". Thus it also overlooks present archological data - proving human populations to have existed in;

1) Varanger/Alta - Norway, 9.900 BP.
2) Kolan Pennisula, east coast, 13-17.000 years ago.
3) Moscow, 17.000 years ago
4. White Sea and Kara Ocean; 36-40.000 BP
5. SW Finland, 11.000 - 280.000 years ago.

(The recent habitat have been used continously - during all known interglacials - from the last 300.000 years, - including the last one...)

The processes of glaciation and de-glaciation is still far from clear. Present researh still work on a model of it`s largest (definite maximum) extent, as well as the consequences of the end of glacial America and Eurasia. A model of the (still) rising of continents, rising parts of continents and local varations along tectonic meltpoints - are just in the making.

Then we have to relate local, regional and tectonic differences - in the reaction to a vanishing pressure of 3-5000 kilometres thick ice - weighing some 0.91 kg pr cubic centi-litre.

As the tectonic reactionS are understood and measured - we have to relate the real rise of the arctic sea-levels, corrected and controlled by the present data from southern waters, stating a rise of 160 metres. And - mind us - the oceanographic surveys have just started to investigate this question in particular...



 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:38:45 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-20-2005 21:44              
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
News from The European Genome Project;
Disentangling the Effects of Demography and Selection in Human History

By
Jason E. Stajich and Matthew W. Hahn

Demographic events affect all genes in a genome, whereas natural selection has only local effects. Using publicly available data from 151 loci sequenced in both European-American and African-American populations, we attempt to distinguish the effects of demography and selection. To analyze large sets of population genetic data such as this one, we introduce "Perlymorphism," a Unix-based suite of analysis tools. Our analyses show that the demographic histories of human populations can account for a large proportion of effects on the level and frequency of variation across the genome. The African-American population shows both a higher level of nucleotide diversity and more negative values of Tajima's D statistic than does a European-American population. Using coalescent simulations, we show that the significantly negative values of the D statistic in African-Americans and the positive values in European-Americans are well explained by relatively simple models of population admixture and bottleneck, respectively. Working within these nonequilibrium frameworks, we are still able to show deviations from neutral expectations at a number of loci, including ABO and TRPV6. In addition, we show that the frequency spectrum of mutations—corrected for levels of polymorphism—is correlated with recombination rate only in European-Americans. These results are consistent with repeated selective sweeps in non-African populations, in agreement with recent reports using microsatellite data
http://www.nature.com/cgi-taf/DynaPage.taf?file=/ejhg/journal/v13/n2/abs/5201321a.html&dynoptions=doi1106273964

--------------------
More repports on the HG;
http://www.nature.com/ejhg/journal/v13/n2/index.html
-------------------- http://www.nature.com/cgi-taf/DynaPage.taf?file=/ejhg/journal/v13/n2/full/5201330a.html#bib3
-------------------- http://www.genetics.org/cgi/content/abstract/167/2/867?view=abstract http://www.nature.com/cgi-taf/DynaPage.taf?file=/ejhg/journal/v13/n2/full/5201329a.html
---------------------
Not to forget the last on the “diversion of the species” – leading up to the origin of the human genome; http://www.nature.com/cgi-taf/Dynapage.taf?file=/nature/journal/v433/n7023/abs/nature03211_fs.html


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:39:23 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-23-2005 08:58             
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After centuries with strife and destructive warfare we nay recognize that the historical memory of the Mediterrnean cultures got weakened and confused, and finally destroyed.
The clear memory of our ancient origin got lost - effecting a fundamental change in the review of our past cultures. As a quick way out we find inadequate, simple exaggerations, creating super-real memories of "the good old". Simultaniously the giantic and extraordinary started to gain ground in the socio-political circles - to explain and legimitate major changes of laws, traditions, constitutions and legal rigths. Finally the constitution of Rome became more and more super-natural, affecting all societies in - and around the Roman Empire.

Thus the "religious realm" came to be a political entity - and finally an all-compassing guide-line to the entire Eurasia. As "Men of God" siezed power, the old (royal) rulers - and their entire staff - became "headon gods" or "demi-gods".

Today the phrase "God" is an immediate, automatic "hyper-linking" before the names of the old Sumerian, Egyptian, Greek or Norse panteons. The "religious realm" are explaining the "omnipotent" ideologies we have seen come and go - up until our time. Today we have dictators that even turn on their very origin, - expelling religion, - as such. To favour another, more updated "relegare", today cathegorized as Anarchism, Communism, Nazism, etc.

The massive and wide impact of our religious history sure explains the need and value of a spititual and social philosophy. But, - as we all know to well already - the "religious realm" also include a socio-political side, - that tend to command rather than observe; dictate, rather than govern; use, rather than relate. To get, rather than give.
The history behind our major religions all show that their main object is cultural "dominion" - controlling the major premises of our cultural philosophy, consequently determining political and economical issue. Today we see the religion still used "for higher purposes" - as it still may serve perfectly, as "explanation" to the evil necessary to commit, "to kill the evil".

When the spiritual, cultural and political order merge we have the "religious realm".
Thus we may understand the nature of our "ideological religions" (Defining rather than Explaining, - concluding by Commandments and Punishment, rather than Understanding and Excitement. Shaping the entire philosophy a political tool.)
Rele-gare still means "Mass-movement" as in "Shift" or "Change". In a neo-latin context that implies the One Thing Making (initiating) this Shift, - making the mass movement. Which may translate into both "Device" and "Purpose". Not to say "ways and means". Thus we get the inferior philosophy, - degrading to the story of ONE Book, as an "all-encompassing" devise, - rather than a purpose in itself - of subjective knowledge and objective debate.

As the spiritual and social words are given pathos the device will be working. Especially when backed by political authority and economical resources. But nothing beats the effectiveness of marching soldiers. Followed by a growing number of The Book - and the pathos of its clerics. If we go closer into it we may adress the cultural shift that actually happened - as the writing-culture becomes "existential" - in terms of "keeping knowledge and understanding". And not "only" mere information, data, statistics.
In the old monarchies they had clerics who took care of the books - for all the wisemen and the fools, alike. Thus we know the classic "Sinhue - The Egyptian", - by Mika Waltari - a historic novel describing Egypt from the period of the famous "Writer", - a sculpture from ancient Egypt, today on display at Brittish Museum, London. Today we may recognize a LONG and STABLE period in our Eurasian history. In the artic area we know that the first settlers started to spread some 10.000 years ago.

If we limit the view to the arctic area we see the first decisive traces of "military equipment or actions" occuring 2.500 years ago - in the very south-east of France, in the border-area. But suddenly - some 2.200 years ago - an enormous army appeared - marching straight through France and England. Conquering, distorting and destroying the classical "Celtic and English cultures". Genetically - since all women had to beget the blessings of their Roman Victors.

Thus we got the first latino lovers and blonde babes, exercising "romantic love" -already as kids play. Add the arising affection of unknown and forbidden passion -and we have screenplays of Romance, - from Shakespeare onwards. Here "Romantic Love" appears as a reminiscence from "the good old days", when flirt and sex was part of the conquistadors way to "enjoy their tributes". Instituting cross-cultural families and cross-racial mating - at the end of an etnic war. In Shakespeares play the "civil resistance" of the families involved focus on the issue of romance and etnicity. During the Catholic period all sexual contact "outside marriage" was defined as "Wild". To save the "Romantic problem" from becoming a social problem - as children of 15 started getting children, giving uncontrollable rises in populations.


Thus the Catholic Church implemented the taboo - "Sex is Evil." Solving the problem "once and for all". Old Roman-tic love became a water-hole of emotional experience, education and growth. And it became a chilling protest, signifying opposition towards the rigid earthly regime of the religious Roman Landlords.
During catholic time we could see stupidity at its worst - in the hands of a political regime. All sexual affection and passion became banned. In a short while we had clerics and politicans showing great affections for the ban, passionately dedicated to serve the Divine - by harder investigations, sanctions and prosecutions -of the libidly poisoned and “possessed”.

The revised ideology required that all our physical and emotional pleasures a "gift of God" and thus "belonged to God", ministered by his servants - and their clerical masters. Who may - or may not - further His blessings to "Anyone chosen to The Joys of Good" - and ALLOW someone to "enter the sacred matrimony".

After the reformation Shakespeare was allowed to shed light on "Anglo-Romantic Love"; using a reminiscence from "the good old days" to provoke debate, reflecting on the effects of "Roman time", - when flirt and sex was part of the conquistadors way to "enjoy their tributes". This "landslide" in the Gallic civilisations - sa in the Greek and Egyptian before - the emperial practice of etnic cleansing - created biological scars of a warfare and brute force, as the basis for the cross-racial. (Oposite the life-principle of the Atlanteans - who initiated the "agenda" of cross-cultural trade and genetic exchange.)
Thanks to centuries of "civil resistance" towards the Roman ethni-fication of the entire arctic culture - as genome, language, culture survived. In our own land, - where our true roots still exists. In all senses of the word. Even undercover.
----
If you are able to see the poetic reality of the rustic Meadowlands you may understand that "God" - never existed as an entity. If we use the term "Our Creator" - we may understand that our human origin dwell in the evolution of this Globe. Channelling through the emergence of life - in forms and ways we start to recognize. At the end of a 450 year cultural and scientific re-constitution.
Today we know enough to see the wonders and the magic of nature as it is. Without the religious terms still connected to the "social sciences" where "religion" is placed in a faculty by itself. And thereby refered to as a "realm" of "reality".

To understand the "Greek, Roman or Norse Gods" you have to see "God" as the old norse word "Gode". A "Gode" is a title given within the old Norse aristocracies - as a constitutional function and position of public service. The King himself as "Head-God"; "Hovgode". Thus all in his closest family - each being part of the constitution, may also be serving as "Gode".

Thus we find Jupiter and his family, - reflecting the same Panteon as the Greek culture, who had the exact same structure. The Hindi and Aino myths shows the same circle of "Head-Gods", - which correlates very well with the Finnish Kalevala and the Norse Edda. Which are rimarily telling that both Japanese, Indians, Finns and Scandinavians have a cultural deeply rooted relation, - in terms of CULTURAL history. If we may change the word "God" - with "Ancestors" - including all their expressed wisdom - we may explain the "incredible creation story" - without the "Hyper-energetic entity of miracelous Super-Nature", who knows all, sees all, knows all, actually had created it all - from eternity to rule forever. (Puha...)

---

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:39:41 am
One verse from the Norse Hryminnesmal gives one line explaining the beginning of the "first age". The saga of the Boxstrom-faimily gives an extensive, logical and very scientific description of time origin, - as it explains the background, the location, the circumstance and the consequence of how the first man and woman came into existence.

For the first time ever do we see a myth that progressively describes historical processes, - while it explain the logic of the different phases and effects of the process. Thus I may close by a question - what happened to the Bible if we forget "God" and exchange "him" with "Adam"? And what happens if we demote Jupiter and Zeus from the "magical realm" and give them their historical presence - as well as their breath back?! The Asers have their own myth of origin, calling it

The Saga of The Ring, - dating their origin back before Ice-time. Explaining its occurrence, as well as its effects, - such as the arctic climate, the entire arctic nature, as well as the arctic human being, AND its culture.

Well, present geology states that the ice-time was here already 35 million years ago. 29 million years MORE than the public estimate less than 10 years back. 20 years back Ice-time was assumed to had been "coming and going" for 600.000 years, - some colleges pushing the time-line to 1,8 million years. At that time, in 1985, the Bock-Saga was revealed - saying that ice-time lasted for 50 million years, before ending 10.000 years ago.

Only one line of Norse myth deals about our very first origin - as human beings. But we have the first five verses of the great epic Voluspaa - describing the origin of the North-Atlantic population - as a branch from the Aser who survived 50 million years of ice-time, as they escaped to "Noatun" (ref. Voluspaa). Rising solid, arctic sons and daughters on his "New Yard", Noa, "The Newer" was able to send 10 of his sons to all corners of the world - greeting from the King of The North Pole, successor of the first speaking monkeys, Frei and Freia, who named themselves "As-r".

Managing to survive on Noa-tun, the Aser could reach the tropics and explain the destiny of Alt-land-is, - as the envoys managed to reach the 10 tropical Kingdoms. The Aser was known as the very first of all royal families - not only to the Norse Kings but also to all tropical Royals.
The existence and impact of the Aser are still respected in all major mythologies. Still they all refer their ethnic and cultural origin to the "Top of the Globe", i.e. the North Pole Area. Professor W. Warren, President of Boston University, explained this in detail already 107 years ago.
www.healthresearchbooks.com

[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 01-23-2005).]

IP: 195.159.184.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:40:09 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 01-26-2005 10:38             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Atlantic Time-line
Because the Northern cultures can be traced back to a "point zero" it is possible to assess ALL archeological data on one time-line, where a definite 0-point is completly clear - as we get 10.000 years back in time. Present geology (US/England/Norway 2002)actually points to 10.300 BP as the last date of existence of the Scandinavian Glacier. And still the next date; 9.900 BP identifying the abscence of the Glacier, - still stands...
The growing consensus within geological circles are stating that the process of disappearance have been VERY fast. Excluding "melting" - and thereby "climate-change" as a main-factor to explain the end of the Eurasian/American ice-time. Mass-movement have MUCH more to do with, - correlating the present discoveries within the ocean, - presenting wide profs of a sudden rise in the Ocean Level, "some 8.700-11.000 years" ago.
Hundreds of islands in the North Atlantic Seas were populated after ice-time. From arctic people - from the west-coast Europe. The only reasonable logic from all known facts about this populations tell of a arctic sea-culture evolving out of the Scandinavian area. Thus North-Way become the trade mark of the land, where the large ocean-current ("Gulf-stream") reach the 62-65 degree North. In this area experienced sailor could turn west - and head into the larger realm of the Atlantic. With good wind, a straight ship - and "16 men behind oars" they could cross the Gulf-drift (3 knots here) and reach Iceland in less than 48 hours...
Then we have the atlantic island-jumping; populating The Orkney islands, The Feroe Islands and South-WEST Greenland. Before returning back home - to Norway?! Maybe, - but only in the initial phase. Turning around and sailing straight back towards Feroe islands is another matter thou. Then You may wait for months, to get SOME wind, - blowing SOUTH and east. Which (today) normally appears in the period January-March. When the worst winter is deep frozen and completly dark...
Thus the way further west, - following the southwards stream became apparent. Finding the "sources" of the eastward stream, - reaching the British Isles and Europe. Which they really DID. We have proves of a stranded Scandinavian "Viking-ship" found in Haiti (1974), carbon-dated at just about the year 1000 (AD). If we pull Indian, Norse and Mediterranean history and legend together - we may understand that the archaeological evidences - such as the pre-columbian mining in Michigan - is ONE of the many memories still existing - of the culture that Plato called Atlantis.
Its 2005 and about time to take our very own eyes, ears and senses seriously. Even if we are educated. A large amount of pre-conceived knowledge have shown to contain a large amount of "errors" to. As we discover that some "errors" of the history-book are based on fraud or deception we may feel strange about some of these things. Thus we need brush our small greys and look again - with fresh eyes. All real research build on that.

Hundreds of islands in the North Atlantic Seas were populated after ice-time. From arctic people - from the west-coast Europe.
The only reasonable logic from all known facts about this populations tell of a arctic sea-culture evolving out of the Scandinavian area. Thus the North-Way become the trade mark of the land, where the large ocean-current ("Gulf-stream") reach the 70 degree North.
In this area experienced sailor could turn west - and head into the larger realm of the Atlantic. With good wind, a straight ship - and "16 men behind oars" they could cross the Gulf-drift (3 knots here) and reach Iceland in less than 48 hours...
Then we have the Atlantic island-jumping; populating The Orkney islands, The Feroe Islands and South-WEST Greenland. Before returning back home - to Norway?!
Turning around and sailing straight back towards Feroe islands is another matter thou. Then You may wait for months, to get SOME wind, - blowing SOUTH and east. Which (today) normally appears in the period January-March. When the worst winter is deep forzen and completely dark...
Thus the way further west, - following the southwards stream became apparent. Finding the "sources" of the eastward stream, - reaching the British Isles and Europe. Which they really DID. We have proves of a stranded Scandinavian "Viking-ship" found in Haiti (1974), carbon-dated at just about the year 1000 (AD). Though - 30 years ago this found was not accepted as "significant" - since it did not fit the present "opinion" of the authoritative historians.

The findings of New Foundland 1962 was still not accepted. First after the Colombus jubilee (1992) did the "Norse discoverer Leif Eriksson" become "comme-il-faut" within broader academic circles. In 1995 Heyerdahl started a survey on the earliest sources of information about the Norse connections to Greenland-America. Based on the works of Kare Prydz it is clear that the Norse sailors of the old North was covering all the North Atlantic, - from a capitol city in the Trondheim area. The sailing-route went from Mid-Norway, via Greenland to Chesapeake Bay, or further, - from where they could hit the Ocean current, - all the way to Ireland.
Thus Dublin and Isle of Man was so important to the old Norwegian Sea-Kingdom. It completed the entire circle, being the "magical" ROUND-TRIP of the North Atlantic.
In 1999 Heyerdahl made another important precision. The collected source-material does NOT say that Leif Eriksson discovered Amerika. They says that he LIVED there, - as part of a widespread culture that reached all the way down to Virginia. Governing from Greenland - where his father, - the royal Erik ruled, - from the royal seat of "Brattalid". It is even reported that father Erik was most unhappy that his son Leif had brought the first "black-men" (priests) with him - back from the annual meeting at the Royal Palace in Trondheim, Norway.
The meeting in question happened 995 or 996, just as the first Roman collaborator amongst the Norwegian nobility had made a coup-de-etat, - starting a "Christianization" of all Norwegian cities. Thus the regional chiefs, Leiv included, had to bring priests with them home, build them churches and get the population to arrive there - giving 10 % of their income for their "salvation".
Backed by Vatican annals it is obvious that Leiv Eriksson did not discover America. But he was the one taking the first German-Roman clerics there, - as "missionaries" to the local populations.
The updates on the political changes of Northern Europe - during the period 800-1100 (AD), - shows that there already existed sailing-routes to America, that was PART of the old Norwgian kingdom. The sagas refer to TWO kings, one ruling the North Sea - from the Bay of Oslo,- while the other ruled the North Atlantic. Thus they are consequently referred - in different sources - as "Sea-kings". Their population, culture and "regime" was spread "over an enormous area - over seas". Their possessions were not land, but overseas areas.
A third centre of sea-fare and trade was build by Gota River, where today lays Goten-bourough. Today Gotenborough is part of Sweden - but still it is the capitol city of Western Gotaland. Eastern Gotaland streches to Got-land itself. The old law-books of this two "lands" still exist. Connected to this mideval laws of the Goter, there exist a small "Myth of Origin", stating that "We all come from Gotland (the island)". The expression "We all" is referring to all Gotic branches,- from where also the Norwegian Sea-Kings - and their produce; the Norwegians, - are descending.

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:40:32 am
Thus we may understand that even old Swedish law-books are pointing to a common origin of the Scandinavian peoples - placed on Gotland. Law-books from western Norway also shows that the Norwegian (Gotic) Kingline, governed Greenland, as well as Markland, Ildland, Helluland, Vineland and other districts of today US east-coast.
Later the climatic "minimum" - peaking 1350-55 - weakened the entire population of Northern Europe. In Scandinavia MORE than 75% of the population died - and the connections with Greenland difficult. A Papal letter of 1352 tell that the Norse populations in Greenland and America had died out - or "fallen from the rigth belief and moved west - to the savage". By 1372 gun-ships extinguished the last, defenceless Norsemen on Greenland. The "savages" to the west - Norse villages - was ransacked and the people taken slaves, - starting a trade that made Portuguese geographers name the area "Labradores". Though the old Norse Sea-Kingdom was broken down, - and the parts "eaten" by the new rulers; the Portuguese and Spanish sailors of The Holy Cross. Thus the entire history of the "island empire" of the North Atlantic became erased - to make way for the New Lords to discover America, - and instignate the "New Time" also there, - in "The New World".
In other words - the unknown part of Eur-American connections and history - is still bigger than the known parts. But we DO know that practical issues created a curiousity for the land in the west - and its southern shores. First time already some 7-9000 years ago. We just do not know exactly when, yet. But at last the American archaeologists have started to accept the fact that they are Scientists, - and not social behaviourists, intellectual opinionists or contra-productive hypo-critics. Denying and supressing "alternative opinions" are one thing, overlooking facts another. Making a fool out of yourself in a different thing. Making a fool out of us all quite another. Especially when their bread is paid by all of us common taxpayers.

The rest of us may play around as we like, - as many posts on this site shows. But also the ones genuinly interested in the legends of Atlantis, - as myth, legend and reality - may have to re-consider the framework of their investigations, since the historical Atlantean culture appeared - populating all Islands - from Greenland to Tenerife - after ice-time. The remains of that peculiar sea-culture still exists - in the boat and ship-culture we find in some rural areas of the North-Atlantean islands. But the conscious connections to the pre-Atlantean culture have vanished, - except from the puzzling - obviously FRAGMENTED - legends that still exist.
If we pull Indian, Norse and Mediterranean legends together we may understand that the archaeological evidences - such as the pre-Columbian mining in Michigan - is ONE of many remnants of the same culture that Plato called Atlantis.


IP: 195.159.192.231


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:40:51 am
docyabut
Member
Posts: 3717
From: toledo .ohio
Registered: Mar 2000
  posted 02-05-2005 15:08             
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Boreas, how could a group of homo sapians be living 80,000 years ago in Finland, when 70,000 years ago there were only 5 to 10 thousand people living on the earth from a mass extinction from the Toba eruption.
http://www.roperld.com/HomoSapienEvents.htm
The ensuing cold millennium
which killed almost all Hss (estimate of 10,000 left)
This was right at a minimum temperture of about 7 degrees C below current temperature.
The eruption took the temperature down to about 9 degrees C below current temperature for about 1000 years.


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:41:05 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-06-2005 07:20             
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How can we know - that the changes in temperatures killed everybody except a few thousands - some 70.000 yrs ago?
What we do know is that one and the same population existed in the Susiluola Cave, already 120.000 ago - until some 11.000 years ago.

There are already a number of missing-links to the theories put foward by Mr. Roper. His time-lines are on the rigth side of sense and nonsense, but still far from precise. And his language-chart doesn`t hold water. Pluss, the following news are also quite embarassing - compared with Mr. Ropers time-line on the population of America.
http://www.archaeology.org/online/news/topper.html


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-06-2005).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:41:18 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-08-2005 07:48             
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The Royal Library of Alexandria was once the largest in the world. It is usually assumed to have been founded at the beginning of the 3rd century BC during the reign of Ptolemy II of Egypt after his father had set up the Temple of the Muses or Museum. The initial organization is attributed to Demetrius Phalereus. The Library is estimated to have stored at its peak 400,000 to 700,000 scrolls.
Destruction of the pagan temples
In the late 4th century (AD), persecution of pagans by Christians had reached new levels of intensity. Temples and statues were destroyed throughout the Roman empire, pagan rituals forbidden under punishment of death, and libraries closed. In 391, Emperor Theodosius ordered the destruction of all pagan temples, and the bishop of Alexandria, Theophilus, complied with this request. Socrates Scholasticus provides the following account of the destruction of the temples in Alexandria:

5th century scroll which illustrates the destruction of the Serapeum by Theophilus (source: Christopher Haas: Alexandria in late antiquity, Baltimore 1997)

"Demolition of the Idolatrous Temples at Alexandria, and the Consequent Conflict between the Pagans and Christians."

"At the solicitation of Theophilus bishop of Alexandria the emperor issued an order at this time for the demolition of the heathen temples in that city; commanding also that it should be put in execution under the direction of Theophilus. Seizing this opportunity, Theophilus exerted himself to the utmost to expose the pagan mysteries to contempt. And to begin with, he caused the Mithreum to be cleaned out, and exhibited to public view the tokens of its bloody mysteries. Then he destroyed the Serapeum, and the bloody rights of the Mithreum he publicly caricatured; the Serapeum also he showed full of extravagant superstitions, and he had the phalli of Priapus carried through the midst of the forum. [...] Thus this disturbance having been terminated, the governor of Alexandria, and the commander-in-chief of the troops in Egypt, assisted Theophilus in demolishing the heathen temples. These were therefore razed to the ground, and the images of their gods molten into pots and other convenient utensils for the use of the Alexandrian church; for the emperor had instructed Theophilus to distribute them for the relief of the poor. All the images were accordingly broken to pieces, except one statue of the god before mentioned, which Theophilus preserved and set up in a public place; `Lest,' said he, `at a future time the heathens should deny that they had ever worshiped such gods.'"


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:41:27 am
docyabut
Member
Posts: 3717
From: toledo .ohio
Registered: Mar 2000
  posted 02-08-2005 17:07             
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Boreas, I do agree with you that Topper is a little off base, however we know there was a mass extinction of homo sapians around 70,000 years ago and we don`t really know what cause it,maybe from disease.
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:41:39 am
docyabut
Member
Posts: 3717
From: toledo .ohio
Registered: Mar 2000
  posted 02-08-2005 18:05             
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Actually scientists are saying according to the documentery, the story of eve, that this extinction happen around 150,000 years ago instead of the second migation of 70,000 years ago,so go figure  130,000 years ago, and a new study of the climate.
http://news-info.wustl.edu/tips/page/normal/4502.html
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:42:00 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-09-2005 18:00             
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Arctic-Tropic interactions;
A TIME-LINE

To understand our ethnic and cultural past we may find the "arctic incidence" - called ICE-TIME, as a somewhat clear shed of a time-line. The start of this time-line, a documented date for the "origin of man" is still far from scientifically answered.

But, - the consensus of a "first origin", a genesis, is nothing but a pre-requisite; to be able to understand the general process of the creation of all species.

Our entire background of nature, with our pre-human forefathers in its midst - did not drop in from the blue. At one point they necessarily had to AP-PEAR. As a pair. Of opposite sex.
A logic approach would include that we address this moment of creation as the result of a seminal process...

Most people I discuss with agree that we DID occur - in a creational moment -as a product of an ever-so-long evolution. Most people agree that we still DO NOT have real and valid clues to how far back the human being possibly goes.

Unfortunately there are scientists presenting their carnovarian and bavianian discoveries in around a Rift Valley as "the oldest possible trace" - rather than the "oldest known, so far". Consequently we stop at 1, 6 million as the "oldest substance found" claiming to be The Genuine "proto-human". Now what’s the chance of that, given that we haven’t looked through more than 0.1 % of the mass of bones, hidden underground in Africa alone? And then we have to add ALL discoveries from ALL the other continents, too. No?

Until further clarity arises we have more than work to do; to get clear on the time-lines, chronologies, objects of culture and movements of cultures - leading up to the present situation, - in terms of language, culture and ethnicity.


ZERO-POINT

That’s why I want to re-focus on the end of the large Ice-Time, the Arctic O-point, - because it:

1. Gives us a fair chance to build a quite complete picture of the last 10.000 years of Eurasian existence.

2. Assess and evaluate Mediterranean and South Asian interactions with the Arctic populations.

3. Relate discoveries of Arctic emigrations to the sub-arctic nature south of the Arctic hemisphere, - especially in mountain areas where a sub-arctic/sub-tropic climate gave good conditions for settlements in uninhabited areas.

“TRIBES OF ATLANTIS”

For this reason I see the ongoing discussion on Rivens thread; Tribes of Atlantis, - as very useful. The collective science of culture/language/ethnicity should be enough to clear this picture - and the ongoing research on the newfound texts from Af-ghan-i-stan are already setting new paratives, - in terms of the relations between Greek, Persian, Semitic and Aramaic languages.

Our "arctic angle" already made its day, - when I discovered that words like "man" and "hand" were present, with clear letters, - in a newly found Bactrian text. Written in an ancient, long gone language labelled "Old Persian", more than 3.000 years old.

Even the more of a surprise that even the combined word; "handa-man", existed. Written in a phonetic alphabet – and pronounced as in English; “hand-a-man”. Today’s experts of the ancient Bactrian language translate “handaman” to "limb". The same two-words, - meaning “hand-of-man” (our most important of “limbs”) is found in both Scandinavian, German and English.

This and other distinctive words have clearly showed a connection from the ancient Persians and an old, arctic culture. From the Mesolithic, Neolithic and Bronze age discoveries made in the Northern hemisphere the present updates from Chinese, Russian and European Archaeology all agree that the arctic area was populated by branches of the same culture, - in terms of ethnicity and cultural progressions. Spreading after ice-time, - all along the Northern Hemisphere, - soon populating the continent from Ocean to Ocean.

Given that the Russians, Kassaks and Turkmen still are labelled “Caucasians” we may presume that their closest ancestors also belonged to this classification. 9.000 years ago they started a spread, - from the Baltic - towards Scandinavia, Europe and Asia (Larger Russia). Already 8.000 years ago there were two parallel, still distinctive cultures existing in Eurasia, - at the same parallel as we still find the Major Linguistic Border that still divides Europe, all along the 1st parallel (30 degrees) east of Greenwich. Note that the division starts north of the Botnic Bay, divides The Aland Isles before reaching the river Wizla in Poland that defined the clear line southwards to Hungary and Transylvania.
That became the Fenno-Ugrians, who populated all areas north of the Black Sea, all around the Caspian Sea - and all the way to the Pacific Ocean and the Chinese wall. Norse myths tell that the "In the beginning The Aser created the Vaner, to populate the east. Thus that land is called Vanaheim”. The Finns still call Russia “Vene-je”, while the Baltics are called “Ved-di”. In Norse language the Northern Finns were called “K-Vens”, while Vaner/Vanir as a popular name is still present in Caucasian populations. The As/Aes/Aesir likewise.

To make things short we may recall the well-known "Komsa-culture", - that reached various places of Scandinavia, especially in the high North, already 9.900 years ago. In the last decades archaeologists have unearthed traces from the Kolan Peninsula and the White Sea showing even older habitats, - aging back to 17.000 BP. In the years 1995-97 a Russian-Norwegian expedition uncovered 40.000 years old habitats east of the White Sea, at the Pechora-basin. The clear parallels of buildings, weapons and other items showed clear parallels to the high-artic “Komsa-culture” of Mesolithic Kola, Finland and Norway. The chronological time-line conclusively shows that the first Russians descend from a very ancient tribe, - that already 40.000 years ago were incredibly well adapted to the high Arctic climate and nature.

7.000 BP the complementary cultures had spread all along Eurasia, establishing lines of communication from Ocean to Ocean, - and beyond. To the west we see a stringent parallel to the “Komsa-culture” that develops distinctive differences in style and forms, creating a "complementary tradition". Thus we can identify a western culture, - covering today’s Germany, France, England and Scandinavia.

This "western culture" spread as different cultural “branches”, - but they were all based on the old root of the "Nordic language", - which today is spoken only in Scandinavia. Thus it is important to point to the fact that the same language once was shared by all sons and daughters of the “Scots”, “Picts”, “Herulis”, “Goths”, “Celts”, “Saxon” and other tribes known from Bronze Age Europe. Until the Latin invasion threw the old family-threes, societies and cultures around.

Two years ago we heard of a 6000 years old city found in Dagestan, bearing traces of burned clay-tablets with clear, straigth symbols similar to our versal letters. Recent works on the 3000 years old Bactrian language (found in scrolls from Afghanistan) have revealed a straight, linguistical import from the arctic language. The links between Bactrian, Aryan and Arameic are obvious. The Bactrian also containing expressions of clear, arctic origin.


OCCAMS ERAZOR

Over the last 3500 years we see that warfare spreads to all the great Kingdoms and Cultures of the ancient Asia. Finally it reaches also the old kingdoms of the arctic culture. 1.000 years ago the Greek-Roman culture finally overtook the last of the Arctic kingdoms. As Charlemagne and his successors laid the entire Europe under Rome, the Imperial Church of Istanbul took care of Macedonia, Bulgaria, Balkan, Transylvania, Moldova, Slovakia , Polen, Belo-Rus, Lituania and Russia, - east to the Chinese Wall.

In 987 the Grand Duke of Kiev – on behalf of the entire Russia - subjugated to The Church of Istanbul. Since then the language started to change, - creating a combination of clerical Greek and native Fenno-Ugrian. The result being the "broadband vocabulary" we find in the present "Grylic" - as it is spoken in Eastern Europe and Russia. Thus we have a mixture of Greek and Fenno-Ugrian that became “Slavonic”.


By the Norman defeat in England, 1066, the last stand against a religious rule lost – and the old arctic culture completely cease to profile its existence – as a historical, civil and cultural actor. In the coming 500 years the Eastern and Western Church where the only cultural institutions left. Consequently the old, pagan mythology, language and culture was subjugated, altered and changed. In some cases it was even erased, - like the ancient English, German, Polish, Russian and Turk languages. None of them are still spoken. A similar eradication had fallen on the Bactrians some 2.000 years BP, as it happened to the Norse 1000 BP, and to the Indians some 500 B.P. Thus “Occams Erazor” had reached around the globe,- relflecting the CeZarian dream; Ruling the World.

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:42:21 am
VISIBLE TRACES

Though, we still find old Fenno-speaking tribes in remote areas of northern and eastern Russia. Even at the high Arctic Ocean, we still see Fenno-Russians finding ways and means to keep a satisfactory supply of food and other necessities. Keeping their old life-style, traditions AND the original mother-tongue in tact. In other areas offside the axis Istanbul-Kiev-Moscow we see that the Fenno-Ugrian language managed to survive – even in good shape, - such as in Hungary and Estonia as well as its "homeland" Finland.

A look at the map also explains how the Finnish Bay and the Baltic Ocean becomes a meeting-point of travels east and west. Already our ancient survivors of ice-time, - that appeared in the White ocean, - had to arrive from somewhere. Thus the discovery of the 40-70.000 years old population in SW Finland (1995) was imminent. All the more as the Finnsh/Swedish border is still the same today as it was during Mesolithic, Neolithic, bronze-age and Viking-time. Thus the local population in the Botnic Bay can pride themselves with their ancient border between east and west, the river Tornea ( “Tower-river”) - being “9000 years – and never stamped by soldier-boots”.

The original root-language of the western culture is also preserved by the coastal population of the Finnish Archipelago, along all the coastline of Finland. Thus we see that the bi-lingual coast of Finland have an ancient position as a meeting-point/melting-point between the eastern and western continents. Recent discoveries of genetic, linguistic and etymythologic nature are underlining the central position of the Baltic area, as a key to understand the parallel cultures of the eastern, respectively western Eurasia.

------

The following article from Nature 2001 gives a rock solid base-line for assessing the whereabouts of the “Komsa-culture”, the immediate ancestors to the present Fenno-Scandians – not to say all Caucasians.

********************************************



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:42:34 am
The ice man cameth early
Early mammoth hunters braved the Arctic.

Nature; September 4th, 2001
HELEN PEARSON

Our hardy ancestors survived north of the Arctic Circle as far back as the last ice age, unearthed tools now reveal. The mammoth hunter’s braved sub-zero temperatures on desolate tundra at least 20,000 years earlier than was thought, the remains suggest, although whether the people were Neanderthals or modern humans is a mystery.

The artefacts, dug up in an Arctic riverbed, show that humans once lived as far north as Siberia and Alaska, say archaeologist John Svendsen, of the University of Bergen in Norway, and his team1. The stone tools, horse and reindeer bones and a mammoth tusk with hand-made markings, were found at Mamontovaya Kurya in European Russia.
Radiocarbon dating puts the finds between 35,000 and 40,000 years old. Previously, humans were thought to have colonized this northern region in the last stages of the ice age only some 13,000 years ago.

The 40,000-year date "marks a turning point in the history of human evolution in Europe," says Svendsen's team. Around that time, roaming Neanderthals are thought to have given way to anatomically modern humans migrating northwards out of Africa and into Europe. The new haul does not reveal the identity of the Arctic dwellers to be either Neanderthal or modern.
Either way the result is exciting, says archaeologist John Gowlett of the University of Liverpool, UK. Either Neanderthals travelled further north than was thought, or modern humans moved and adjusted to northern extremes very quickly - within a few thousand years of leaving hotter climes.

Temperatures seem to have fluctuated markedly at that time, pushing populations north or south. Early modern humans may have followed herds of mammoths, wild horses or reindeer northwards during a warmer period, speculates Gowlett. During colder spells, freezing steppes extended as far south as Greece. "Humans had a hold on the north, if only for a short time," he says.

Highs and lows
To survive at these latitudes, humans have to be well adapted, explains anthropologist Chris Stringer of the Natural History Museum in London. Temperatures fall to -40°C and there is 24-hour darkness for part of the year.
"You've got to have clothing, housing and fire," he says. Eating meat and fat would have been important, as there are few plants. Cold-dwelling populations such as the Inuits also have physiological differences that make them more tolerant to the cold.

Whereas modern humans are known for their ability to survive in extreme conditions, Neanderthals were thought to lack such skills. If the remains are Neanderthal, then "they were not a load of numbskulls," says Gowlett.

Our view of the historic landscape in which the hunters lived is also changing. The animal bones add to mounting evidence that this region of the Arctic, although cold, was not ice-bound 35,000 years ago. Instead, it probably consisted of open, grassy steppes.


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-12-2005).]


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:42:56 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-12-2005 09:45             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The World of the 10 Wheels - upside down...
http://www.historiska.se/collections/treasures/brons/kult.html
Further surfing; www.historiska.se/collections/treasures


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-12-2005).
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:45:40 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-12-2005 21:37             
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MYSTERY OF THE FUTHARK
ALPHABET
The Futhark alphabet was used by the North European Germanic peoples (the Swedish, Norwegian and Danish) between the 3rd and 17th centuries A.D. About 3500 stone monuments in Europe, concentrated mostly in Sweden and Norway, are claimed to have been inscribed with this writing.

The purpose of this article is to draw the readers' attention to the fact that this Futhark alphabet, which is also called the Runic (1) stemmed from the very same origin as did the ancient Turkish (2) inscriptions with Gokturk (3) alphabet

The monuments considered to be in the 16-rune futhark group belong to a later period called the Viking Age which started at about AD. 800. During this period, the 24-characters of the Primitive Norse runes became simplified and reduced to 16-rune series.The pages 25-30 and the rest of the book in Jansson's study are allocated to this subject which is beyond the concern of my article.

The Europen scholars have come to recognize from the very beginning the obvious similarity between the character forms of the Primitive Norse stones and those of the C.Asian Gokturk monuments, but for certain various reasons have refrained from tackling this point by denying all kinds of plausible relations. All throughout the period of 160 years that elapsed between the years of 1730 and 1893, that is between the discovery of Orhun monuments and their definitely final decipherment, fanciful theories were fabricated about the Vikings' (or Indo-Germans', or Celts', or Goths') prehistoric emigrations into C.Asia, and the **** of Orhun stones as landmarks of their presence and civilization dating back to several thousands of years BC in that region.

Only when in 1893, it was understood that these inscriptions were not written in any other tongue but pure Turkish, then those fanciful theories were discarded, and the proposed pre-historic datings were revised to be not earlier than AD 700. Even today, a number of academicians are still straining at finding a Sogdian, Persian or Aramaic origin for Turkish inscriptions, but their efforts at proving their claims all end in vain.

A casual comparision of ancient scripts is all needed to see that the characters used in Orhun monuments are more identical with the futhark than any of those alleged originals. Besides this close resemblance, it is an exciting fact that the Primitive Norse runes declared to have ambiguous contexts can be rendered meaningfully when they are exposed to our novel method of read-ing ancient Turkish scripts.

As I have remarked at the beginning of this article, it must be kept in mind that the ancient Turkish script used in Central Asia and the Primitive Norse futhark in Europe, as well as those other scripts mentioned in passing above, have all stemmed from a common origin in a very remote past. Then, the Turkish, Germanic, and other tribes have independently relied on this common legacy of writing for the monuments in their own tongues.
http://www.antalyaonline.net/futhark/FUTHP2E.HTM

See also;

Ancient Celtic alphabeth: http://www.krysstal.com/writing_runic.html

Ancient Hunic alphabeth: http://fang.fa.gau.hu/~heves/runic.html

Ancient Turkmeni alphabeth; www.antalyaonline.net/futhark/FUTHP2E.

Fenno-Ugrian and Basque; http://www.antalyaonline.net/futhark/FUTHA3E.HTM


IP: 195.159.190.150
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:46:02 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-12-2005 22:40             
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YOUNGER EDDA
"Reminiscent of Timaeus, the Younger Edda legend tells of an ancient Swedish king named Gylfe, who journeys to Asgard, where he assumes the name Ganglere (the wanderer). There he beholds a land of temples, golden palaces, and plowed fields populated by a mighty and noble race called the Asas. Just as the Egyptian priests relate to Solon, king of Athens, the tale of Atlantis and of the great flood that befell his ancestors, the Asas tell Ganglere the tale of Ragnarok. Asas comes from Norse word Aas, which means a “ridge of high land”. Hence the Asas, like the Atlanteans, would appear to be a fictitious race that once dwelt high up on the ice sheet’s glistening, paradise of ice."

From "Earth Under Fire" by Paul LaViolette
http://www.goldenageproject.org.uk/316edda.html




 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:46:22 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-20-2005 15:38             
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English study
questions carbon-dating
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/1413326.stm
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:46:46 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-20-2005 22:14             
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ARCTIC PRE-HISTORY;
References to the incredible discovery of the so-called "Wolf-Cave", outside Kristinestad - at the South-West coast of Finland.
http://www.nba.fi/en/nmf_permanentexhibitions
http://www.nba.fi/en/tutkimusprojeng

Numbers of items have shown human activity –on a regular baisis - from 8.700 BP to the inter-glacial called the Eem-period, 120-150.000 years ago. Findings from the deeper layers point towards the Holstein interglacial, which highlighted around 300.000 BP.

Unfortunately there is no larger repport made in english – on the net. Two official publications available;

Schulz, Hans-Peter. The lithic industry from layers IV-V, Susiluola Cave, Western Finland, dated to the Eemian interglacial. Préhistoire Européenne. Volumes 16-17. s. 7–23. Liége 2002.

Schulz, Hans-Peter; Eriksson, Brita; Hirvas, Heikki; Huhta, Pekka; Jungner, Högne; Purhonen, Paula; Ukkonen, Pirkko & Rankama, Tuija. Excavations at Susiluola Cave. Suomen Museo 2002. s. 5–45. Helsinki 2002

Order directly from;
kirjatilaus@nba.fi


[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-20-2005).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:47:00 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-21-2005 08:01             
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The missing link with Neanderthals was a fraud
It appeared to be one of archaeology's most sensational finds. The
skull fragment discovered in a peat bog near Hamburg (Germany) was
more than 36,000 years old - and was the vital missing link between
modern humans and Neanderthals. This, at least, is what Professor
Reiner Protsch von Zieten - a distinguished anthropologist - told his
scientific colleagues, to global acclaim, after being invited to date
the extremely rare skull. However, the professor's 30-year-old
academic career has now ended in disgrace after the revelation that
he systematically falsified the dates on this and numerous other
"stone age" relics.
His university in Frankfurt announced the professor had been
forced to retire because of numerous "falsehoods and manipulations".
According to experts, his deceptions may mean an entire tranche of
the history of man's development will have to be rewritten.
"Anthropology is going to have to completely revise its picture of
modern man between 40,000 and 10,000 years ago," said Thomas
Terberger, the archaeologist who discovered the hoax. "Prof Protsch's
work appeared to prove that anatomically modern humans and
Neanderthals had co-existed, and perhaps even had children together.
This now appears to be rubbish."
The scandal only came to light when Prof Protsch was caught
trying to sell his department's entire chimpanzee skull collection to
the United States. An inquiry later established that he had also
passed off fake fossils as real ones and had plagiarised other
scientists' work. His discovery appeared to show that Neanderthals
had spread much further north than was previously known. But his
university inquiry was told that a crucial Hamburg skull fragment,
which was believed to have come from the world's oldest German, a
Neanderthal known as Hahnhöfersand Man, was actually a mere 7,500
years old, according to Oxford University's radiocarbon dating unit.
The unit established that other skulls had been wrongly dated too.
Another of the professor's sensational finds, "Binshof-Speyer" woman,
lived in 1,300 BCE and not 21,300 years ago, as he had claimed, while
"Paderborn-Sande man" (dated at 27,400 BCE) only died a couple of
hundred years ago, in 1750.
"It's deeply embarrassing. Of course the university feels very
bad about this," Professor Ulrich Brandt, who led the investigation
into Prof Protsch's activities, said yesterday. "Prof Protsch refused
to meet us. But we had 10 sittings with 12 witnesses. German police
also investigated the professor for fraud, following allegations that
he had tried to sell the university's 278 chimpanzee skulls for
$70,000 to a US dealer. The university admitted that it should have
discovered the professor's fabrications far earlier. But it pointed
out that, like all public servants in Germany, the high-profile
anthropologist was virtually impossible to sack, and had also proved
difficult to pin down.

Source: The Guardian (19 February 2005) http://www.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,3604,1418025,00.html

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:47:13 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-22-2005 04:46             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Kant and Schiller both assert that "A myth does not represent debasement, or a sinking down from original perfection, not a victory of sensuality over reason, but on the contrary, it manifests the advancement of a man from a state of comparative rudeness to freedom and civilization."
I am not in accord with these ideas because common reasoning tells me the case should be reversed. Fully ninety-nine percent of the myths are traceable to legends. Legends are history orally handed down. History is a record of facts, so that myths instead of "manifesting advancement" manifest a retrogression; for they show that history, a part of civilization, is being forgotten. Therefore that civilization has declined. [Col. James Churchward, Sacred Symbols Of Mu, p. 24-25]
http://mirrorh.com/timeline.html 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:47:40 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-22-2005 05:11             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
'Single mutation led to language'
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/693744.stm
Darwin revised;
http://www.britac.ac.uk/news/release.asp?NewsID=84

[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-22-2005).]

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:47:55 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 02-22-2005 10:43             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Boreas,
Really apt statement by Churchward there!

I am really excited by the statement by the Oxford Professor Crow. If he knew the underscoring of that idea by the Bock saga, it would give him a lot to chew on!

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:49:01 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-22-2005 13:07              
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HEAVY MILK-ADDICT?
There is always someone making it differently. Some time ago they started squeezing the milk out of cows, - and drink it, - just like babies sipping from mothers breasts...

For some reason this culture become very strong - at least among some societies. So strong that they eventually went through thick and thin to develop a resistence towards the poisoning effect that milk-proteins create when digested, leaving the milk-sugar (lactose) behind - in the digestive process. One may wonder what the motivation could be...

For some unbelivably funny reason they carried on drinking cow-milk. While the rest of the worlds adult population quited during youth - the agricultural societies must have continued, - since the result is part of our present reality; namly populations where the larger majority is used to butter, cheese and rockefort. By the accumulation of persistance did these populations start to develop very specific, intestine enzymes, able to split the milk-sugar - and make it part of normal digestion.

But, - thats like asking for a brand new inner organ! The adaption required to gain this ability must have been very demanding -since it ended up as the most clear and typical European haplogroup. Consequently there is a link between the agriculture and genetic development. The early adaption to an agricultural diet would be linked to the haplogroup with the highest tolerance (persistance) of the lacto-diet. Finally this question are about to be answered. One may just wonder - did the Atlanteans drink milk? Here`s the expertise;

--------------------------------------------

Fresh lessons in the history of milk drinking By
Edward Hollox,
Institute of Genetics, University of Nottingham.

Most people cannot drink milk as adults without the symptoms of lactose intolerance, and most lactose intolerance is due to absence of the lactase enzyme in the gut. This presence/absence is a genetic polymorphism commonly called lactase persistence/nonpersistence, depending on whether or not lactase activity persists from childhood into adulthood.1 In Northern Europe, lactase persistence is common and many people not only drink milk, but culturally it is seen as a healthy and nutritious food. How this happened is now becoming clearer.

Definition
Lactase nonpersistence is the ancestral state, and lactase persistence only became advantageous after the invention of agriculture, when milk from domesticated animals became available for adults to drink. As expected, lactase persistence is strongly correlated with the dairying history of the population. This genetic ability to digest milk has been regarded as a classic example of gene-culture co-evolution, where the culture of dairying creates a strong selective advantage to those who can drink milk as adults, for only they can nutritionally benefit from the milk. A recent paper confirmed this link by analysing the diversity in bovine milk protein genes and showing that the highest gene diversity (and by implication the largest historical population size) is in cows from areas of the world where dairy farming is practised and the people are lactose tolerant.2 In humans, epidemiological analysis has shown that the cultural development of dairying preceded selection for lactase persistence.3 Since dairying is thought to have originated around 10 000 years ago, the selective pressure has been only for the past 400 generations. Despite this short time, there is suggestive evidence of recent positive selection: lactase persistence is associated with one haplotype, which is very common only in northern Europeans, and is distant from the ancestral haplotype.4, 5 Discovery of the possible molecular basis of this polymorphism - a single nucleotide change 14 kb away from the gene, has allowed further analysis of genetic variation associated with lactase persistence/nonpersistence.

Reliability
Proving that the lactase gene has been under recent positive selection in Northern Europe is difficult. As it is a recent regulatory change, codon-based methods that examine the different substitution patterns across a gene are not suitable. Instead, methods relying on allele frequency must be used - which are vulnerable to the fact that frequency patterns produced by selection can also be produced by demographic processes such as changes in population size and genetic drift. A statistic called 'relative extended haplotype homozygosity' (REHH) has been developed, which relies on the fact that a selected haplotype (ie a haplotype on which a relatively recent beneficial mutation has occurred and has risen to high frequency) will have an extended range of linkage disequilibrium (LD) compared with other haplotypes in the population.9 This is because the selected haplotype is young, and hence there has not been enough time for recombination to break it down. We infer that this young haplotype has been driven to a high frequency by positive selection. It is not an ideal method: since it relies on the length of linkage disequilibrium on one haplotype in relation to the frequency of that haplotype, it may be vulnerable to different sampling strategies that could alter the apparent frequency of that haplotype.10 Allele-specific recombination rates could also produce a similar effect. Nevertheless, since it compares variation on different haplotypes across the same region, it is less vulnerable to demographic changes than other population genetic measures.

Positive selection
REHH was used by Joel Hirschhorn's lab to provide further support for positive selection in Northern Europeans.8 It confirms that the haplotype carrying lactase persistence is almost identical for nearly 1 Mb, is therefore young and must have been positively selected to reach the observed frequency of 77% in Northern Europeans. Analysis of markers across this region showed very high genetic differentiation between European Americans (dairying) and Asian/African American (nondairying), suggesting that these markers had hitchhiked on the haplotype carrying lactase persistence. By considering the Asian Americans and African Americans to have a diversity representative of a pre-dairying 'European' population, a selection coefficient of 1.4-15% was calculated - consistent with the 5% previously predicted using a gene-culture co-evolutionary model.11 Did early farmers, who practised mixed farming, really rely on milk so much? There is now genetic evidence that they did, although it is still not clear why milk was so important (for discussion, see Hollox and Swallow12).

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:49:36 am
Two different mutations
Most studies for practical reasons have focused on lactase persistence in Europe, but lactase persistence is also common in certain tribes in Africa that have a history of dairying. Is lactase persistence in these people caused by the same mutation - as would seem likely - and has it been under positive selection as well? The first part of this question has been answered by Mulcare et al.13 Their paper shows that the putative causative allele 14 kb upstream from the lactase gene is not at frequencies high enough for it to be the causative allele in Africa, even when the inherent errors in lactose tolerance testing are taken into account. There could be two reasons for this - either the allele is not causative at all and is merely strongly associated with the causative allele, or in Africans lactase persistence is due to another mutation. The first reason is possible, especially given the high LD across the region - many polymorphisms within this region will be strongly associated with lactase persistence just by virtue of being on the same huge haplotype. But functional studies from two groups show that the putative causative allele is a gain-of-function mutation increasing the expression driven from the lactase promoter in reporter gene assays in a human intestinal cell line.14, 15 So what about the second reason - a different causative mutation in Africans? Intuitively, this seems unlikely, but given the powerful selective advantage of being lactase persistent any mutation is very unlikely to be lost by genetic drift. It is possible that another mutation in the same regulatory element, a different element, or even in a trans-acting transcription factor may be responsible for lactase persistence in Africans. The answer will only be found by further genetic analysis of this locus in Africans.

Mendelian composits
As well as examining the role of this polymorphism in human evolution, this work provides an interesting case study for those concerned with finding alleles that confer susceptibility to common disease. In this case, we have a clear clinical phenotype (lactose tolerance) with a very strong well-defined Mendelian genetic component (lactase persistence/nonpersistence polymorphism), and a well-defined 'candidate' gene (LCT, lactase). Despite these factors, the causative polymorphism has proved difficult to discover, and the most likely causative polymorphism is located 14 kb away in an L2 repeat within an intron of another gene. Added to this, if this polymorphism is causative, then it is not the causative polymorphism in all populations. If there is a lesson to be learned from this, it is that the genetics of complex disease are likely to be very complex indeed.


European Journal of Human Genetics (2005) 13, 267-269. doi:10.1038/sj.ejhg.5201297 Published online 15 December 2004.
E-mail: ed.hollox@nottingham.ac.uk

--------------------------------------------



Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:49:46 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 02-22-2005 20:06             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Very interesting Boreas,
One more clear piece of evidence.

I am curious about the genetic history of the African Masai tribe, who's main nutrition (I believe) is from a combination of milk mixed with blood, which is tapped from the neck-vein of the cows.

 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:49:57 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-24-2005 06:18             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Using the cows blood as a catalyst to easen the digestion of the milk. Honey added...
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:50:14 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-25-2005 03:48             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Ata,
I had the pleasure of reading the link you gave us some time ago;
-----------------------------------------
Quote atalante
posted 01-28-2004 09:21
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is a link which claims that most of the Indo-European peoples (including the Vedic people of India) originated near Finland, during 5000-2000 BC when Finland's climate was warmer than the present by 4 degrees Centigrade. http://www.dipmat.unipg.it/~bartocci/ep6/ep6-vinci2.htm
---------------------------------------
I just tried to repeat it - but couldnt get it to open. Nor did I get through on the main site. What to do?
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:50:30 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 02-28-2005 06:13             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Underwater arrowheads, tools dazzle Maritime historians
22 Feb 2005 12:25:15 EST
CBC News

HALIFAX - Archaeologists are showing off a treasure trove they call one of the most significant discoveries of Mi'kmaq artifacts in Nova Scotia.
Hundreds of arrowheads and tools, some 8,000 years old, were discovered last summer along the Mersey River, near Kejimkujik National Park in the southwest region of the province.

Workers from Nova Scotia Power were doing repairs to generating stations on the river. As water levels dropped in some areas, the riverbed was exposed for the first time since dams were built 70 years ago.
Suddenly hundreds of artifacts appeared in the mud. "The quantity of material, the quality of material, the age range represented by the material, all is just fascinating for us," said archaeologist Bruce Stewart, who was hired to investigate.

Pottery fragments, spear points, knives and other items were found around 109 ancient campsites. One barbed harpoon was once used to spear salmon and eels 3,000 years ago, Stewart said. Since the artifacts were lying on the surface, the RCMP was brought in to control looting. Even the discovery was kept a secret.

"I think this is vitally important," Mi'kmaq historian Daniel Paul said of the find.
"There was a real functioning civilization here when the Europeans began to come here en masse, but the proof has been virtually destroyed. And all of a sudden we are finding the proof."


The Mersey River encampments are once again under water. The artifacts will be sent to the Nova Scotia Museum once Stewart and his team finishes sorting them.
http://www.cbc.ca/story/science/national/2005/02/17/artifacts050217.html


 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:50:43 am
Boreas
Member
Posts: 433
From: Namsos, Norway
Registered: Jan 2004
  posted 03-07-2005 19:31             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
South Carolina fire pit dated to be 50,000-year-old
In the growing debate about when people first
appeared on the North American continent, a
leading archaeologist said he has discovered
what could be sooty evidence of human occupation
in North America tens of thousands of years
earlier than is commonly believed.
University of South Carolina archaeologist
Al Goodyear said he has uncovered a layer of
charcoal from a possible hearth or fire pit at a
site near the Savannah River (see also Archaeo
News 3 July 2004). Samples from the layer have
been laboratory-dated to more than 50,000 years
old. Yet Goodyear stopped short of declaring it
proof of the continent's earliest human
occupation. "It does look like a hearth," he
said, "and the material that was dated has been
burned." Since the 1960s, anthropologists
have generally accepted that hunters migrated to
North America about 13,000 years ago over a land
bridge into Alaska following the retreat of Ice
Age glaciers.But other sites, including the
Topper dig in South Carolina, have yielded rough
stone tools and other artifacts suggesting that
humans lived in North America thousands of years
earlier when the climate was much colder. While
there is no ironclad proof that an older culture
existed, scientists are increasingly open to the
idea that humans arrived from many other
directions besides the northwest, perhaps even
sailing across oceans. But a 50,000-year-old fire
pit would scorch the prevailing occupation
theory. Goodyear's evidence was examined by
other scientists, who performed radiocarbon tests
on samples to determine their age. Thomas
Stafford, director of Stafford Laboratories in
Boulder, Colo., took samples of the substance for
tests at the University of California at Irvine.
The results showed that wood varieties had been
burned in a low-temperature fire at least 50,300
years ago, he said. Stafford said the layer could
have been the result of a fire tended by humans,
or the ashes could have been deposited by wind,
rain or flooding. Other researchers were
more skeptical of Goodyear's discovery, noting
that previous claims of very old occupation at
other sites never have been verified. "We still
need to be cautious," said Vanderbilt University
anthropologist Tom Dillehay. "I would not yet
rewrite the books. The find is very significant
and shows that there is much we don't understand
and can't easily reject or accept." Other
scientists were blunter. "I think it's a
50,000-year-old geologic deposit," said
University of Texas archaeologist Mike Collins.
"It has almost nothing to do with the story of
the peopling of North America."

Sources: Associated Press, CNN, News-Leader.com,
Yahoo! News (18 November 2004) http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=514&e=13&u=/ap/20041118/ap_on_sc/early_americans_5
http://www.cnn.com/2004/TECH/science/11/17/carolina.dig/index.html http://www.news-leader.com/today/1118-Discoveryp-229184.html


Bronze Age sites in co Wicklow are now protected

The Irish Minister for the Environment has signed
a preservation order to protect two Bronze Age
sites in Co Wicklow. The move is being seen as
showing fresh Government commitment to the
safeguarding of archaeological monuments
throughout the country.
The protection orders were signed following
reports that a prehistoric settlement near
Blessington had been damaged. The Bronze Age
sites include a stone circle and a number of
burial mounds.

Source: Irish Examiner (17 November 2004) http://www.breakingnews.ie/printer.asp?j=102235440&p=yxzz36xzx
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 03:51:06 am
rockessence
Member
Posts: 1000
From: WA USA
Registered: Feb 2004
  posted 03-13-2005 09:39             
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is an article that supports the idea (asserted in the Bock saga) that domestication of animals was carried out from the Aser by envoys at the end of Ice-time around 9000 years ago.

Pigs domesticated 'many times'

Pigs were domesticated independently at least seven times around the
globe, a new study has found. The discovery was made by linking the
DNA of tame porkers with their wild relatives. Researchers found
farmed pigs in several locations were closely related to wild boar in
the same region, suggesting local domestication. This challenges the
notion that boar were tamed just twice before being transported
throughout the world.
"Many archaeologists have assumed the pig was domesticated in
no more than two areas of the world, the Near East and the Far East,
but our findings turn this theory on its head," said Keith Dobney, of
the University of Durham, UK. "Our study shows that domestication
also occurred independently in Central Europe, Italy, Northern India,
South East Asia and maybe even Island South East Asia."
Archaeological evidence suggests the pig was first domesticated
9,000 years ago in Eastern Turkey. They were also domesticated in
China at around the same time. Until now, archaeologists generally
assumed that after their initial domestication in these two
locations, tame pigs were transported - through trade and human
migration - around the world. In many ways, this is the simplest
explanation: as farming methods spread during the Neolithic, new
innovations and domestic animals were thought to have been passed
through the human population. But it seems the truth is a little more
far fetched. Instead of importing tame pigs, people from several
different countries domesticated the animals themselves.
"There is definitely something a bit weird about it," said
co-author Greger Larson, of Oxford University, UK. "Maybe people
really didn't bring pigs with them during the agricultural sweep as
part of the Neolithic. "Maybe instead of bringing pigs with them they
were domesticating wild boar only."
However, because the researchers have not been able to date the
recently discovered centres of domestication, it is unclear whether
the idea of taming pigs was had independently, or whether it was
transferred between communities. The team found that all domestic
pigs in Europe are descended from European wild boar - and not Near
Eastern boar - which means farmers travelling west from Turkey were
not bringing significant numbers of pigs with them. But that does not
mean they did not bring the good idea of pig domestication with them.
Nonetheless, it raises questions about the process of animal
domestication, and the spread of agricultural ideas.
"Domestication probably isn't just one guy having an ingenious
idea and looking at a wild boar and saying, 'I can get a domestic pig
out of that'," Dr Larson said. "It could be that domestication is
almost a natural consequence of people settling down to farm. "These
findings are forcing the question about the origins of domestication
across all animals."

Source: Science, BBC News (11 March 2005) http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4337435.stm
 


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Janna Britton on November 16, 2008, 04:06:03 am
End of original material.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: BlueHue on May 15, 2009, 10:52:33 am
I just peeked in to say that During the highlight of Atlantis the REST of EUROPE
 probably was in the late neo-lithic Era of the Younger DRYAS.

tHUS WHEN THE eGYPTIANS enjoyed their 18-th Dynasty
 Greece -mainland was still in the Magdalian Epoch
 when rthe egyptian king CECROPS established the first greek invaders kingdom there

I try to say that any written Myth like the Irish Formoirs and Thuata de Danann,
is likely to have come from Egyptian invaders and proto Greek vassal nations,
As a heritage folklore and may actually not have played in Europe at all but in Egypt
Thus Atlantis in America and CAYCE " Yuccatan-readings are a perpetrated HOAX"

So the ERIDANUS RIVER in the Baltic and Heracles in the Baltic Era
must have originated from Egypt and later adapted to the new country of settlement.

That the ATLANTIS  SAGA itself is misunderstood and misinterpreted
I tried to prove by my Blue's:3 THUMBnail Rules to" Better be able to Locate the original Atlantis "

We all cherish falsh traditions an becopme cross when some-one like me tell them that they are falsh.
I think however that my discovery of Atlantis in Aden speaks for itself !
Practically no Forum member has yet challenged my Three Rules of Thumb.


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Bianca on May 15, 2009, 11:28:36 am





QUOTE



"........Atlantis in America and CAYCE " Yuccatan-readings are a perpetrated HOAX"



                                                          The HOAX is YOU


BLUEHUE/ASINO!!!!


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Boreas on February 28, 2011, 10:18:03 pm
Anthropologists Trace Human Origins Back To One Large Goat
 
8)

http://www.theonion.com/articles/anthropologists-trace-human-origins-back-to-one-la,19191/


Title: Re: Herein lie the "Lost" Boreas Files by Rockessence
Post by: Boreasis on May 13, 2019, 02:55:44 am
"The Sacred Marriage" explaining The Origin of Man - at the time of Pompeii, when the old, Hellenic culture still existed on the northern shores of the western Med - before the arrival of the hyper-natural pseudo-philosophy of the tyrants able to overthrow the old, indigenous Kingdoms - once responsible for the evolution of the western Meds, from early stone-age to the fall of the Roman kingdom and the consequent republic.

https://holeinthedonut.com/2014/06/24/erotic-art-of-pompeii-herculaneum-italy/

On the islands of Northern Europe the Schools of Knowledge known from Europes pre-religious Antiquity would survive for another millennia, though - until the Holy Roman Empire were able to conquer all of Europe and erase the last traces of the old culture. (Note: Only scrupless, criminal usurpers - acting as reptilians rather than mammals - would conquer old, legal Kingoms with brute and violent force. To fullfill some wet dream of 'building an Empire' to satisfy the greed of some corrupted and scrupless noblemen from some ancient civilization, later known as "The Black Nobility".

Secretly ruling the Roman Empire, as well as the Holy Roman Empire, their accumulated wealth - still intact - is beyond comparision in todays world. They still owe some minimum of 700.000 metric tons of gold, about 3,5 times more than all the gold that's supposed to exist according to public sources. 

Thus they are used to a history "proving" that humankind is of a violent nature - eventhough he's the most intelligent, empatic and communicative of all mammals and primates - whereof NONE share the self-destructive behaviour of the "reptilian humans" able to commit murder and mass-slaugther of their own specie.  The practice of the new-babylonic tyrrants conquering Asia Minor, Egypt and Magreb, Anatolia and the Greek islands were spoiled humans, turning into scrupless criminals to force their brutal rule on whoever they could overcome. In an endless row of raids and campaigns to plunder, loot and enslave the entire world.

Luckily we're living 500 years after the reign of the Holy Roman feudal-system enslaved all of Europe by merecantile monopolies and philosophical dogma. Since the days of Reformation, Enlightenment, Free Science and Free Speech there's been numerous great discoveries from the old, pre-Roman/pre-Religious cultures of Eurasia.

As some hidden stories were revealed from the Norse traditions known throughout Fenno-Scandia the writings of Plato and other scribes from Roman, Greek, Egyptian, Sumerian and Vedic antiquity. Thus we may speak of a common Indo-European culture, following the Indo-European three of languages. Following the descendants of the Cro-Magnon-man of Ice-Age Europe - thorughout the "Temperate Climate-zone" from Iberia and Ireland across arctic Eurasia to Siberia and Tarim, as well as India and Nepal - we find the "Caucasian peoples" evolving into various branches. During the pioneering millennia following the Younger Dryas (11.900 yrs ago) the small group of surviving Caucasians would produce 'royal representatives' that would travel to and mix with the tropical survivors of the last ice-age, found at the coasts of N Africa as well as India, Indo-China and China.

Producing various, patri-linear Kingdoms of mixed descendants - one part arctrical, the other tropical - as the arctical and tropical survivors of Ice-Age, also called "The All-Land-Ice Period", would meet again after eons in isolation from each other. Among these "Atlanteans" - aka 'arians' and 'caucasians' - the legend of out common, human origin have indeed survived. The "missing link" in Darwins theory of evolution was not due to an disability to recognize the nanny-goat as a POSSIBLE candidate. The reason Darwin stuck to the "Ape" only was the heavy stigmatization that the new masters of imperial Rome cursed on anything old and legal, according to ANY old culture with old and wideheld traditions of law and order. Among everything stigmatized the olde idol of the Nanny-Goat as well as the Goat-Buck have been rigorously and most brutally surpressed.

It seems, though, that Erasmus Darwin - Charles grandpa - already knew the old legend of the A-pa and the Nanny-Goat to be the origin of the first bi-pedal, speaking and laughing kids, ready to grow and to become healthy, strong and intelligent creatures - once called "Aser", from whom "All Men" were 'made' or "perfected". Among the Arian christians of N Europ - the legend of the Nanny-Goat and the Monkey were still seem known and reffered to. Here serving as an illustration to the theme: "A Perfect God - A Perfect Mankind".

https://britishlibrary.typepad.co.uk/digitisedmanuscripts/2014/09/apes-pulling-shapes.html